Regarding testing of leads and appliances,  there is no legal requirement for that to be done unless they are used for a business.  However any caravan park owner can make it a condition of entry as part of their OH&S requirements

Pete

Middo wrote:

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Regarding testing of leads and appliances,  there is no legal requirement for that to be done unless they are used for a business.  However any caravan park owner can make it a condition of entry as part of their OH&S requirements

Pete

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 100% for that one Middo, however it's not such a bad idea if your appliances are getting a bit long in the tooth especially small motors etc as you well know. 

As far as CPs go, some insist and some couldn't care less. I've found the council owned parks the worse, my run in with the manager Over the testing of my main feed was a council park. 

Rock and a hard place mate. 

oldtrack123 wrote:

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Aus-Kiwi wrote:

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[1] admittedly in van there's not too many other earths..

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[2 As I said it doesn't have to the earth wire .. we test with temp earth on domestic as its a known earth ..

refereing to

[3] earth trip is the old earth leakage circuit breaker type..

[4]power in the annex for example ..

 

 

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 Hi

 

As I said You may be surprised at how many" earths" are in the average Van ,camper ,motor home.

Sadly many are not aware that the following are more than likely to be "EARTHS"

[1]the whole chassis & any metallic objects attached to it  that usually includes metal doors & windows  & their frames ,If metal clad the skin

[2]the gas pipe lines & any gas appliance[gas stove]

[3]All class 1 appliances, fridge, aircon ,micro wave , toaster,electric jug /kettle ,etc

[4]Possiibly the stainless steel wash up sink & taps   

The true situation would be that almost anywhere you stand EARTHS are within reach!!]

EVEN if the extension lead is not plugged, but a generator or inverter is plugged into the power inlet socket

The old ELCBs[1960s]  as used in the general electrical area,  worked on exactly the same principle as today's RCDs

They detect an out of balance in current between ACTIVE & neutral 

The only way that can occur is by a leakage to" earth" in an" 'earthed" neutral system.

or the very remote chance, that one or the other legs within the ELCB /RCD is bypassed

Perhaps you are referiing to the EARTH leakage detectors used by supply authorities  that warned of line leakages???

PeterQ

Just had a handfull of popcorn

 

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Thursday 2nd of April 2015 02:50:15 PM

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 Not surprised at all .. Wow metals conduct ... 

Phil C wrote:

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Ontos45 wrote:

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Snippet: Please remember that if you grab hold of a live wire you will not be able to let go. This will KILL you!

Depends on what side of neutral the sine wave is, one side it will grab you the other it will throw you away. Found out the hard way when an apprentice, was adjusting a slide on a Logabax mechanical computer and ended up across the room with a smoking melted screwdriver in my hand when driver slipped.

All electricity will kill, even DC, like the electric chair which is DC powered.

Currents with about 50mA through the chest region are considered deadly! Voltage higher than 35Volts overcomes the skins electrical resistance.

(Have my own coloured popcorn snacks thanks  )

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 Hi Ontos, to qualify you post. (not sure what a logabax is though)

The time it takes for one cycle at 50 Hz is 20mS, trust me you cant let go (been there done that) it feels like 10 million very large angry  ants crawling up your arm, I was lucky I fell backwards and the wire was ripped out of my fingers, thanks goodness for sir Isaac.

I was fiddling with an old B&W TV when I was 13, my Dad told me not to touch the trippler (which creates the very high DC voltage for the tube) I did and ended up with my bottom making a dent in the roller door of our shed. That was very large DC.

You are correct about 50mA, anything above that will start to "cook" vital organs, the frequency plus current will fibrillate the heart and give you a very bad day.

PS I like coloured popcorn too.

