Broken old Digger wrote:

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GDAY I HAVE A STOCK STANDARD 2017 D MAX IM LOOKING AT GOING BACK TO A CARAVAN TO REPLACE OUR MOTORHOME. GOC HOME FRONT [WIFE] LIKES TO HAVE THE ABILITY TO MOVE AROUND IF REQUIRED, CAN SOMEONE PLEASE HELP ME WITH THE FOLLOWING;

A. DO I NEED TO UPGRADE THE SUSPENSION THE VEHICLE IS FITTED WITH FACTORY SUSPENSION;

B. WHAT SIZE VAN WOULD BE SUITABLE; ONLY 2 TRAVELERS  VAN NEEDS THE FOLLOWING SHOWER, TOILET;AND BE SEMI OFF ROAD 

C DO I NEED A TRANSMISSION COOLER.

 

ANY ADVICE PROVIDED IS WELCOME PLEASE TRAVEL WIYH CARE ON THE ROADS, CHEERS

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 Hi John.The DMax is a great car and will cope well with a 3000kg ATM van.Tare is under 2 ton,so you've got a bit to play with,but rear axle is rated at only 1870kg.This will be the only thing you need to watch as 300kg towball weigh (10% of ATM) will put around 430kg onto the rear axle,having taken 130kg OFF the  front axle. Without any direct experience,I would suggest that a transmission cooler would be a good investment. As far as the van goes,there are many vans that would suit,but you MUST weigh the van before you part with your gold,as the claimed tare on the compliance plate means absolutely NOTHING. Check towball weight and weight on wheels separately and together.You need to be able to carry at least 400kg in the van if you're going bush,so tare is important.If you find a van that appeals,many people on here can give advice if you provide details. Where are water tanks? How many? These things can affect the "balance" of the van,as towball weight may change as tanks are emptied.You might like to consider hiring a van to go away in for a few days to work out what you and your wife like and dislike,see how it tows and how the car feels etc etc. To answer your questions 1) If the right van is chosen you won't need a suspension upgrade. 2) If you plan to go off road,keeping under about 20' would be good, and there are many vans shorter than that that have showers and toilets. Make sure there's plenty if water storage,or room to add tanks. 3) transmission cooler would do more good than harm. Good luck with your search,but always feel free to ask questions.The only silly question is one that you don't ask! Cheers

P.S On their own suspension upgrades do NOT increase carrying capacity.It also is important to remember that the universally accepted cure-all WDH cannot be used offroad,and generally causes more problems than it solves.Increased towball overhang increases the weight applied to the car's rear axle by towball weight,as well as the actual weight of the  WDH unit,bars and chains etc adding around 40-45kg to that rear axle before you even start. The DMax is a capable vehicle in that it has a long wheelbase and a relatively short TBO (towball overhang,or distance from rear axle to hitchpoint) so is not as affected by towball weight as are some lesser vehicles.A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. As I said earlier,your DMax will safely tow a van that has up to around 3000kg ATM. Good luck.

PPS I have assumed that your DMax is the 4wd model.

yobarr wrote:

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It also is important to remember that the universally accepted cure-all WDH cannot be used offroad,and generally causes more problems than it solves.Increased towball overhang increases the weight applied to the car's rear axle by towball weight,as well as the actual weight of the  WDH unit,bars and chains etc adding around 40-45kg to that rear axle before you even start. The DMax is a capable vehicle in that it has a long wheelbase and a relatively short TBO (towball overhang,or distance from rear axle to hitchpoint) so is not as affected by towball weight as are some lesser vehicles.A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. As I said earlier,your DMax will safely tow a van that has up to around 3000kg ATM. Good luck.

-- Edited by yobarr on Wednesday 29th of December 2021 04:44:41 AM

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 Yobarr sorry but what load of missinfomation and generalization about Weight Distribution Hitches.

As a user of WDH's for over 40 years and I have researched the correct use and setup of various types of WDH's and yes some are unsuitable for off road use, but not dirt road use.

A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. Your statement is factually incorrect, and can be countered by the fact that some manufactures actually require their use or highly reccomend they be used.

Gundog wrote:

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yobarr wrote:

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It also is important to remember that the universally accepted cure-all WDH cannot be used offroad,and generally causes more problems than it solves.Increased towball overhang increases the weight applied to the car's rear axle by towball weight,as well as the actual weight of the  WDH unit,bars and chains etc adding around 40-45kg to that rear axle before you even start. The DMax is a capable vehicle in that it has a long wheelbase and a relatively short TBO (towball overhang,or distance from rear axle to hitchpoint) so is not as affected by towball weight as are some lesser vehicles.A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. As I said earlier,your DMax will safely tow a van that has up to around 3000kg ATM. Good luck.

-- Edited by yobarr on Wednesday 29th of December 2021 04:44:41 AM

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 Yobarr sorry but what load of missinfomation and generalization about Weight Distribution Hitches.

As a user of WDH's for over 40 years and I have researched the correct use and setup of various types of WDH's and yes some are unsuitable for off road use, but not dirt road use.

A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. Your statement is factually incorrect, and can be countered by the fact that some manufactures actually require their use or highly reccomend they be used.

