A government Enquiry needed in the Caravan industry

Hey Jim · Guru

A government Enquiry needed in the Caravan industry

iana · Guru

I would totally agree, but I am of the opinion that it is the government that is to blame. They are weak knee'ed when it comes to policy, policing and discipline. A few companies prosecuted, nice large fines and take away their licence would soon see the companies toeing the line.
It looks as though we have both been served the same as far as build quality and design is concerned, however I don't think it is just the one company doing these things. I also think the sellers of the tow vehicles should label their product with what it can actually do. We should not have to fit suspension upgrades to a new vehicle just so it can do as it was advertised it could do.

I wonder who else out there has had these problems, according to third party accessory fitters, a lot are having these issues.

Bruce and Bev · Guru

I think you are very lucky if you buy a new RV and don't have a lot of faults with it, usually caused by poor workmanship and little or no quality control and checking the end product. I bought a caravan made by a major industry player and would never do it again. I would either buy a unit that was around 18 mnths old with all the problems sorted and fixed hopefully and have it inspected by a reputable caravan repairer prior to handing over any $$$, or use one of many small family owned and OPERATED makers who turn out 1-3 units a week and you can watch them build other units and also see yours as it goes through its various completion stages.

As for a govt inquiry, that just wont happen Jim......our bitches only affect a small proportion of the population so theres no votes to be gained from electors. How long did it take for Sate and then a Royal Commission into child abuse ???? - many years and prodding by numerous news media programmes and in newspapers!!

Desert Dweller · Guru

We carry a box full of food (heavy items) plus everything that should be in the boot of our van all in the back of our Nirvara to not go over our vans maximum allowable weight. Our vans single tank (drinking water) can only be one quarter full for the same reason, we carry water bottles in the Nirvara. We reckon there's a lot of rigs getting around that are obviously way overweight but their owners ignore the situation. Our Nirvara will tow 3000kg but our vans max is 1600kg. Our van was purchased new & was made by a large maker. Basically we can put 150kg plus a pair of socks & jocks in our van, any more & she's overweight.

goldcoaster · Senior Member

Have to agree with you Jim , my Jayco Optimum Motorhome is now 13 mths old , it has been back 14 times (total of 6 - 7 weeks out of my use) and its a trip to Brissie every time , a round trip of 200k's. In Jayco's defence they have addressed all problems and extended my warranty , but I'm still waiting for a response on 1 more big problem (under sized Onan Generator 2.3kva , should be the 3.3 kva which the later models now have). Obviously their was no quality checks , just get it off the lot and we will address all problems later. If we were in America it would've been a Lemon and I would have the option to replace or refund.
In our short travels , I have spoken to Avida , Swift and other owners of Motorhomes and they have all had problems buying new . The Swift owner has to wait for a part to come out from England.

So Yes , the Industry needs to be Regulated.
Mick

aussietraveller · Guru

A significant number of Sydney people including us have had significant problems with Jayco Sydney and although I am not impressed with Jayco build Quality and I don't need someone to tell me you get what you pay for because I can import a much better build quality van from the US for a much lower price than you can buy a Jayco from Sydney Jayco who just don't seem to care once they have sold the van, Jayco ACT were much better when my daughter had some warranty issues they even rang her to give a progress report and delivered her van back to her after the work was done properly the first time.

rockylizard · Guru

Gday...

cry I understand the angst expressed on this thread, and other threads on the same topic and definitely feel your pain.

However, rather than trying to blame the government for the 'faults' in Jayco (and some other manufacturers) most of the "blame" should be shouldered by the "market".

Complaints about Jayco have been rife for decades - AND have been very well known to caravanners Australia-wide for decades. They may have 'modernised' their product but have not improved their product - in build or quality.

They have no quality control and mostly respond to complaints from their buyers after the van has left the yard.

Often that 'response to buyers' takes many months to remedy - if at all. As Jayco owners know, Jayco's quality control is their customer's complaint. hmm

Given Jayco's widely known poor quality-build why on earth is it that Jayco hold over 47% of the market .......... and growing.

Why is it that so many Jayco owners who have experienced their 'poor manufacturing methods' continue to respond with the comment "OH yeah, we had a lot of problems, but they looked after us when we complained." Why not admit that the van purchased was NOT well-made and was of poor quality materials and fittings.

