This post is in regard to active promotion of the devises @ caravan shows & in the RVMMA booklet [p21 ]
The section of the RVAMAA handbook dealing with electrical safety & in particular the use of "Epods" at the service pillar for RCD protection &/or connection of a 15amp plug to a 10amp socket is NOT AN APPROVED USE
I have made inquiries direct to the relevant authorities To date ,I have had three replies regarding the incorrect information in the RVMMA booklet regarding the use of portable outlet boards WA &TAS have confirmed that "epods " complying to AS/NZS 3105 ARE NOT APPROVED FOR THAT SITUATION[ie used for connection to a van extension lead The Qld SEI has confirmed that the info was supplied some 10years ago,IT IS OUT OF DATE THEY have contacted the RVMMA
I have a 10-15 amp adaptor which I have used from the van to my aircon connection which is a separate in-plug, when the power pole doesn't have a second 15 amp point. I haven't used it as a 15 amp to 10 amp connection. So far so good. It was assembled by an electrician when I first set out on my ventures.
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20ft Roma caravan - Mercedes Benz Sprinter - SA-based at the moment. Transport has no borders.
Management makes the decisions, but is not affected by the decisions it makes.
What's the difference between the adaptor made up for me and the "Ampfibian" device you're referring to? I'll Google it to get an idea of what you're talking about.
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20ft Roma caravan - Mercedes Benz Sprinter - SA-based at the moment. Transport has no borders.
Management makes the decisions, but is not affected by the decisions it makes.
Having attempted to research this topic further, I'm no totally and absolutely confused. Are you addressing power boards with cut out switches? Are you talking about extension cords? Are you talking about 15 amp power leads to caravan/motor home etc? Too many abbreviations and other items have just succeeded in confusing me without a doubt. Can you please clarify, with pictures and diagrams if possible to specify the equipment to which you refer? I'm not being a smart a..se. I just don't understand your description and terminology.
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20ft Roma caravan - Mercedes Benz Sprinter - SA-based at the moment. Transport has no borders.
Management makes the decisions, but is not affected by the decisions it makes.
What's the difference between the adaptor made up for me and the "Ampfibian" device you're referring to? I'll Google it to get an idea of what you're talking about.
Hi Granny
I'll try to answer clearly , but if any problem just ask for further explanations
your extension lead with a 10amp plug & 15amp socket , is not an "APPROVED" device.the various state elecricity acts state that only 'APPROVED devises SHALL be used"
[2]It is not & cannot be "approved "because it does not conform to the "Standard" for extension leads.
This is the reason such ext leads are not available for sale
non approved devices should not be sold & again sellers could incur heavy penalties
It is also the reason an electrician could be up for heavy penalties if he made one up
The standard , among many other things ,stipulates that "an extension lead SHALL have the same rated plug & socket.ie10x10 or 15 x15
As you can see the authorities take a pretty serious view on such nonapproved /modified ext leads
Someofthe problems that the authourities see is the possibility of overloading the 10amp side of things possibly causing fire [it doeshappen]
Or depending on cable size,cable overheating ,xposed conductors & risk of electric shock
[2]The Ampfibian is a fully approved "adapter" it is not an extension lead
It has an inbuilt current limiting 10amp overcurrent cutoutso no part of the cable or 10amp side of the system can be damaged by excess current
To meet approval requirements it was required to be:
[a]water proof
have cable support & restaint to prevent 15aplug being partially withdrawn from the internal socket
[c]have means of supporting the devise itself so as to not impose strain on the 10amp cable & plug connections
[d] Have a 10amp current limiting devise[olcb]
[e]For those without a RCD fitted to their van , a further option of an inbuilt RCD
This is particular advantageous when using 10 amp supplies as there is a high chance that some of those outlets will not have RCD protection
Having attempted to research this topic further, I'm no totally and absolutely confused. [1]Are you addressing power boards with cut out switches? [2]Are you talking about extension cords? [3]Are you talking about 15 amp power leads to caravan/motor home etc? t[4]oo many abbreviations and other items have just succeeded in confusing me without a doubt. [5]Can you please clarify, with pictures and diagrams if possible to specify the equipment to which you refer? I'm not being a smart a..se. I just don't understand your description and terminology.
