Who needs an Amphibian?

KFT · Guru

RE: Who needs an Amphibian?

oldtrack123 · Guru

PJK wrote:
With all this debate about approvals, I would like to put a scenario to the experts for comment -

If I buy all the correct rated components, plus the correct IP rated junction box, and then pay a fully licensed and certified electrician to assemble it, and tag it, why would that not be legal to use??

I would think that the only need for "approval" is for the manufacturer to market the product??

Am I wrong??

Peter
PJK

HI Pete

I am not sure as to which situation of use you are referring but if you mean a10 to 15A adapter for connecting a VAN to a 10A power outlet in[ for want of a quick description] public place, YES, that can be done provided the unit complies with ALL the requirements for THAT application.'"Transportable Structures & their power supply "as defined in AS3001

Yes the APPROVAL is required for SALE

But it does involve a bit more than just an IPx4 junction box .AS Ampfibian & another potential supplier of a slighly different concept know when seeking approval.

Too late now, & not sure what tomorrow will bring when we go to see the Specalist ,but I do hope to be able to continue our friendly conversation with my friend Frank smile ,[ or anyone else who asks a sensible question] regarding the requirements of the Standard soon,perhaps tomorrow night ,all going well

But,first I have got to find where I have saved my FULL copy of AS3001

I do hope I have not lost it with a Computer failure a few months ago & change over from XP to W7

Stay turned, you may find it interesting smile

PeterQ

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-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Monday 29th of September 2014 11:25:55 PM

Phil C · Guru

oldboar wrote:
Wasting your time arguing the rules with this bloke KFT. Been there, done that, even asked for his qualifications at which point he went very quiet for quite a while. As most in the trade say, he's an X spurt. I assume you know the rest of the definition.

Darrell

Yes yes yes.................................

I wish to heck people would let the BS go and let people make their own mistakes. To sprout chapter and verse of the standards is non productive and causes people to get seriously pissed off!!

Sorry to say that guys but I am sick of crossing swords with these blokes. If we choose to make these "illegal" items, so be it. If it craps out then so be it. OUR/MY problem and no standard on earth can change that. I bet my woo hoos that I get some flack for this as well....

As far as gentlemanly discussions go, Its my opinion that these guys believe they are right 100% of the time and no other option or opinion counts and thats so annoying, nobody likes a smarta**se. Its still my belief that if I want to make a 10amp plug and attach it to a 15amp socket I can (just go to bunnings and buy the bits), as long as I am the only one using it and I accept the consequences of my actions.

Frankly I got sick of the bloody standards ruling everything I did as a sparky, yes I obeyed the edicts and made sure all my work complied, but that was a different ball game from making a small dongle, that I will NEVER sell, to cover an exigency that (so far) has never happened to me. The good news is I dont give a damn any more! BTW I would never make one for anybody else.

Rant over

-- Edited by Phil C on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 10:42:03 AM

oldtrack123 · Guru

Hi Phil

With all those EX quals

[Quote]Ex RAAF Electrical Fitter and Electrician

Retired trade trainer (Electrical and ElectronicsEnd

I am a little surprised at that;

[a] how many of your posts are not correct

your apparent lack of undertstanding of Standards & the need for such

[C]that you would suggest the use of any devise that does not meet the requirements for the imtended use

In this case as a equal to an Ampf ibian to supply VANs etc in CPS etc.

It does not meet the basic requirement of at least an IPx4rating

THat rating is required for any outlet box including in tent & annexes as they are not considered as indoors for that purpose

The outlet box[as a fully completed & connected unit] referred to in the tent section4 of the standards has to met the requirements of section 4.4 [IPx4]

In simple words it SHALL be ipx4 rated when in use.

THAT includes ANY/ALL plug & socket connections made to it .

Now look at your cheap alternative

IT does not & can not!

& THATs Certainly includes a 10to 15A outlet boxs used in those situations

I suggest y you do a little more research before posting such advice & leading those who do not know better or undertand astray .

