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Post Info TOPIC: Lithium


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Lithium


Question for those that know I have a Redarc manager30 battery system currently connected to a lead crystal battery No issues but I want to change to lithium for obvious reasons but my system does not have the lithium profile Apparently Redarc updated this system in 2020 and mine was Installed before that . I contacted Redarc still waiting for a reply !! What do I need to do that will allow me to install lithium ??

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Sort out weight problems with Dealer before you modify vehicle they may solve your problems.

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Possum; AKA:- Ali El-Aziz Mohamed Gundawiathan

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Hi possum will just take less water 1 jerry can and 30litres in tank will save 140 kg ! 

Ive been driving around for 6 years overloaded with no issues 

My own fault should have had it weighed !!!!!   

 

For those more remote trips when a bit more water needed depending on how long the stay is 

When i can afford it i will get lithium and upgrade my Redarc BMS   save heaps in weight there 

No regrets getting rid of the caravan this thing so much easier and dont need gas bottles 

Thanks for advice



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goldenyears wrote:

My own fault should have had it weighed !!!!!   

___________________________________________________________________

Sadly you are far from alone in discovering this after you had purchased. Personally I feel that manufacturers who make/sell vehicles or vans with unusable & impractical load carrying capacity should be subject to 'unfit for purpose' laws & that this should be easy for those they sell to to access. 

It's a far from common situation & relies upon consumers assuming that the manufacturers will 'do the right thing'. 

Certainly a broader awareness of this issue among consumers would help but when purchasing a new vehicle/van the law should be very clear about placing the responsibility on the manufacturer. 

This has been a problem for at least the last 25 years that I've had anything to do with the RV scene, probably longer & it's hard to understand why it is still allowed to continue. 

The type of vehicle you have, which suit many folk, are particularly vulnerable to this problem. 

 

 



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Cuppa wrote:

you are far from alone in discovering this after you had purchased. Personally I feel that manufacturers who make/sell vehicles or vans with unusable & impractical load carrying capacity should be subject to 'unfit for purpose' laws & that this should be easy for those they sell to to access. 

It's a far from common situation & relies upon consumers assuming that the manufacturers will 'do the right thing'. 

Certainly a broader awareness of this issue among consumers would help but when purchasing a new vehicle/van the law should be very clear about placing the responsibility on the manufacturer. 

This has been a problem for at least the last 25 years that I've had anything to do with the RV scene, probably longer & it's hard to understand why it is still allowed to continue. 

The type of vehicle you have, which suit many folk, are particularly vulnerable to this problem. 

 


 The Australian Consumer Law Certainly Does place the responsibility on the Dealer. It emphatically states if a good is not fit for purpose it; MUST BE REPLACED OR FULL REFUND GIVEN.

Dealers will lie and attempt to squirm out of this and attempt to pass onus of responsibility onto individual suppliers of componentry, which is illegal.

 



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Possum; AKA:- Ali El-Aziz Mohamed Gundawiathan

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goldenyears wrote:

Question for those that know I have a Redarc manager30 battery system currently connected to a lead crystal battery No issues but I want to change to lithium for obvious reasons but my system does not have the lithium profile Apparently Redarc updated this system in 2020 and mine was Installed before that . I contacted Redarc still waiting for a reply !! What do I need to do that will allow me to install lithium ??


 Did someone tell you that or have you gone through your manual and checked?  Have you also gone into the settings so see if there is in fact a setting for lithium.  I have a Redarc Manager 30 and and a quick internet search indicates that the Lithium profile has been out since 2015.

Tim



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Tim the manager 30 was upgraded to a lithium profile in 2020 

mine was bought before that  2017               No lithium profile in settings sorry your info wrong 

After speaking to redarc i found out i"m able to trade in the old system to upgraded modelApril 2020 Redarc Electronics released the next-generation Manager30, along with a variant of the Manager30 with RedVision display. This provided connectivity of the Manager30 to the RedVision Smartphone app, allowing real-time monitoring of the battery state of charge.

