Waeco CF50 12V cable polarity

hako · Guru

Waeco CF50 12V cable polarity

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

Check with test lamps ?? To earth .. The earth your standing on.

-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Saturday 16th of November 2013 01:32:20 PM

oldbobsbus · Guru

Aus-Kiwi wrote:
Check with test lamps ?? To earth ..

LOL... dunno that a test lamp would do much good but a multimeter would find the pin that goes direct to earth.. blankstare

hako · Guru

Thanks for the tips but the is no earth as such. The 12v supply goes into an encapsulated board covered in resin ....same with the 240V side. Every bit of the unit is double insulated and hidden out of reach - probably designed this way so they can take rough treatment. I might have to sneak into BCF and look at the cable they have - hopefully they are not all boxed up. I was just hoping that someone had a Waeco and could tell me from looking at the cable.
If I cannot get the unit working on 12Vdc I'll run it through and inverter but would prefer to have the 12v side working so I can power it with a solar panel.
Thanks

Denis

oldbobsbus · Guru

Take your multimeter with you Dennis, The cables they sell are the enclosed type so you would have to test it to find out which one is which..

hako · Guru

Thanks Bob - didn't think of that. I've got a tiny multimeter in the van that is no bigger than a matchbox. If I took my big Avo in I'd be arrested!
Regards
Denis

Rover · Veteran Member

top -

bottom+

oldbobsbus · Guru

Rover wrote:
top -
bottom+

Thanks for that Rover and welcome to the forum..
I bet Dennis still goes to BCF to check it out and maybe buy a lead..

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

hako wrote:
Thanks for the tips but the is no earth as such. The 12v supply goes into an encapsulated board covered in resin ....same with the 240V side. Every bit of the unit is double insulated and hidden out of reach - probably designed this way so they can take rough treatment. I might have to sneak into BCF and look at the cable they have - hopefully they are not all boxed up. I was just hoping that someone had a Waeco and could tell me from looking at the cable.
If I cannot get the unit working on 12Vdc I'll run it through and inverter but would prefer to have the 12v side working so I can power it with a solar panel.
Thanks

Denis

Plenty of earth !!! Your possibly standing on it ...

hako · Guru

Thanks Rover, that's the exact info I need, and yes Bob I will still go to BCF and buy something that I MUST HAVE, but it won't be a lead. wink

And Kiwi....well you are correct

Thanks again to all.

hako · Guru

Update....well it won't work on 12Vdc.....open circuit so maybe there is a fuse somewhere inside. I can live with it running on 240v and use an inverter if away from 240V. Can't complain I suppose as this unit was dumped.
Regards

Denis

Ontos45 · Guru

Remember someone telling me Waeco has an internal fuse that had to be replaced by a tech.

Peter

oldbobsbus · Guru

Ontos45 wrote:
Remember someone telling me Waeco has an internal fuse that had to be replaced by a tech.

Peter

I reckon by the time Dennis has finished fixing this fridge he will not only be able to call himself a Tech he will be an Expert..lol :)

hako · Guru

Spot on Bob, but I think Peter is correct that there is an internal fuse but incorrect that I will require a Tech. I'm not guaranteeing that I really don't need a Tech to do this job, just that unless something I own is under guarantee, it will usually be bodgied up by me. I have many examples to prove this, not all work anymore.
I've read that there is a special type of fuse inside the Waeco's so I'll tread carefully.
And Peter, I have a bro-in-law who is a retired Tech and I sometimes use him as a last resort but you know the male thing...never give in till you've really stuffed it up!

Sometime I think this fiddling around with things that you only have a limited knowledge of is bordering on the ridiculous, but then it keeps me out of the pub....and despite destroying some, it is good fun.

Regards

Denis

DeBe · Guru

A lot of guessing here, whynot post pictures of the relevant circuit boards. There is several articles here on this forum on waeco fridges, that ive posted. The special fuse was a PTC polly fuse. It would go high resistance when overloaded. When it cooled down it would go back to a low resistance. Some of these were faulty some time ago.

