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baute


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Help with a little power issue
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Hello all, I dont post much but read a lot. I am one of the silent ghost readers that just pop out on the occasion when I really need to know something. One day when I have some more grey nomading experience I will probably post more but for the moment Im still on L plates.

So here goes: I am so confused and trying to work out what I need to power my short trips away.

I require power to recharge phone, tablet, laptop, GPS, 12v shower, my ezy wrench, and not much else. One day I may invest in a fridge but make do with esky for the time being.

I managed to blow my 12v in console using ezy wrench and have solved that problem now by connecting it directly to battery instead.

I have priced a dual battery setup with view to future needs and decided it is too much money for my present camping style. So have decided I just want a portable power pack which will meet my needs.

I have 12v outlets linked to my main battery in the back of my ute and want to power a portable unit through these.

I am looking at a  6in 1 jumpstarter from Jaycar($169) and the Waeco cool power raps battery 36ah($250 on special).

The Waeco is a deep-cycle AGM battery. http://www.anaconda.com.au/Product/Camp-and-Hike/Power-Supply/Cool-Power-Raps-Battery-36Ah

 The Jaycar is Features: http://search.jaycar.com.au/search?w=jump%20starter
Automatic air compressor for pumping tyres and other inflatables
AC and DC chargers included
12V 18Ah SLA battery inside
400W (800W surge) modified sine wave Inverter - 230VAC outlet at rear for powering laptops, etc
5 LED work/map light at front panel
Charging and air compression dial indicators
2 x 12VDC sockets for running 12V appliances
DC charging takes approximately 12 hours
AC charging takes approximately 34 hours
Charging jack
Built in air cooling fan
Battery level indicator
600A Cranking, 900A Max

Basically I just want something that will do the job but is best value for money. I think both will do job. I believe that if you charge them by 240v before you go away then just keep them plugged in whilst driving they should stay charged.

My thoughts are the waeco are stating that their power pack can run  their fridges and is a deep cycle battery so might be better than a jump starter but the jumpstarter like the jayco has other benefits like the compressor and 400W (800W surge) modified sine wave Inverter.

So if there is anyone out there who could provide an opinion on jump starter versus the waeco or some other solution I havent thought of I would appreciate any advice. I have looked at other jump starters and become confused by the amps they are quoting.

Thanks in advance for any input or opinions.



-- Edited by baute on Friday 22nd of November 2013 10:32:40 PM

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SnowT


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There is no Easy explanation..

"how long is a Piece of String..??"

It all comes down to what you want to do..

- What are you powering..? AH Load
- For How Long is it running..?
- What are you doing to charge it.. Solar, wind, Generator..?
- To what % do you want to discharge the batteries..?
the Questions are way to many..

how much Money are you willing to spend..?

Seriously I had a Look at Both.. Now this is ME speaking..

I would buy Neither.. [But then I'm nut's, and have to have the best I can afford.. Looking to the future..]
spend the extra Money Now to get a Second Battery installed..
- Get a Good Battery [100Ah or so..]
- the required Gear to hook it up in your Car..[Not 100% sure of what that is..] to make sure it charge's Properly and keep's it life long..
- A Small solar Panel to help keep the battery charged when camping..
> when you need to run the ezy wrench make sure the car is running..

that would be my plan of action.. But then I'm nut's..

Juergen




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PeterD


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The Waeco model has twice the battery capacity of the Jayco one. That would be the deciding factor for me.

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PeterD
Nissan Navara D23 diesel auto, Spaceland pop-top
Retired radio and electronics technician.
NSW Central Coast.

 
SnowT


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Hey as I said from the start make sure when you use it[Ezy wrench] when the car is running Best way..

If you have to do something from a fair distance.. make sure you upgrade the size of the cables for the ezy wrench..[I'm not sure what it's load is.. heavier cables the better it is]

Juergen



-- Edited by SnowT on Saturday 23rd of November 2013 10:57:09 PM

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IF I say something Dumb.. Just Smack me..

 

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Plendo


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I am with Jurgen on this one, nothing beats the security of having that second battery properly fitted, and set up so it carries the non vehicle load, thus your starting battery will always be available when you need it.