Now IF you doubt this OR anyone doubts this, simply contact your local ESO giving details of how you wish to use ANY electrical device & they will set you straight t

DO not believe what a seller's adverts say!!!!

That has been proven many many times

Unfortunatey letting peoples "mistakes go" when posted on open forums can have dire consequence

Again I would have thought YOU would understand THAT,with all those quals that you post

PeterQ

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 11:43:14 AM

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 11:51:03 AM

-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 11:59:12 AM

oldtrack123 · Guru

PeterD wrote:
Phil C wrote:
BTW it even has a compliance certificate.
Phil, what are the uses that that approval covers?

Hi Peter

He does not know,

Some seem to not understand that an approvel may not & usualy does not cover every type of use or location /situation

As YOU are well aware smile

Phil C · Guru

PeterQ, I like you... you stand up for what you think is right and thats admirable.

PLEASE let people be people and make mistakes, the standards do not cover stupidity or plain arrogance.

However, I did quote that the approval for the cheap RCD was for an RCD only... so I do know. AND only a fool would put it out in the rain.

I taught standards till they came out my ears, we had 4 units of study just on standards and wiring, so please dont tell me I dont understand them. The thing I get cross about is practicality can often over rule standards as long as its not stupid, like putting active to earth etc.

If a thing is technically safe and used only by its creator then who cares, honestly mate, give it a break, the rules are there for guidance, and safe keeping.

Sorry Peter, I find your reply a bit confronting. BTW I can read black as well as red.... not necessary mate. As well the personal attack on my qualifications is just wrong and not in the spirit of these blogs. I was responsible for putting millions of dollars worth of military aircraft back in the air so dont sprout on about qualifications and standards, the Mil standard makes AS3000 look like "my first reader". There was more skill and safety mechanisms required to work on aircraft than being an A grade electrician will ever have!

BTW your much vaunted amphibian has a recall on it it seems they used a 15A breaker rather than a 10A, I do actually research mate, its an old habit.

Perhaps Cindy should close this one down, Im sick of the flack! I have requested that she do so. I would prefer you dont respond to my posts again.

-- Edited by Phil C on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 12:18:25 PM

-- Edited by Phil C on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 12:24:20 PM

-- Edited by Phil C on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 01:21:24 PM

rockylizard · Guru

Gday...

I love watching the "electrical threads" - better than watching World Championship Wrestling.

I have yet to figure out which one is Hulk Hogan and which is Killer Kowalski and/or who actually wins - if anyone does. But the 'muscle flexing' is definitely entertaining.

But my interest was piqued about the recall so I just hadda have a gander - https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/1055935

I wonder how many owners of the product actually knew about the recall ... and returned their product for correction?

Or if anyone has had a 'non-returned' one go up in flames or blow their elbow off this year cry confuse hmm cry

And for the contenders - I find the 'information' and 'advice' provided on here so far above my uninformed head I simply ALWAYS just go to an auto elec or sparkie and not bother asking on here.

Cheers - John

Phil C · Guru

rockylizard wrote:
Gday...
I love watching the "electrical threads" - better than watching World Championship Wrestling.
I have yet to figure out which one is Hulk Hogan and which is Killer Kowalski and/or who actually wins - if anyone does. But the 'muscle flexing' is definitely entertaining.
But my interest was piqued about the recall so I just hadda have a gander - https://www.recalls.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/1055935
I wonder how many owners of the product actually knew about the recall ... and returned their product for correction?
Or if anyone has had a 'non-returned' one go up in flames or blow their elbow off this year
And for the contenders - I find the 'information' and 'advice' provided on here so far above my uninformed head I simply ALWAYS just go to an auto elec or sparkie and not bother asking on here.
Cheers - John

You have made my day John.

Im the devil's advocate.. disbelief

Not sure about world championship wrestling John, more like grey nomad pissing competition. evileye

-- Edited by Phil C on Wednesday 1st of October 2014 12:48:08 PM