Myrtle not sick - My mechanic states normal for her age.

Happywanderer · The Master

Myrtle not sick - My mechanic states normal for her age.

goinsoon · Guru

Sounds like he is bullsh1tting to you, we have nearly 300,000 km on our little 1994 Barina and it does not use a drop of oil

rockylizard · Guru

Gday...

Hmmmmmmm .... I am VERY surprised.

No motor can 'use' that much oil in such short distances unless -

a) burning it through rings or valve guides (blowing blue smoke);

b) leaking it from 'somewhere' (rocker cover, oil sender loose, oil filter loose, rear seal, etc) and that would leave oil on the motor and eventually on the ground. (and that would have to be a bloody loose item to lose it that much);

c) has an oil leak that only puts oil out due to 'pressure' when the motor is running - again, would eventually leak onto the ground and would have signs of having been sprayed around the engine compartment.

Given the mechanic had 'completely checked it out' prior to you buying, and the previous owner is saying "never had a problem when I had it" I think one (or both of them) are having a lend of you.

See what RACV can do (may not be much other than check it for you - at a price maybe) and see what their advice is.

I was thinking only last week while sitting at Murgon that I should have made the time to seek you out at Biggenden and had a look for myself - I am annoyed now that I didn't. (Didn't want to intrude)

And make sure you continue to question any explanations that you don't understand. Make them explain so you do understand.

Cheers and

John

-- Edited by rockylizard on Wednesday 1st of June 2011 04:10:09 PM

gordon_adl · Senior Member

This just does not sound right to me. I have driven some really old clinkers in my time and never have used that much oil. You'll go broke driving that thing. I really think you need to find a different mechanic as this person doesn't know what he's talking about, or even worse, he's taken some serious advantage of you. :(

goinsoon · Guru

Oh! and Marj, one thing I meant to suggest "change your mechanic"

Not trying to be funny, I really think he is not being honest with you

ken thomas · Guru

Hello Marj
Who is the mechanic that you go to ??
Ken

Happywanderer · The Master

I'm upset and I'm angry, what the heck is going on?
John, If I had known you were mechanically minded I would have come see you myself when in Biggenden. I had no one there with knowledge and was advised not to touch the only mechanic in town who by the way is the RACQ. Was advised better to go into Childers or Bundaberg for reliable feedback.
I was only just over the bridge from you and would have loved to have met you but the offer was never forthcoming so just walked the town every day trying to work out what to do until I decided better to just come home. Now it looks like I could have kept going if my mechanic knows what he's talking about. Is he just covering his backside as he did the initial check over before I bought it and took 2,000 of my money getting it on the road.
If I ring the RACV here it will be just to get her started (if she doesn't start in the morning) No use using them to find out what could be the problem. As I've mentioned before Our local RACV is in the office of the company I bought her from in the first place.
goinsoon. I said the same thing to mechanic that I have talked to many owners of old campervans and their vans are not using oil like this. But he said, they may have been better looked after over their lifetime, this one may have not.

rockylizard · Guru

Happywanderer wrote:
I'm upset and I'm angry, what the heck is going on?
John, If I had known you were mechanically minded I would have come see you myself when in Biggenden.
{Really sorry - I just did not want to intrude - foolish perhaps but that is me}
I had no one there with knowledge and was advised not to touch the only mechanic in town who by the way is the RACQ. Was advised better to go into Childers or Bundaberg for reliable feedback.
I was only just over the bridge from you and would have loved to have met you but the offer was never forthcoming so just walked the town every day trying to work out what to do until I decided better to just come home. Now it looks like I could have kept going if my mechanic knows what he's talking about.
{The mechanic is only saying "suck it up - it's an old vehicle" which is not any sort of an answer and he could simply do a compression check to determine oil usage - Cruisin' Granny mentioned it previously - a simple and first thing to do. It will certainly give an indication of the 'internal's of the motor such as rings, valves etc}
Is he just covering his backside as he did the initial check over before I bought it and took 2,000 of my money getting it on the road.
{I think this unfortunately could be the case - or he just thinks it is too old for him to bother}

If I ring the RACV here it will be just to get her started (if she doesn't start in the morning)
{Is it hard to start? You hadn't mentioned that previously. Is this just since you got back home?}
No use using them to find out what could be the problem. As I've mentioned before Our local RACV is in the office of the company I bought her from in the first place.
goinsoon. I said the same thing to mechanic that I have talked to many owners of old campervans and their vans are not using oil like this. But he said, they may have been better looked after over their lifetime, this one may have not.
{Well, then that shows the previous owner, for whatever misplaced reason, has told you some porkies as well}

Gday...