Cheers

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 About 17KV from memory for the old B&W tellies. The big screen colour tellies could put out about 25KV or better.. A rough way to check the output was to see how long a spark you could draw out using a screwdriver grounded to the chassis. About 30KV per cm in dry air from memory. Luckily there is very little current with that voltage though, so not to much damage from the actual touching the EHT lead, it's the damage you do when you bang yourself about from the fright of it. Microwave ovens are bad though.. only about 5KV from memory on the Klystron, but enough current to take the tip off your best screwdriver if you accidentally touch it to the EHT. Worst i did was almost broke my leg when I fell off a stand while adjusting the klystron on the old Mirage radar, on the end of the strip during an exersize. We had some Malay pilots landing about 50M from where we stood and it made me a tad nervous and I accidentally touched the wrong bit.

aussie_paul wrote:

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I guess I will get shot down.  I grew up on a farm with a father that was very mechanical and did as much as he was capable of. He instilled in me to assume everything is dangerous and to think before conducting any job. I developed Diabetes at the age of 20 and farming, was a flat out one day and less so another. Back then Diabetes control was much more difficult compared to today. After Eril and I married we spent several years on the farm which also including losing our first baby at 3 weeks.

Eril and I decided that continuing with a farming lifestyle with my Diabetes was going to be difficult and I liked the mechanical and not the stock side of farming which included contract gravel carting from our Mount Emu.

So, Eril and I bought a run down Motel in Ballarat in 1976. I did quite a few minor things electrical, plumbing, and anything else that was required. We built some new units and of course there was an electrical inspection required. We had a retired man we used for odd jobs and looking after the business while we went on the odd holiday. This guy had a son who, with a partner, ran an electrical business. I thought I had better get them to tidy up any stuff that I had done. The business partner berated me sternly about some of the stuff that I had done!!!! Anyway all was good after the necessary work was performed and the new motel units were connected.

A couple of years later the guy that berated me was killed in a roof when he had his bare knees on a cold water pipe and he drilled through a live wire!!! So sad..

Aussie Paul. 

 

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 No gunfire from me Paul, just a sad story of how easy it is to get into strife with electricity or for that matter, anything. That can bite you.

when I was teaching we would get a mate from the office of the technical regulator to come around and show the apprentices what happens when we don't respect electricity, there were quite a few deaths in roof spaces, I hated crawling through them  and wing tanks at the best of times

I hope you are better mate.

philC

Just a bit of brush up Phil, a Klystron is a low power Microwave local oscillator in a Radar. Havent seen one since the 60s, heres one out of an old Decca radar.

Phil C wrote:

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Wow, that brings back memories troopy, the old mirage. Never got to work on them but we were trained with their generator system and did a little on the cyrano.

15KV will most certainly bounce you on your butt, I got booted by 240 on a P3B on a test flight taking voltage readings in the main load centre, knocked me out and the test flight was aborted, spent a few days in the base hospital for a very large bump on the head and 10 stitches on my noggin, oh also hooked up to a heart monitor.

In those days there was very little concern for OHS. I saw a YouTube on some sumpies doing an engine change and fuel tank clean on a herc they had hard hats, breathing apparatus etc, good lord that was unheard of when I was in.

Take care mate, good to hear from you.

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Yeh familiarity with the job is also a hazard. I ran about 18 Deutz - 10 and 25 and 1 X 55kVa gen sets at Pt Cook in the early 70's as the Vic power supply was so unreliable. 2 ran all the time while flying was on and the others as required. I was the blackhander and Smelly B was the elec fitter.

On a cold Pt Cook mornings everyone was rugged up and in a hurry to get back inside and warm up so often shortcuts were taken. One shortcut was to change 2 gensets connected together with one running so the 3 phase plug was "hot" on the standby genset.

Well Smelly came in one day very haggard,,, he was put on his arse as he tried a hot change over to connect a 3rd genset and so I could take the standby away for service. He was very very quiet and later stated he was sent back over 10m, with some minor burns,, but he wouldn't got to medical because of the ramifications.

Another lucky escape eh Phil.

Need one of these ..National  licence to perform high risk work .. Lol

DeBe wrote:

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This is a Magnetron in a Microwave oven.

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 Thanks DeBe, yep.. I said Klystron but meant Magnetron.. in the MWO

Magnetron in a transmitter, Klystron in a receiver...

Like this one Peter?