 



-- Edited by goldenyears on Monday 24th of July 2023 08:18:57 AM



-- Edited by goldenyears on Monday 24th of July 2023 08:34:15 AM

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If my information is wrong then so must Redarcs be. confuse

https://www.google.com.au/search?q=redarc+manager+30+upgrade+to+lithium&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-au&client=safari#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:a82cd6fa,vid:J2E2t34mTDI



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Tim i'm not sure why you sent a link to the redarc site ?

Yes the manager 30 does have a lithium profile        BUT the upgrade didnt happen until 2020 !



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If you care to look at the date of the Redarc YouTube site I posted the Manager 30 with lithium profile has been out since 2015. If you believe Im wrong and it was 2020 then so be it.  There was probably plenty of old stock hanging around though wink



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Thanks for your input tim today is spoke with the redarc office again regards a rebate on my old system and decided that as everything is working fine and to be honest i cant be bothered taking it  all out !! 

Lithium is a %100 better in all ways just a shame mine doesn"t  support it ! The new ones about $1500 and of course the battery on top of that so when i'm able perhaps .

 

 



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goldenyears wrote:

Tim the manager 30 was upgraded to a lithium profile in 2020 

mine was bought before that  2017               No lithium profile in settings sorry your info wrong 

After speaking to redarc i found out i"m able to trade in the old system to upgraded modelApril 2020 Redarc Electronics released the next-generation Manager30, along with a variant of the Manager30 with RedVision display. This provided connectivity of the Manager30 to the RedVision Smartphone app, allowing real-time monitoring of the battery state of charge.

 



-- Edited by goldenyears on Monday 24th of July 2023 08:18:57 AM



-- Edited by goldenyears on Monday 24th of July 2023 08:34:15 AM


 

You may find that most Lithium Batteries (check manufacturer specs) can be connected to any battery (14.8V) charger (AGM, Calcium etc.) as long as the Absorption Cycle is turned off. The Lithium battery BMS will control the maximum charge applicable to the battery and float the battery at 13.6V (100% capacity) or less.

 



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"Home is where the Den is parked, Designer Orchid Special towed by Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited"

"4x250W solar panels, Epever 80A charger and 3x135Ah Voltax Prismatic LiFePO4 Batteries".



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Dick0 wrote:
goldenyears wrote:

Tim the manager 30 was upgraded to a lithium profile in 2020 

mine was bought before that  2017               No lithium profile in settings sorry your info wrong 

After speaking to redarc i found out i"m able to trade in the old system to upgraded modeln April 2020 Redarc Electronics released the next-generation Manager30, along with a variant of the Manager30 with RedVision display. This provided connectivity of the Manager30 to the RedVision Smartphone app, allowing real-time monitoring of the battery state of charge.


 You may find that most Lithium Batteries (check manufacturer specs) can be connected to any battery (14.8V) charger (AGM, Calcium etc.) as long as the Absorption Cycle is turned off. The Lithium battery BMS will control the maximum charge applicable to the battery and float the battery at 13.6V (100% capacity) or less.


 Hi Dicko. Please note that my knowledge of Lithium is virtually nil, but I did notice the highlighted words in this post.

The 540ah Lithium I have in my van regularly are up to 13.84 V before midday, solely from sunlight, but the 180ah in the car often reach 14.4 volt when I'm driving. 
Just wondering if all seems OK with my setup? Cheers



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v



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Yes all is ok.  What you are seeing is the terminal voltage whilst charging. When rested they will settle at about 13.4V.

Tim



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TimTim wrote:

Yes all is ok.  What you are seeing is the terminal voltage whilst charging. When rested they will settle at about 13.4V.

Tim


 Thanks Tim.Cheers



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My Apologys Tim you are absolutely correct about lithium being introduced in 2015 MY INFO was WRONG !! found out i have an issue with my display screen ! 

just goes to show you cant beleive all info on the net .

Very relieved to find out that its lithium ready smile

Now i can get rid of that 45kg lead crystal battery !!! 

 

 



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yobarr wrote:
TimTim wrote:

Yes all is ok.  What you are seeing is the terminal voltage whilst charging. When rested they will settle at about 13.4V.