-- Edited by DeBe on Sunday 17th of November 2013 02:24:47 PM

KFT · Guru

Denis there are not too many "special" fuses out there so if that is the problem then you could solve it using any fuse of the same rating by modifying the fuse carrier or deleting it altogether and fitting one that takes a more common style of fuse.

These days many automotive applications use "blade" fuses and there are lots of fuse holders available for them.

if you run into any difficulty I am happy to assist with info.

frank

hako · Guru

Thanks Frank, when I say "special fuse", I mean one of those that are inside an aluminium capsule - I've seen one inside a Sunbeam frypan removeable plug - they are usually spot welded not soldered so they can take the heat I guess. I further suspect that when/if I find this 'special fuse', it will be encased in resin to make it difficult to repair. I seem to remember something about this fuse on the CF.
Anyway, I'll have a look - thanks again for the kind offer of assistance.

Regards

Denis

DeBe · Guru

The avatar picture was taken at South Neptune Is in South Australia. The boat over the seals head is a Cray fishing boat I used to workon in the mid 70s. KFT what you are refering to are Micro Temp fuses, Havent seen any in a Waeco yet, but are common in a lot of apliances.

-- Edited by DeBe on Sunday 17th of November 2013 09:54:30 PM

hako · Guru

DeBe wrote:
A lot of guessing here, whynot post pictures of the relevant circuit boards. There is several articles here on this forum on waeco fridges, that ive posted. The special fuse was a PTC polly fuse. It would go high resistance when overloaded. When it cooled down it would go back to a low resistance. Some of these were faulty some time ago.

-- Edited by DeBe on Sunday 17th of November 2013 02:24:47 PM

That sounds like the one I'm thinking of. I'll take you up on posting pics of the board(s) - I know there is one on the other side of the panel that's in my first post and I guess that board decides if it's handling 12/24v and if it's above or below optimal voltage and then passes it along to the other board which figures out if the compressor needs power now or not. How's that for a highly technical description of my understanding.

Thanks DeBe

KFT · Guru

Denis those are usually a thermal fuse and from memory are a once only operation. Once they function due to overtemp they stay open.

forget the actual name of the device but I do remember they are available in many different ratings

we replaced lots of them over the years.

DeBe is the bloke that knows these machines very well. His advice will be spot on.

frank

hako · Guru

Thanks Frank - there is a mine of info on this forum, no doubt due to the members. Your avatar looks very idyllic. DeBe's looks like south of Tasmania...Macquarie Island?
I'll post pics on this thread in a day or two.

Regards

Denis

KFT · Guru

DeBe you are spot on, that name rings a bell. I must admit I have not seen any other "fuse" in a aluminium case. The only thing that comes to mind is a HRC fuse but I see no need for those in a portable fridge either.

Denis, that photo was taken at sunset at lake Sambell cp in Beechworth Vic. top spot.

frank

hako · Guru

OK - here's some pics of the first board on the removeable panel. Something I've just noticed when resizing the first pic, on the top right hand side there seems to be a dry joint....however there also seems to be the stain from a liquid there as well and maybe the liquid has caused the pin that's soldered to rust giving the illusion of a dry joint? Only one way to tell but I'll have to leave it till morning as it's dark (boogy man and all that). If it is a dry joint then ????
Comments welcome
Regards
Denis

DeBe · Guru

That is a dry joint but it wont affect the running on 12V as its a 240v filter capacitor. By almeans resolder it. If its running ok on 240V then the compressor is ok. Will post some pictures of whats on the board, aswell as the controller for the compressor Danfoss 101N0500. The main 12V DC feed to the compressor is the pins marked + & -- on the controller. Its getting late here to. Cheers Daryl

dorian · Guru

"Service Manual" for DANFOSS R134A,R404A,R507,R407C,R22 COMPRESSOR:
http://elektrotanya.com/danfoss_r134a,r404a,r507,r407c,r22_compressor.pdf/download.html

Actually the above document is in Russian and has exploded diagrams and wiring diagrams.

