Just interested, may change our van for a smaller one, but the other half is talking pop top. Any views on whether either type ( Pop Top verses Full size Caravan) is preferred.
We are going back to a hardfloor camper from a poptop, to lower our weight and give us more then the blacktop and odd dirt road to tour. Will be fitting a ducted a/c both heating a kooling. Hot water system if it hasn't got one, and few other things as well. It will be a used hardfloor camper. We had a soft floor before after two other c.vans, just wish we, we stuck with our initial interest in a Hardfloor camper, instead of this van.
One factor in this choice is "How much travelling will you be doing?" Poptops use less fuel - not much less, but just the same less fuel. A poptop caravan is heavier than the equivalent full height van because there is a substantial frame around the top of the body, and then you have a separate frame of sorts for the roof. Also, the tow vehicle. If you have a 4WD or other high vehicle, this will act as a windbreaker for the van. When we ordered out poptop, we asked for one with a shorter drawbar. By accident, I think this helps us with fuel economy because there is virtually zero airflow between our 4WD and the van. Travelling on a wet road, the back window of our 4WD remains totally dry. This indicates to me that the caravan is not pushing any air out of the way. Obviously there is a huge suction at the rear of the rig, but the suction would be worse with a full height van.
Poptop caravans are not as well insulated as full height. The label on our poptop says "Fully Insulated" Ha! I have been trying to sort out the TV connections and there is no insulation there for sure. But that would apply to full height vans as well. Even if our van was fully insulated, you have a strip of vinyl fabric around the roof with a vent in it as well, and the insulation value of the vinyl is zero. It is not a major problem for us because we rarely go off grid and a small fan heater or the (noisy) air conditioner heats the van well enough for us.
Having a poptop van allows us to put the van in a shed. A full height van would not be as easy to put away. It is easier to properly clean the poptop van after a trip.
Poptop vans are more stable under strong side winds. The centre of gravity is lower and there is less sidewall area for the winds to act on. If you look at photos of caravans which have rolled, I cannot recall any poptop vans rolling. Plenty of full height vans though.
Resale of poptop vans is poor. If you are looking to buy a used van, poptops will be much cheaper these days. But if you are going down this track, inspect the canvas/vinyl for signs of mould where people do not properly dry out the van before storing it.
Entry and egress from a poptop is more difficult because of the lower doorway. You only hit your head a few times before you work out how to go in or out without hitting it though. Depending on the design, in windy conditions, the roof on a poptop may move around a bit. Our van is quite stable though. We used to have a wind-up camper van were you would the roof up and pulled the beds out from each end. Now that roof used to really flap around in the wind.....
If you want a shower and toilet, ventilation of the toilet with a poptop is not as good as a full height van. Same with the shower. But everything with a caravan is a compromise and it is how far you wish to compromise that ultimately makes your decision.
I think I have listed all the downsides to poptops. Having said that, there is no way we will ever have a full height van. We love our rig and can see no way of ever changing it to a full height van.
Thanks for that big effort in replying to my question erad. At the moment we are full time on the road, but who knows what's around the corner. Our van is full size, and very comfortable, just looking at ways to get the weight down.
Bicyclecamper, I don't think those type of campers are for us. Seen some unfortuates in bad weather. We did have a Jayco Swan at one stage.
-- Edited by iana on Sunday 20th of September 2020 08:27:26 AM
That's okay iana, I doing it for a few reasons, another one, is I want to spend time in very remote areas, with my dog at times on my own, and know I couldn't get there with the van. I also want to save money into the bank, not sitting outside in the yard wasting away, all for at the most maybe 6 weeks away with wife a year. This camper will fit in my shed, where as I would have to build a bigger shed for the poptop, and that would also be another waste of money. And getting down some pretty narly tracks or up the Gunbarrel , the Tanami, and Canning stock routes again will be magical trips. And that bloody extra weight that we lug, hits me in the pocket fuel wise like no other.
Just adding to Erads reply. We have a 2015 Jayco Journey Outback PopTop 17.55 -3 + extended draw bar to carry a wire basket under the boot.
With the double bed at the front and kitchen at the rear wall, with the door at the rear too .A combo toilet / shower in the rear corner.
We chose this layout with long term trips in mind/ long lay overs of 10weeks at a time.
When chosing a camp spot (We free camp 90% while on the road ) If there is some breeze I will park into that breeze. The reason for doing so With the pops windows unzipped, we get a cross breeze witch lets ALL the heat flow straight out the rear window And Door. The summer heat gets extracted though the top windows. The 180lt fridge runs very cool on these days too.
The cars engine bay get a break from heat build up as well.
We have diesel heater for the colder nights mounted under the bed.
As the cook and chief bottle washer upper I wanted that kitchen as far away from the bed area as possible.