Added apologies here for not being more 'intrusive' .... I tend to not butt in unless asked. Now annoyed with myself.

PM me and let me know where 'home' is and I will see if my brother in Vic knows a mate in the general area. He, and me for that matter, are old motor sport idiots and have revhead mates all over the place. No promises, but maybe there could be someone 'independent'.

Cheers (and felt the slap upside of the back of my head)

John

-- Edited by rockylizard on Wednesday 1st of June 2011 04:46:29 PM

Nicholstones · Guru

Do you think it is worth complaining to the people who sold you Myrtle? After all, you were under the impression you were buying a van with a certain amount of kilometres clocked up, it turns out that in fact she presumably had many more. I wonder how she passed the roadworthy, I would have thought a working odometer was one of the required items. I know when we complained to Nissan that our (new) Patrol registers about 5% under on the odometer (when we have travelled 100 km the odometer only clocks forward about 95) they told us that the legal requirement was accuracy within 10%. If in fact she wasn't roadworthy then as a motor dealer thery shouldn't have sold her. Given all the run around you have had from the salesman and the mechanic, do you think a call to consumer affairs might give you at a minimum some leverage over these people to sort things out without it costing you even more?

Happywanderer · The Master

You are all being so helpful.
Nicholstones, unfortunaltey I got the roadworthy done myself with this mechanic as the car yard couldn't be bothered dealing with it. Should have seen the red flag there. Also you couldn't tell the speedo wasn't ticking over till out on the road and doing the 99999s then it took a while until the last one at Kingaroy at 195999 when it hasn't turned over since. No one would have known while doing the roadworthy.
And as the mechanic said today until you get out on the road and do at least 200ks you have know way its using oil.
John, I suggested a compression test, he came up with what sounded like a plausible reason not to do one, by this time I was sort of stunned and can't remember what he said. Something like it wouldn't be accurate or wouldn't tell us what we wanted to know.
Its only got hard to start since I've been home. Had no problems while away except the last day at Wyalong when in a hurry to get out of park as guys were in there wanting to fill in the potholes. A lovely guy in a landcruiser jumpstarted it for me after I flooded it.
Since home its started once, the other times does a couple of kicks and then won't kick right through.
Mechanic said that will be something simple.
Whats simple????? ME!!!!

Cruising Granny · Guru

Happy Wanderer, you are not happy, and neither you should be.
Your "trusted" mechanic is pulling the wool. I'm a "girl" and I know no vehicle should be pouring oil out of the exhaust pipe at that rate unless there is a problem with the rings and bearings. The fact the van didn't start tells me things have become very tight in the engine block.
Please, please get a second opinion. Chat to another garage just to run the symptoms by them. If they talk to you with respect and wisdom, then that is where you go.
The RACV will tow Myrtle to the garage where the work can be undertaken.
I know they have their accredited repairers, and if they recommend one of them, then that is where you go, as long as it's not the crook who seems to be conning you. In fact, if there's a serious problem with Myrtle he may be liable for the costs based on his previous work and his most recent assessment.
Don't let him con you based on your innocence in these matters. Believe me it looks like he's trying to take advantage of your trust.
This time I think it will pay you to be suspicious, cynical and skeptical all at the same time.
Please get another opinion, even if it's through the RACV.
At this stage it pays to watch your ass in these matters. You've already spent a lot of money, and I do think you did the right thing not carrying on your travels. The wisdom of 20/20 hindsight is all very well, but where was the offer when you were most in need?
Keep smiling.

gubby · Guru

Marj, when you take the radiator cap off what does it look like, ie just clean with water and coolant or do you have a white froth??

_wombat_ · Master (of Mischief)

Marj, you really need to contact the ACCC 1300 302 502 this is the info line just make that call NOW not next week,they will tell you what you can or cannot do.

also have a look here http://www.accc.gov.au/content/index.phtml/itemId/854467

Now promise you will make that call do not leave it too long

Vic · Guru

I agree with CG. This "mechanic" and I use the term loosely, was willing to take a substantial amount of money from you and now won't even run a few basic tests (which he should do for nothing) to see what the problem is. And to say "wait until you have the money" what a bloody cheek he should give you credit until you can pay after paying him so much in the beginning. DO NOT go back to him, he sounds dishonest and not to be trusted, whether he is your relatives friend or not.

There is something not right here and I think you are being taken advantage of. Even though the RACV has an office at the dealers you bought it from, they have to be independent and you can report them to the head office in Melbourne if they aren't. Even better still, can you take it to another RACV depot. If you are an RACV member, you may be entitled to one free item check, they won't fix it but will tell you what is wrong with it. Our RACWA do this as a free service to members. You can also ring them for mechanical advice over the phone if you are a member.