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 And we all know WHY some manufacturers require their use,or recommend that a WDH be used,don't we? If you don't know,you have not been following my posts over the last couple of years.My statement is not "factually incorrect" at all,but simply tells it how it is.Get a better car or a lighter van. The OP said he was looking for a semi off road van,so I simply alerted him to the perils of using a WDH in that situation,as washouts and dips in the road etc put an enormous strain on both the car and the van.You should,after 40 years,understand that a WDH creates what is essentially a "stiff arm" from the car's front axle, through the hitchpoint,to the van's axle group.When you cross a deep washout,and the rear wheels of the car are carrying almost NO weight,can you imagine the stress on both the car's chassis,and that of the van? Again I will point out that a WDH is used only by those who are trying to make a car do things for which it never was designed.Cheers

Gundog wrote:

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yobarr wrote:

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It also is important to remember that the universally accepted cure-all WDH cannot be used offroad,and generally causes more problems than it solves.Increased towball overhang increases the weight applied to the car's rear axle by towball weight,as well as the actual weight of the  WDH unit,bars and chains etc adding around 40-45kg to that rear axle before you even start. The DMax is a capable vehicle in that it has a long wheelbase and a relatively short TBO (towball overhang,or distance from rear axle to hitchpoint) so is not as affected by towball weight as are some lesser vehicles.A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. As I said earlier,your DMax will safely tow a van that has up to around 3000kg ATM. Good luck.

-- Edited by yobarr on Wednesday 29th of December 2021 04:44:41 AM

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 Yobarr sorry but what load of missinfomation and generalization about Weight Distribution Hitches.

As a user of WDH's for over 40 years and I have researched the correct use and setup of various types of WDH's and yes some are unsuitable for off road use, but not dirt road use.

A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. Your statement is factually incorrect, and can be countered by the fact that some manufactures actually require their use or highly reccomend they be used.

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 X2

I don't think that there's a vehicle made that doesn't benefit by equalizing the

balance of the tug. who wants their front wheels floating due to reduced weight on them?

Hard to understand the misinformation and lack of understanding in some circles

regarding WDH's and their benefits.

Brodie Allen wrote:

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Gundog wrote:

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yobarr wrote:

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It also is important to remember that the universally accepted cure-all WDH cannot be used offroad,and generally causes more problems than it solves.Increased towball overhang increases the weight applied to the car's rear axle by towball weight,as well as the actual weight of the  WDH unit,bars and chains etc adding around 40-45kg to that rear axle before you even start. The DMax is a capable vehicle in that it has a long wheelbase and a relatively short TBO (towball overhang,or distance from rear axle to hitchpoint) so is not as affected by towball weight as are some lesser vehicles.A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. As I said earlier,your DMax will safely tow a van that has up to around 3000kg ATM. Good luck.

-- Edited by yobarr on Wednesday 29th of December 2021 04:44:41 AM

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 Yobarr sorry but what load of missinfomation and generalization about Weight Distribution Hitches.

As a user of WDH's for over 40 years and I have researched the correct use and setup of various types of WDH's and yes some are unsuitable for off road use, but not dirt road use.

A WDH is used only by people who are trying to make their car do things for which it never was designed. Your statement is factually incorrect, and can be countered by the fact that some manufactures actually require their use or highly reccomend they be used.

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 X2

I don't think that there's a vehicle made that doesn't benefit by equalizing the

balance of the tug. who wants their front wheels floating due to reduced weight on them?

 Hard to understand the misinformation and lack of understanding in some circles

regarding WDH's and their benefits.

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 What ARE you on about? What does "equalizing the balance" mean? Most cars have a a transfer of weight from the front axle to the rear axle of about 45% (+/-) of the towball weight,so a 350kg towball weight takes around 150kg off the front axle of the car.A WDH will return around 70% of that weight (105kg) to the car's front axle,with the rest going on to the van's axle group,possibly putting the van over its ATM rating.Remember,a WDH DOES NOT change towball weight.If anybody really believes that running the front axle 105kg lighter is a matter of life or death,then you might like to consider that there still is 100% braking on,usually,three other axles.How do you think heavy trucks coped in Canada etc where they often had no front brakes in icy conditions to avoid losing steering when braking? As for front wheels "floating due to reduced weight on them",surely you jest? If taking 150kg off your front axle has that sort of effect,the car is not loaded correctly.Heaven forbid,if you've got two fat fellas in the front seats, they could weigh 150kg more than two petite ladies.With weight on wheels of 3650kg (GVM?),no WDH,my car has 1350kg on the front axle.How much more do you think I need? Cheers

yobarr wrote:

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 What ARE you on about? ............  

As for front wheels "floating due to reduced weight on them",surely you jest? If taking 150kg off your front axle has that sort of effect,the car is not loaded correctly.. ......

....

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I agree that 150kg does not make a huge difference. But you are talking about measurements when you are parked in the driveway. No need for a WDH then. At rest, a WDH does very little. Its benefit comes when you are on the open road and the dynamics of road irregularities impose huge weight variances.

In the recent thread about WDH that was closed (due to insults and bickering) a video was posted showing the front wheels of the tow vehicle (BT50 I believe) becoming airborne while travelling on the highway. Anyone care to think about what that would do to the tow vehicle handling characteristics with 100% of the weight on the back wheels and 0% on the front for an instant? Perhaps not a major issue when travelling in a straight line, but rounding a bend may be a totally different story.

OK, that is an extreme case, but you only need to tow a heavy van with and without a WDH to appreciate the benefit it provides. You can put lipstick on a pig with spring conversions and upgrades, but if that does not restore weight to the front wheels, they have reduced road grip. So you are travelling with reduced handling capabilities.

We have a 13' Golf 390 Savannah Maxxi semi off road van. It has a separate toilet room and a separate shower room. It has a fold out double bed and the dining table converts to another king single size bed. It is less than 2 tonnes and is very easy to pull with our unmodified Patrol Y62. We have been through some creek crossings and river beds at National Parks and it has worked well. Even though it is very small it suits the two of us and everything is within reach from the dining table.