Rather than sitting back on the deck chair at happy hour and demanding "the government" must do something - tell the story how it is and don't buy another Jayco - and suggest others don't bother with a Jayco either.

Agreed, there are other manufacturers who produce vans with some faults and issues - but from my experience over the decades, no other manufacturer has the same low quality and poor build as Jayco - or Jayco's reputation.

Also, the greater majority of van manufacturers respond to warranty claims promptly and correctly. The majority of the industry produces vans of good quality, provide good service and backup and value their customers.

Having said all that, it is generally acknowledged that the caravan industry could produce better vans/motorhomes etc. Vans are mainly built to a price not a recipe and are usually built to a standard that the industry sees as adequate.

However, I think many in the industry do not realise how their product will be used and those who buy their product do not understand they were not designed to be used in some environments and conditions.

Expecting "the government" to fix all our consumer problems is something of wishful thinking I feel. It would be more productive for the consumer to 'vote with their wallet' - when sales disappear the good operators will respond.

cheers - John

chris & terry · Senior Member

"Agreed, there are other manufacturers who produce vans with some faults and issues - but from my experience over the decades, no other manufacturer has the same low quality and poor build as Jayco - or Jayco's reputation.

Also, the greater majority of van manufacturers respond to warranty claims promptly and correctly. The majority of the industry produces vans of good quality, provide good service and backup and value their customers."

Oh dear. Quiet a stretch in proclaiming both these points and isolating in the main to the one manufacturer. I believe both points may be a little more widespread throughout the industry. Yeh, a industry wide shakeup would not go astray. But don't hold your breath.

terry.

Bryan · Guru

Totally agree with Rocky lizard. We are quick to lay the blame on everybody else but ourselves. If a product does not meet expectations don't buy it. Simple. If you've bought before doing your research, blame yourself.

The Phantom · Guru

How many times on this and other Forums do we see the comment about nanny states and over regulation by the Government? And now we have a call for Government to further intrude into our lives.

The real problems lie with people rushing in to buy a product without doing the necessary research to satisfy their requirements.

It would appear that, recently, some people have bought lemons and now want the Government to intervene. The purchase of your van was your choice and the dispute between yourself and the manufacturer is not an area for Government intervention.

I would suggest that some people could be guilty of expecting too much for their dollar. It's the old conundrum "If it appears too good to be true, it probably is".

However people still forge ahead and purchase the bells and whistles from Manufacturer A for $50K when the same bells and whistles from Manufacturers B & C cost $60K. Surely the penny must drop somewhere and if it doesn't, how is it the Governments problem?

I am sure that this will pi$$ a lot of people off but you need to face the fact that buying the van was your choice not the Governments.

The Phantom

brickies · Guru

I think that is over reacting to a poor choice , Do we have an investigation to the cloth industry because the shirt your brought from the cheap shop for $5 isn't has good has the one from David Jones for $95 , Maybe we should some people to Specsavers , Let get real nobody twist your arm to buy a caravan from Jayco the price does .

Tones · Veteran Member

Some strange logic here.

Imagine what would happen if the motor vehicle retail industry in Australia had the same situation regarding factory faults, lack of quality, component failure, design faults, shoddy workmanship, poor after-sales service, etc etc. The sales figures would quickly remedy the situation.

Try getting a motoring organisation like RACQ, RACV, NRMA etc. to take up your case and make representations to a caravan manufacturer.

It is not a case of consumers making the wrong choice; it is a case of the various State Governments not having the courage to unleash their respective Departments and allow them to fully enforce their individual State Statutes that cover the spirit of the National Competition and Consumer Legislation that was passed on to the State Governments circa 2010. In other words, it is not the Manufacturer who is the target under that legislation; it is the Dealer who carries the responsibility of the quality of the product that is delivered to the customer by him and the only reason that the legislation is not working is because the consumer does not fully understand the law.

Your State Office of Fair Trading is the starting point in this scenario. It is up to them to police the dealers within the States. If this was to happen, you would not have to worry about the manufacturers because it would be the individual dealers who would be chasing them for some relief from the situation. Remember, the dealers exist to carry on their businesses under State legislation, not Federal.

Must go now! Am off to do some preparation work on my lemon (sorry......van) prior to the cooler months ahead.