Of course if you want to have a complete mechanical and body check then you have to book it in and pay the fee for it. You cannot afford "NOT" to be a member of the RACV. Your membership also gives you reciprocal free call outs just in your state but also with RAC's and the NRMA in other states if your travelling around Oz.

-- Edited by Vic on Wednesday 1st of June 2011 06:01:15 PM

blaze · Guru

I typed this out and posted before and it got lost somewhere so here goes

If you change the type of oil in older engines it can make them use oil, this os a simple explanation on how. If the vehicle has done all its milage on a low detergent oil and the new owner/mechanic changes to a higher detergent oil it will clean the carbon deposits out of the engine. Well you would think this is good but it can also have the efect of making an engine use more oil, this happens by cleaning the carbon from behind the oil and compression rings and by doing that the oil rings will not do the job they were meant too. Most mechanics these days would use a higher detergent oil and if the vehicle was served by the owner before using a cheap woolies type oil this would be a cause. The fault dosnt lay with the mechanic is this case as he would have been trying to do the right thing. Back when I was mechanicing full time and was going to do an engine rebuild we would put a higher detergent oil in so the internals of the engine cleaned up easier. I have driven vehicles that used a lot more oil than your vehicle and just kept pouring cheap oil into them. There is NO additive that you can put in your engine to help with oil burn,

cheers

blaze

yeoeleven · Guru

Hi Marg,

the Hi Ace motors run for many 1000s of kilometres mine has over 250000 up and does not use any oil. It certainly appears that you have been given some poor advice from your mechanic.

Many members have given you their thoughts on the oil usage and I have to agree with them it is far from usual for any car to use that amount of oil so it is either leaking out and would be obvious below the van or using it whilst driving and that will again be obvious looking at the exhaust smoke and black around the tailpipe or contamination around the engine. Not the white exhaust when just started up and drying out the condensation.

Hope you can get to the bottom of the problem quickly,

John

rockylizard · Guru

blaze wrote:
I typed this out and posted before and it got lost somewhere so here goes
If you change the type of oil in older engines it can make them use oil, this os a simple explanation on how. If the vehicle has done all its milage on a low detergent oil and the new owner/mechanic changes to a higher detergent oil it will clean the carbon deposits out of the engine. Well you would think this is good but it can also have the efect of making an engine use more oil, this happens by cleaning the carbon from behind the oil and compression rings and by doing that the oil rings will not do the job they were meant too. Most mechanics these days would use a higher detergent oil and if the vehicle was served by the owner before using a cheap woolies type oil this would be a cause. The fault dosnt lay with the mechanic is this case as he would have been trying to do the right thing. Back when I was mechanicing full time and was going to do an engine rebuild we would put a higher detergent oil in so the internals of the engine cleaned up easier. I have driven vehicles that used a lot more oil than your vehicle and just kept pouring cheap oil into them. There is NO additive that you can put in your engine to help with oil burn,
cheers
blaze

Gday...

Good advice Blaze. However, it has been advised previously. Having said that, if the 'modern' detergent oil was used, giving the worn and gunky internals a good clean out, then the now clean, non-sealing rings would be burning the oil - blue smoke! He could at least have removed a couple of plugs to see if they were clean or gunky.

This is such a conundrum for HW - and I am dumbfounded the bloke would NOT do a simple compression check - geez, 10 minutes and it would have either shown the problem - confused him - or provided some confidence.

I am now a little concerned the motor is difficult to start. It had been backfiring previously, apparently under load up hill for instance, and now not wanting to start easily. It has to be timing, points or plugs. If burning oil, the plugs may be too gunked up to give a strong enough spark. If he removed them and found them gunky, a clean may solve the hard to start problem, for instance.

I am so p**sed off I kept me beak out of problem when HW was at Biggenden. But I can't undo that now blankstare

Cruisin' Granny's advice is very good HW - hopefully you can apply it.