Hi Granny
Pleased to see you are genuinely interested
So will try to answer as per my previous& again ask further if needed
[1]The particular post regarding the RVMAA was in reference to their suggested use of power boards
More commonly called elecrtical portable outlet devises [EPODs]
These are those commonly seen in Bunnings etc in the Clipsal & Arlec range
Thes are ARE NOT approved for the specific use of connectinf a van to a pwer inlet either 10amp or 15amp
The reasons for this specific NON approval are many & complex
But they all involve electrical safety in THAT aplication
[2]Many consider that because they incorporate a 10amp current limiter [olcb]they do the same job as the "Ampfibian "
In that ONE sense alone they do
But they bring in many additional risks as in [1] above
So again are NOT approved for THAT particular use
[3] I am talking about ANY extension lead [plug in connection] to a motor home van ,tent etc
Generally referred to as transportable structures under the standards
[4]sorry about the abbreviations/
[5] If you google:
[a]"Amfibian " you will find the three complying devises
"Clipsal power board" you will see a large range, which while quite suitable for the purpopes they are designed for
Do not comply with the requirement for use in our situations
[c]Similar with "arlec power boards"
If you have difficulity with googling & I will find the links
Granny, I do not believe you are trying to be a smart a#*e
So keep asking questions but understand some of the reasons are quite complex & do require an understandind of electrics a little deeper than usual
In particular regarding the epods in the van etc situations
I just reread your first post re :"I have a 10-15 amp adaptor which I have used from the van to my aircon connection which is a separate in-plug"
IF I read that correctly your van has TWO power inlets
Naughty ,naughty girl"
The very reason the van has a seperate inlet for the air con is to meet the requirements of the standards.
Again the reasons are many & take up many pages of the standards
It should only be supplied by a seperate cp power outlet [15amp] no double adapters etc allowed
Now your's is one typical example[ one of about 12 possible misuses or other reasonsof why they are not approved ] of where the EPODs can be misused, by using one as a means of supplying THE TWO inlets
Peter
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Friday 19th of August 2011 12:23:15 PM
I am not trying to be a smart a** either but I regularly use a 15 amp lead (both ends) from my 240 gennie to my van for bush camping.
And I often use the same lead direct to my 1800 watt chain saw from the gennie am I at risk? By passing the van completly.
I have used the Gennie sitting on the rear tailboard of my Cruiser and cut timber well into the bush. The input plug on the saw is 10 amp. with a very short lead.
Every thing seem to work ok. and the gennie runs the saw very well.
Further what is an Rcd. and what function does it serve?
I am not trying to be a smart a** either but I regularly use a 15 amp lead (both ends) from my 240 gennie to my van for bush camping.
[2]
And I often use the same lead direct to my 1800 watt chain saw from the gennie am I at risk? By passing the van completly.
[3]
I have used the Gennie sitting on the rear tailboard of my Cruiser and cut timber well into the bush. The input plug on the saw is 10 amp. with a very short lead.
[4]
every thing seem to work ok. and the gennie runs the saw very well.
[5] Further what is an Rcd. and what function does it serve?
Regards Haji-Baba.
Hi Haji baba
[1]
No problem you do have a legal "APPROVED" lead
[2]
THAT is the correct way to do it.
[3]
It is quite ok to connect an appliance factory fitted with a 10amp plup top into a 15amp socket
The appliance itself is the current limited to < 10amps
[4]
AS long as the load is within the generator rating all is OK
[5]
A RCD is the correct term for what is often called a "safety" switch
It's purpose is to reduce the risk of electric shock to "earth' if the appliance developes an earth fault
Standard generators are classed as fully isolated & in that condition ,one cannot recieve a shock to earth with a sinle appliance with an earth fault
If an earth fault develops ANYWHERE that isolation is gone
This is the reason for the standard recommendation that ONLY ONE devise requiring an earth plug be 'CONNECTED at any time
A RCD will not function [including your van RCD]n the case of a 2nd dangerous fault as it is not correctly connected
YOUR van is that first appliance if the generator is plugged into the van power inlet
So each additional appliance encreases the potential for that 2nd dangerous fault to occur
A plug in RCD @ the generator ALSO gives NO protection
So use that generator & THIS INCLUDES INVERTERS with great care
A new devise [URCD] available can replace your existing RCD & will give protection against earth faults in the system
Very well answered, I now know where I stand particularly with the saw.
My wife and I do a lot of bush camping and We only rely on the Gennie, ( Honda 2 ) also the second battery in the Cruiser. It all works very well 16 foot Golf Van, excellent 3 way fridge, 40 liter Engle which most times doesn't leave the car when we are camped.
Quintrex Dart 355 tinnie, 15 hp. Yamaha, folding trailer, Can't get a better rig than that.
Some times travel light without the Outboad or Petrol Chainsaw, only need 18 liters of petrol for the gennie for 2 weeks in the bush.
Carry up to 120 liters of drinking water, showers and washing water from local sources. Electric pump straight from the local bore river or tanks.
Portable toilet.
Just had two weeks fishing boating on local inland river, water clear & clean & some lovely fish.
Have Fun Haji-Baba.
-- Edited by Haji-Baba on Tuesday 30th of August 2011 09:25:03 AM
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