We wanted to keep the van in the cave. Having a 3 metre door clearance and the A/C on top It was a no brainer for us.
Been practical and forward thinking, this was the way to go IMO.
Hope this helps as well. Good luck with your discissions.
My son and wife travel extensively in a Jayco poptop https://www.jayco.com.au/range/pop-tops/starcraft-pop-top/floor-plans/touring/starcraft-1238-2sc-my20
Raised the bed to have 20l porta potti under the overhang of the bed they pull out at night and put at the door. They have taken it across most tracks in Aus without any failures. Standard road caravan with axle put under the springs, standard 14" tyres and never had a failure of any type. He has it fitted up with diesel heater and compressor fridge. They had a hard floor camper previously and couldn't get rid of it quickly enough. Can't stop for smoko or lunch, wet weather is crap, cold is crap, living in canvas in poor weather is just crap.
We used to have a pop top, but when the heavens opened at Mansfield & the pop top skirt leaked, the wife said no more pop top!
Considering we were planning longer trips, this fitted in with our plans to switch to a full size van. Vehicle was also due for a change & we bought accordingly. We can tow 2500kgs, but find ourselves in the 2240-2290kg range. So what you plan to do overall will lead you to choices one way or the other.
Another good reason for full size was I no longer hit my head like I did in the pop top. No such issue for vertically challenged Mrs fwdoz!
Pop tops don't generally weigh less for the same length, so if getting weight down is your aim then going for a pop top isn't going to help. The main thing I don't like about pop tops is that they let in a lot more noise, they also generally have less storage and are harder to warm. Personally I would stick to a full van for the comfort and simple ease of use. Fuel savings with a pop top compared to modern full vans with a sloped front is minimal as the square box of a pop top is aerodynamically worse.
I am a full van fan. Dislike the vinyl/canvas sides under the roof for all the reasons mentioned before. Having to put the roof up all the time. Just one more thing to set up. Love my van. Would not go back to a poptop.
Only really good reason for one is storage. Getting them into a shed or similar. My van is 2.8 metres to the top of the aircon so you need a pretty tall structure to get it under.
When I had a full size van I used "Carastow" storage wheels to lower it just enough to squeeze under the car port. Just another option to consider if height is an issue...
-- Edited by Mamil on Sunday 20th of September 2020 03:44:04 PM
Well, I/we are tent travellers as well, not so much in summer, but the other seasons - yee ha, we are out in , rain, cold, snow, and mud, does not bother our 60 plus year old selves. I did have to ask my wife a few times if she wanted to go back to a camper, and she said , she wished we kept the soft floor we had. It also had aircond h/c and a shower as well. In bad weather the portable crapper sits in the camper down the back, and then moves out to s...house in good weather. I think it is because we both lived in homes as toddlers, children and teenagers in houses that only had compressed dirt floors, and we lived like that for 3 rears as well in our first few years of marriage. If we are comfortable that is all that matters.
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-- Edited by Bicyclecamper on Sunday 20th of September 2020 05:22:12 PM
My understanding is the fuel savings is not a lot. So we went the full van. The other reason is I understand that putting the top up is an issue if you have crook shoulders and as you age.
And yes, colder.
We were new to caravanning several years ago and after a lot of research decided on an off-road full height van. The reasons being:
- minimal setting up whenever we stop. even just for morning coffee or lunch.
- better (not much) insulation heat/cold/noise.
- all the luxuries of a small home.
- debatable, but increased security
- it fits ok in our sideway.
The downsides:
- 3.2 metre clearance needed - watch out for those overhanging trees and low service station awnings.
- increased fuel consumption - some say not much, but I have nothing to compare with.
We have done two major trips and until someone creates an affordable Tardis, we will stick with full-size.
G'day Ian,
I went to a pop-top mainly for storage at home (didn't have to raise the carport).
We live in the warmer part of the country - if the temperature is not too hot (ie above 32 degrees, when we run the airconditioner), it is more pleasant as we have an extra four "windows" or large screened vents to open well above the normal windows.
Erecting them can be difficult if the roof has been down for quite some time but with good struts, they generally offer easy lifting.
By the same token as others have pointed out, they can be more difficult to keep warm. If a storm blows up, it is still possible to bunk down with the lid down - reducing the windage, depending on your height (I'm 6'6", can walk stooped down providing I remember to "duck" under the lights!!
It has been mentioned that "Storage is less" - that would be marginal as we have more vacant room than I can safely fill - often would like to carry more but would then be over weight! Yes with a full sized van the air conditioner is usually on the roof whereas ours "takes up room in part of a cupboard, under a bed".
Like most things it is horses for courses, pros & conns. While my van looks lean, sleek with its sloping front & the roof down, friends with the same sized, full height van were convinced ours was longer than theirs until they measured them both.
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Warren
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