Cheers

John

bill12 · Guru

It definately seems your so called mechanic is giving you a bum steer, and in my opinion you should go to an accredited mechanic and , if they say you have been taken, proceed straight to the small claims mob in your state. I have won these contests before. They usually start with mediation, and then to court.Don,t be scared-they are there to help. Have you tried the nulon oil treatment? I hope you fix your motor.

hammer · Senior Member

to burn that much oil through the rings or valve stem seals you would not see the back of the vehicle when following it, so when you look in the mirror you would not miss the smoke.The thing to look for would be an oil leak some where (rocker cover or rear main seal). As for the back fire look for a split vacuum hose, and last of all find someone else to work on your myrtle.

blaze · Guru

very simply if there is no oil leaks and HW advises as much, it has to be burning it smoke or no smoke.
cheers
blaze

Helena · Guru

Oh HW I really do feel for you we bought a really old toyota hi ace when we first started tgrav elling and we never had a problem with her using oil so I would seriously look at the advise you have been given on tghe forum and go for an accredited mechanic hope you are feeling better. Helena.

blaze · Guru

I would also like to point out it dosnt matter how many km are on a vehicle to wehter it uses oil or not. I have had to do oil/fuel burn ratios on $200000 new machinery to see if it hads excess oil consumption. Seen an old crown with 750000 km and never had the head off it or major work done, this vehicle only did 400km trips twice a week and no short runs. Personel HW I would drive your camper using cheap woolies oil and save up for a jap import engine. I dont think stressing, going to aca or even changing mechanics is to help. I think you should deal with the mechanic you have now, at least your sil knows him. Sorry if I dont say what you want to here but I have been clicking spanner for a long time, I also respect other people views
cheers
blaze

Happywanderer · The Master

So many replies, where do I start?
Firstly, have decided I won't be going back to that mechanic regardless of the friend status, made that decision tonight.
Now!! I live in Echuca.
Do I go to the Toyota dealership and use their workshop to get a complete checkup.
Do I go through RACV of which I am a member but they are in the same office as the car yard I bought Myrtle from, not sure if I would get a correct appraisal there. To go to another RACV would be nearly 100 ks away.
Do I go to another company of which I don't know. The couple I parked by in Moonie, he suggested I go to Repco ,I think it was, for a compression test.
I will try to answer you other questions as I go back through for a 2nd read.

Happywanderer · The Master

I will start with Blaze, I'm using 20/50 Caltex Oil as advised by this mechanic when I ran out north of Dalby.
I was advised by someone here a while ago about a higher number oil ?/70. I asked mechanic about that today. he said no way as it would be so thick it would make the engine force a thicker oil through and might do damage.
I will take all your suggestions on board and try not to stress about it. Your suggestion about a cheaper woolies oil is an interesting one. Maybe worth checking that out but with who.
I'm worried about going back to the mechanic as he really didn't seem to worried about any of it at all.
When I suggested maybe just getting rid of the van, he made the suggestion to at least try to sell it privately rather than trade in as I would get more for it and the buyer wouldn't have any comeback on me if things weren't to their liking.

Happywanderer · The Master

hammer, he did say today, if it was blowing smoke out the exhaust you wouldn't see it anyway when travelling at 80 - 90 along the highway as it would disperse before beihng noticed.
All hoses were replaced at my request when the roadworthy/service was done.

Happywanderer · The Master

Bill, I'm not sure about the nulon oil treatment, haven't looked into it.
I do have a nulon brand in the coolant I have or is it the valve protectant. One or the other, stored just in case under the back seat.
Which answers another question further back, yes the radiator has green coolant in there, not frothy and I am carrying spare just in case as told better than adding plain water.

Happywanderer · The Master

Blaze wrote "there is no additive you can put in your engine to help with oil burn"
So doesn't that negate the nulon oil treatment Bill mentions??

I am thoroughly reading all info given trying to make sense of it all and decide what to do.

DeBe · Guru

Hi HW, Some time ago i had a Ford Festiva to fix for a freind, it was intermittently backfiring, & been to 2 different garages who replaced spark plugs, fuel filter, & an expensive fuel pump & didnt fixit. It was left with me to sort out, found the distributor cap had carbon tracking betwean 2 points under the cap. Replaced the cap & nolonger int backfiring.

Happywanderer · The Master

Thanks DeBe, will have to make note of all these suggestions and take a list with me where ever I end up going.

Travel Bug · Guru

Hi Marj, I have been out all day so I've only just looked in on the Forum and read of your latest problems.

After reading all of the excellent advice you've been given...and noting that you have already decided that the mechanic is "having a lend of you", There isn't much for me to add but this....

I'm not a mechanic but my husband was a "car nut" and both of my sons are too....so over the years I have had my head under many a car bonnet. I was trying to think how many cars....from old clunkers to brand new.....that we have owned between us and there were way too many to count.

With all of those cars we never had one that chewed oil like Myrtle so I am glad that you are taking the poor girl to see another car doctor for a second opinion.

Just want to add that I am really sorry that you are having all of these problems and hope that they will soon be sorted.

Cheers for now. Pam.