There are more Danfoss "service manuals" here:
http://elektrotanya.com/?q=showresult&what=danfoss&kategoria=&kat2=schematics

Instructions, Technical Information, Service Bulletins:
http://www.danfoss.com/SearchResult.htm?k=101N0500&s=www_danfoss_com

Here are various documents including wiring diagrams, specifications, and refrigeration projects:

PTC starting device:
http://de.refrignet.danfoss.com/TechnicalInfo/Literature/Manuals/06/eptc_description_08-2005_ei200b202.pdf

http://de.refrignet.danfoss.com/TechnicalInfo/Literature/Manuals/06/electronic_unit_101n0500_voltage_04-2008_en100a102.pdf
http://sundanzer.com/documents/ACDCElectSpecs.pdf
http://www.oceansolutions.com.au/files/file_269_45_110712161928.pdf
http://ptacsolutions.3dcartstores.com/assets/images/electronic_unit_101n0500-tech-info.pdf
http://www.coastalcoolaids.com/images/AC_-_DC_Controller_Wiring_Diagram.pdf
http://www.hvacusa.com/media/datasheetfiles/101N0230.pdf
http://www.rparts.com/documents/CR_011-1020_Manual_v2dw.pdf
http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0208/7716/files/Truckfridge_SelfDiagnostics.pdf?258
http://www.secop.com/fileadmin/user_data/pdfs/guidelines/application_note_bd_solar_06-2012_desa100c102.pdf
http://kaeltepartner.net/media/Danfoss_bd35f_r134a_12-24vdc_09-2011_dehc100d802.pdf

Shipment of Refrigeration Appliances in Horizontal Position:
http://de.refrignet.danfoss.com/TechnicalInfo/Literature/Manuals/06/shipment_positions_06-2005_ei000i26m.pdf

-- Edited by dorian on Tuesday 19th of November 2013 07:25:29 AM

hako · Guru

Thanks Daryl - Frank was correct! Much appreciated. I'll get the Avo out in the morning and do some tracing.

Regards

Denis

dorian · Guru

You may not miss your grandfather's help.

Google's translator should do a reasonable job.

http://translate.google.com/?hl=en&eotf=0&sl=ru&tl=en

-- Edited by dorian on Tuesday 19th of November 2013 08:32:49 AM

hako · Guru

Thanks Dorian....wow! One of my grandfathers was Russian FWIW. I'm going to play around tracing wires as best I can, then if I find something that look 'broke', I'll ask the questions on here. Any tricky soldering of miniature components I pass on to my bro-in-law. I'm aware of my limitations having in the past exceeded them with costly results if you know what I mean.
Thanks again.

Denis

DeBe · Guru

Denis, just be aware that if you are going to make a 12V lead for your fridge to test it, include a fuse 8Amp in the line as there is NO internal fusing for 12V in that fridge. The only fusing in the fridge is for the 240V AC. One fuse is in the 240V socket. The other is a 2A fuse soldered to the circuit board inside the 101N0500 module on the compressor. Picture is the inside of the module showing the 2A fuse. The module shown has most of the 240V powersupply removed as that part was damaged due to high voltage.

hako · Guru

Thanks Daryl - fridge is currently working perfectly on 240Vac whereas before it would only work on the emergency switch...thermostat switches in/out OK as well...even the light in compartment comes on, just the 12Vdc bit to put the meter on as it's open circuit right now. Social bowls this arvo and going camping with the grandkids wed/thu to Murpheys creek campgrounds where the kids can ride bikes, paddle in the creek and play with fire. That means this job gets left on the bench till Friday, as I don't want to rush it.
Regards

Denis