Tim


 Thanks Tim.Cheers


Hi Yobarr,

The Battery BMS will control Overcharging and Undercharging. If you look up the specs of the battery you should see that the charge can be up to 14.8v and depending upon the BMS it will float at 13.6V or lower. The advantage of having a programmable charger is that you can control the float level of the battery(s), normally about 13.4V (less that 100% charge) which lengthens the life of the battery(s). The aim is to charge and float LiFePo4 at about 90-95% capacity (or less). The beauty of Lithium batteries is that you can control the charge from 90% to 10% which is far more efficient than AGM batteries that should not be depleted below 50% capacity. Basically, look at the Lithium battery as if it were a mobile phone battery... run it down and re-charge with no effect on the battery life. Do it with AGM and the flooded battery will suffer in the long run with a shorter life span.

 

 



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Cheers, Richard (Dick0)

"Home is where the Den is parked, Designer Orchid Special towed by Jeep Grand Cherokee Limited"

"4x250W solar panels, Epever 80A charger and 3x135Ah Voltax Prismatic LiFePO4 Batteries".



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Dick0 wrote:
yobarr wrote:
TimTim wrote:

Yes all is ok.  What you are seeing is the terminal voltage whilst charging. When rested they will settle at about 13.4V.

Tim


 Thanks Tim.Cheers


Hi Yobarr,

The Battery BMS will control Overcharging and Undercharging. If you look up the specs of the battery you should see that the charge can be up to 14.8v and depending upon the BMS it will float at 13.6V or lower. The advantage of having a programmable charger is that you can control the float level of the battery(s), normally about 13.4V (less that 100% charge) which lengthens the life of the battery(s). The aim is to charge and float LiFePo4 at about 90-95% capacity (or less). The beauty of Lithium batteries is that you can control the charge from 90% to 10% which is far more efficient than AGM batteries that should not be depleted below 50% capacity. Basically, look at the Lithium battery as if it were a mobile phone battery... run it down and re-charge with no effect on the battery life. Do it with AGM and the flooded battery will suffer in the long run with a shorter life span.


 Thanks Dicko. My batteries rarely drop below 80% but reach 100% early in the day. In the next few days I will take more notice of voltage at certain times, and compare the voltage with the indicated level of charge. Cheers



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v



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No apologies needed we are all here to try and help each other and good to hear that you have found out that your Manager has a lithium profile.  smile

Whether it be on the net or from other sources you sometimes need to search, search and search to find the correct answer.

Good luck

Tim



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Talking about helping each other... Is a 180 amp Lithium battery more efficient than 2 x 100 deep cell batteries? Plus is a 1500 inverter compatible with a 180-amp Lithium battery? Jay&Dee

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JayDee wrote:

Talking about helping each other... Is a 180 amp Lithium battery more efficient than 2 x 100 deep cell batteries? Plus is a 1500 inverter compatible with a 180-amp Lithium battery? Jay&Dee


 Although my knowledge of batteries is limited, definitely a 180 ah Lithium is way better than 200ah deep cell batteries.

As far as the inverter goes, I reckon that'll be OK too, as I run a 5kw inverter off 540ah Lithium in the van and a 2kw inverter off 180ah Lithium in the car.,Good luck. Cheers



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Firstly in theory you can get 180Ah out of a LiFePO4 180Ah battery but some manufacturers set the BMS so you do not get 100% discharge.  If for example they set at 90% then you can draw out 162Ah.

A 2 x 100Ah deep cell batteries you can get 100Ah from if you want to look after them.

Your LiFePO4 wins hands down.

In running a 1500W inverter with LiFePO4 the question is what is that maximum discharge rate of the battery you are looking at.  This is usually determined by the BMS that is installed.  If the maximum discharge is 180A then you are well and truely ok as that is what we call a 1C rate.

1500/12 = 125A 

You will be well under.

If the battery has a 90A maximum discharge rate or 0.5C then unless you have two it is not suitable.

Hope that helps

Tim

I might add that I usually do the division by 10 to allow for inefficiencies but I take it that you have already allowed for an inverter that is slightly larger than the power draw of your largest appliance.





-- Edited by TimTim on Thursday 7th of September 2023 02:20:31 PM

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