Tones

dorian · Guru

I think we need an enquiry into government enquiries. Specifically, I'd like to know how a small bunch of wigheads manages to fleece the taxpayer of $400 million in a single gabfest. That's equivalent to 8000 years on the average wage.

Perhaps it would be cheaper if the taxpayer just paid for the repairs.

-- Edited by dorian on Friday 26th of February 2016 01:19:23 PM

Hey Jim · Guru

The Phantom wrote:
How many times on this and other Forums do we see the comment about nanny states and over regulation by the Government? And now we have a call for Government to further intrude into our lives.
The real problems lie with people rushing in to buy a product without doing the necessary research to satisfy their requirements.
It would appear that, recently, some people have bought lemons and now want the Government to intervene. The purchase of your van was your choice and the dispute between yourself and the manufacturer is not an area for Government intervention.
I would suggest that some people could be guilty of expecting too much for their dollar. It's the old conundrum "If it appears too good to be true, it probably is".
However people still forge ahead and purchase the bells and whistles from Manufacturer A for $50K when the same bells and whistles from Manufacturers B & C cost $60K. Surely the penny must drop somewhere and if it doesn't, how is it the Governments problem?
I am sure that this will pi$$ a lot of people off but you need to face the fact that buying the van was your choice not the Governments.

The Phantom

Hi Peter,

When you sold your van, were you finished with traveling around the block, or were there issues with yours as well.

Have you brought another van as yet. smile

Regards Jim

montie · Guru

www.caravanindustry.com.au/mvsa-review-due-shortly

There is already a Govt enquiry under way.

Jayco is the largest manufacturer in the country producing around 8000 units per annum. Many people are on their third or fourth Jayco and will probably buy another one.
No matter what brand of caravan we talk about there will always be a percentage of dissatisfied buyers and they are usually the only ones we hear from on a forum. The satisfied Jayco (or other brand owners) rarely post on a forum so we only get to hear one side of the story.

I think it is a simple fact of life that Jayco could not continue to sell the numbers that they do if their quality control was as poor as suggested by some.
I am not, by the way a Jayco dealer.