BUT, just to confuse the picture further, there are now small (as in very small) devices on the market that store enough power to jump start a large diesel, do not weigh much, can be easily charged, etc. They use LifePo4 battery technology (safe), that can deliver their power very quickly. Well worth a look, here are a couple of examples:

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mini-Jump-starter-for-Dissel-4WD-600Amp-Crank-power/321243150647?rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.m1851&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D261%26meid%3D2902732084402052654%26pid%3D100005%26prg%3D1088%26rk%3D3%26rkt%3D5%26sd%3D321254586124%26

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Mini-Jump-starter-Multifunctional-/321254586124?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item4acc43f70c&_uhb=1



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baute


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Thanks for the responses. I have spent most of today searching for my solution and am still confused, but that's okay I now know there is so many options out there and all have plus and minuses. Dual battery is okay but takes up space and is not light to remove if you want to remove to take to a campsite away from vehicle. Jump starters seem to be the go for small amounts of power that is portable. The battery packs seem to be another option. Anyway I guess I will work it out eventually, I know why there is much debate on the internet about this issue, no one solution suits all applications. That piece of string is very long and very tangled I think.


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Jedo_03


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Here's my advice:
The Jaycar has lots of Bell's and Whistles, and the gear they sell is "okay" but that unit at 18aH is probably useless for your needs... Now, and in the future...
The Waeco 36aH has twice the capacity of the Jaycar... is good gear... But again probably useless for your current and future needs...
WHY...?? I hear you asking...
Two important reasons:
First is: The "Jaycar" is not a "deep cycle" storage battery. It is not designed to be charged/used/recharged on (say) a daily basis, like camping needs. It is one of those batts that are handy to be kept "on charge" ready to go into action if you need a light or need to use a low-power-draw appliance...
The Waeco IS a "deep cyle" battery - it IS designed to be constantly charged/used/recharged on a daily basis...
Which brings the second reason: You must Never - never - ever discharge a battery to below 50% of its rated capacity... You may get away with doing it a few times, or even a dozen times... but each time you do it, you are damaging the internals of the batt - and it will soon be cactus...
50% of the Jaycar is 9aH - not enough "power to recharge phone, tablet, laptop, GPS, 12v shower, my ezy wrench, and not much else. One day I may invest in a fridge but make do with esky for the time being." nowhere near enough...
50% of the Waeco is 18aH - barely enough "power to recharge phone, tablet, laptop, GPS, 12v shower, my ezy wrench, and not much else. One day I may invest in a fridge but make do with esky for the time being." barely enough... and probably not enough...
So, don't consider buying the Jaycar... It will NOT do what you require...
The Waeco MAY meet your current power needs - depending how long you shower for... how often and long you use the ezy wrench... But it will NOT meet your needs when you buy that fridge... (ballpark current draw of a 40L Waeco CFX 40L Fridge Freezer operating at an ambient temp of 30C over a 24 hr on/off cycle period is about 25-30 amps...) The Waeco Raps will only (safely) supply you 18... If you are also using power for your other needs, then the Waeco will very soon be cactus... 252 very dead dollars sitting in the back of your vehicle...
Yes... The Waeco 36aH Raps is quite a useful unit.. I have one of those... Handy and portable...
But I also have 2 x 100aH + 1 x 120ah deep-cycle AGM's that are my "core" power sources...
And for LESS co$t, YOU can buy a 100aH, true deep-cyle, AGM battery from the likes of Ebay for about 200 notes... free delivery...
Gives you 50amps of Usable power - enough "power to recharge phone, tablet, laptop, GPS, 12v shower, my ezy wrench, and not much else" AND the fridge if you do decide to invest in it one day...
The $52 you save can go towards a Solar Panel that will re-charge your batt while you are fishing at your favourite spot...
Which is (hopefully) NOT Cahill's Crossing...


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Joe and Sheila - Poms until 1987. Nissan 3L Patrol pulling a Jayco 17.55-3 Discovery.
baute


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The $52 you save can go towards a Solar Panel that will re-charge your batt while you are fishing at your favourite spot...
Which is (hopefully) NOT Cahill's Crossing...

Thanks I needed a laugh, cahills Crossing will have to check that out.

Your advice I agree with and have come to the same conclusion. But I really don't want to use up the space on dual battery, maybe I should just go old fashioned camping without the bells and whistles. Boiled water and tub wash, star gazing instead watching stars on DVD, switch off the phone (I remember when they weren't invented) and use the stars again to guide my way and if I get lost, OH WELL that's half the fun :) But Im not giving up my ezy wrench that's my necessity!



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Jedo_03


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Cahill's Crossing...
Interesting fishing spot... On the East Alligator River on the border of Kakadu and Arnhem Land... Infamous... Place where you compete with Mr and Mrs Crocodilus for Baramundi...
Been there many, many times... Magic spot... But never fishing...
Oh - you catch some beauts... www.ntnews.com.au/article/2013/07/08/322585_fishing.html
But don't under-estimate the River-Hunters...
www.dailytelegraph.com.au/travel/travel-news/crocodile-lying-on-middle-of-creek-crossing-stops-traffic-in-top-end/story-fnjjv9zk-1226715111843
www.youtube.com/watch
Back to Power - We have a 120aH Batt mounted permanently in the rear of our Nissan Patrol...
Footprint is a mere 15 x 9 inches...
Connected via heavy duty 6mm diam wiring to the alternator with a dual battery isolator...
Charges the Batt when the engine is running... Isolated from the Crank Batt when we are stopped... We can ALWAYS start the Nissan, and the Waeco 50L purrs along quite nicely in the back - 24/7...
Another set of heavy duty 6mm wires come from the alternator directly to the 2 x 100aH AGM deep-cycle battes in the caravan... that's 5 or 6 metres of wire... AND supplies power to the caravan fridge to keep it COLD while we are running... That's 7 or 8 metres of wire... And ALL run from under the bonnet of the Nissan...
And when we get there... 2 x 120W Solar Panels can keep ALL of these batts charged... and ALL of our appliances and gadgets going for days or weeks on end...
Days gone... We used to camp frugal: 3v torch and a pump-up Kerosene Cooker... Look for the stars and Constellations we knew to get our bearings... Boil the water to kill off the bugs and the trichinella... No phones, DVD's, onsite Telly in those days...
But times change... And we CAN have all these things - and More - these days...
Necessity IS the Mother of Invention....

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Joe and Sheila - Poms until 1987. Nissan 3L Patrol pulling a Jayco 17.55-3 Discovery.
baute


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Well I never knew that asking a question could be so much fun. So many memories here being brought on by the responses.

Cahills Crossing, well I may have been there, I certainly have memories of similar crossing back before Kakadu was named Kakadu and Uluru was named Uluru.

I remember waiting it out by the side of flooded causeways as the Holden Kingswood station wagon just wouldn't make it across. I don't know how we survived though, no air conditioning, no seatbelts, and only the 12v on the car to run the lights and fridge when travelling with the old Millard.

Thanks for the tip about keeping the engine running with the Ezy wrench, I will do.

Here's a thought, what is your opinion about the blue Ark Pak box. Is it something that is worthwhile or just an over priced box?

http://www.bcf.com.au/online-store/products/Ark-Powerpack-Battery-Box-Smart-Charger.aspx?pid=165815#Cross

or maybe this

http://www.bcf.com.au/online-store/products/Battery-Box-Power.aspx?pid=131929&menuFrom=571489#Cross

I am thinking the blue box as it has the feature to recharge by 240v and a 6 stage smart charger.

 

 



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oldbobsbus


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Anything from BCF is over priced..smile



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baute


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Thanks old Bob, but I just went and bought the blue ARK Pak from them BCF.

My question now is: Does anyone see any problem/issue with me putting a dual battery behind the passenger seat in a utility?

This is the best place I want to put it for my setup.



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KFT


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baute,

a couple of things to consider with your idea.

use sealed batteries that will not vent gas into your car

make sure the batteries are enclosed in a battery box and well anchored down

frank

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