Montie

rockylizard · Guru

Tones wrote:
~~~SNIP
Imagine what would happen if the motor vehicle retail industry in Australia had the same situation regarding factory faults, lack of quality, component failure, design faults, shoddy workmanship, poor after-sales service, etc etc. ~~~SNIP
Tones

Gday...

... Because it is such a soft, and oft-mentioned and perhaps oft-maligned, target, I really do hate to give this simple one word answer to the above comment - Jeep.

Cheers - John

greyhoundtom · Senior Member

Eight months ago my wife and started looking for a used van around the 22ft long with an ensuite to do the big lap in, with the intention of living in the van until such time as we became sick of traveling.

Four months of looking at vans of every breed and kind, in the end it was a 2010 Jayco Sterling that impressed us the most for both quality and value. While I have changed a few items to suit us such as a couple of new batteries and extra solar panels, as well as adjusting the margins on a couple cabinet doors and have altered one plumbing item.

All in all I think it's a great van and I'm extremely happy with its built quality.

If I must have a bitch about anything it's about the unrealistic load the van is able to carry before running foul of the compliance plate. But that applies to most other vans I have looked at.

brickies · Guru

The big thing that you did was your research Tom and that what it all about .

Bruce and Bev · Guru

Brickies - yes you are right to an extent, but there are many other faults with RVs that a buyer would not even see (or be able to see)

Our 1st problem with our new van is when the pipes going into the hot water heater were cut through with chaffing due to improper installation by the van manufacturer, causing us to loose all our tank water and having to travel many kms to a country caravan repairer. All he did was replace the pipes and wrap them in one of his sons bike inner tube to stop them moving in transit and to protect them from being cut again.

To have found this sort of problem at time of purchase would have meant almost dis-assembling the 'van. The consumer law "The Trade Practices Act" makes it abundantly clear that "goods must be fit for the purpose......". This is often not the case with too many RVs made in Australia.

Rocky makes the point about Jeep and the bad stuff that went on with them. Apparently, Jeep have sorted the problems out with those now coming off the production line and they are now a good product. Likewise with VW.

I think the issues with the RV industry is that it doesn't make the front page headlines or the 6 o'clock TV news and is pretty much confined to social media and sites like this. Most first time buyers don't think to look behind the surface and they are not aware of the generally poor level of workmanship with RVs = afterall, new vans on the surface look good. If I was a 1st timer buyer of a 'van, I would assume that Jayco units are great because there are so many on the road

banjo · Senior Member

We too have been there done that with jayco, never again, what niggles me is if you pass a negative remark of the marque you are classed as a jayco basher.

I've never been that, I just tell it like it was for us and many more friends on the road, we no longer have the problem, we bought a quality 5th wheeler and it has been faultless in 4 years now.

As already said the industry in general stinks and needs a good shake up, but it'll never happen.

Koala · Veteran Member

Hi all,

yes I totally agree with everyone's comments especially the workmanship & quality of the caravans being pumped out at a rate of knots. It is disgusting that we have to put up with someone else's stuff ups, I bet those bastards would get a reality check if they had to put up with a leak in the roof right over the bed when it's pouring down rain, plus all the numerous complaints that we all have, I also agree that now of I have my problems sorted I am reluctant to sell as I now know that we have a good Van ?

I have to commend the manufacturer as they have fixed any issues but it's a real hassle to have to take your van 600 km's away to be repaired & time it takes & the cost & inconvenience of not having it to use. I am just from the old school & my favorite saying is I don't go & pick up my new Toyota Landcruiser & be expected to put up with bad craftsmanship ??

K J

The Phantom · Guru

Hey Jim wrote:

Hi Peter,
When you sold your van, were you finished with traveling around the block, or were there issues with yours as well.
Have you brought another van as yet.
Regards Jim
Jim,
I sold my van because I no longer had any use for it. Been there done that, so to speak. I toured for 18 months all over the country and do not intend touring again. The van was sold in very good condition and I received, what I thought, was a good price. As far as I am aware the new owner has had no issues with it (other than not being able how to operate the screen door).

I own, and am renovating, a 26 year old van that I will use on destination based holidays, mostly to Barn Hill or Bremer Bay in WA.

I have been several times around Oz both prior to, and after, retirement and, although I haven't seen everything, I'll be kept busy sorting through some 30,000 photographs of my travels.

Best Regards

The Phantom

the ginger nomad · Senior Member

How about a few of us who like our Jayco's and have not had problems stand up and be counted. We have a 17ft poptop discovery that has covered over 45.000kms, and YES I would buy another JAYCO tomorrow. Remember how many problems there were in the Auto industry only a few years ago.( reading some forums these seem to be still continuing )and successive governments poured billions of dollars into the industry to keep it afloat and it still sank! We need to be more assertive with Dealers/Manufactuers if problems arise and if not satisfied THEN involve consumer affairs and the media.
Sorry rant over!

montie · Guru

the ginger nomad wrote:
How about a few of us who like our Jayco's and have not had problems stand up and be counted.

I knew there had to be one out there somewhere!! smile

Montie

greyhoundtom · Senior Member

montie wrote:
the ginger nomad wrote:
How about a few of us who like our Jayco's and have not had problems stand up and be counted.

I knew there had to be one out there somewhere!!

Montie

You probably have to make that two.

aussie_paul · Guru

greyhoundtom wrote:

You probably have to make that two.

Three for sure. biggrin

Aussie Paul. smile

Hewy54 · Senior Member

Sorry Jim, but you need to get over it. How can you possibly call for a govt enquiry just because you made a bad choice?

Bryan · Guru

rockylizard wrote:
Tones wrote:
~~~SNIP
Imagine what would happen if the motor vehicle retail industry in Australia had the same situation regarding factory faults, lack of quality, component failure, design faults, shoddy workmanship, poor after-sales service, etc etc. ~~~SNIP
Tones
Gday...
... Because it is such a soft, and oft-mentioned and perhaps oft-maligned, target, I really do hate to give this simple one word answer to the above comment - Jeep.
Cheers - John

Took delivery of another Jeep last Saturday. My 6th consecutive one. Never had the need to ask for a Govt enquiry.

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

I just wish my David Jones shirt lasted as long as my other $5. One !! Lol is it similar with converted motorhomes . They are more custom made ? If your into 60k or so ? Have an MR licence ? Then it maybe another option ??

Snail · Senior Member

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