"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by the way its animals are treated"

JayDee · Guru

Melbourne, the most livable city

Rob Driver · Guru

Melbournites and Vics in general are doing quite well in the area of new daily virus cases.

They have gone from 700 plus cases per day 6 weeks ago to 81 today. They are achieving great numbers.
It is a shame that within the community there still appears to be a group who are just hell bent on not conforming.
Unfortunately there are people such as a certain retired footballer and sports show commentator that is on TV inciting discontent as well.

These types are not helpful in achieving containment down to manageable levels.

I personally would not call Melbourne the most liveable city if we are comparing it with other cities in Australia. This is only my view as I have never enjoyed any visit to that city.

If the current trends continue with daily infections then a visit to family may not be out of the question by Christmas.

Keep up the good work Victoria.

Regards

Angie

Mike Harding · Guru

I have now had it!

I was supportive and I'll give them another few weeks maximum.

We had weeks of lockdown in March then the state government failed dismally at a basic task so we have had weeks more lockdown.

People are loosing their jobs, their businesses, their families to stress - enough!

We have a police state in Melbourne - silly young women being arrested for no serious reason, this is how dictator states work and we would be critical of North Korea for doing same.

Lockdown, I recall clearly, was introduced to "Flatten the curve" in order to allow the health service to come up to speed in order to tackle C19. Now it has morphed into eradication of C19 which is probably an impossible task. They have no mandate for that change in focus.

Mr Andrews and his party will *not* be receiving my vote next time... assuming, of course, he doesn't ban elections....

Enough!

boab · Senior Member

instead of blaming the pollies why not blame the nitwits that break the rules, we dont blame pollies for drunk drivers if every one had done as they were asked victoria would be as clean as wa is,i have always said west is best

Crinkle and Dobbie · Member

Totally agree with you Mike, it reminded me of history programmes showing people be arrested for disagreeing with the ruling party.

Keep safe, keep calm.

Regards

Julie

Mike Harding · Guru

boab wrote:
instead of blaming the pollies why not blame the nitwits that break the rules, we dont blame pollies for drunk drivers if every one had done as they were asked victoria would be as clean as wa is,i have always said west is best

Because those nitwits did not put themselves up for election and say
"Vote for me, pay me a big salary and I will lead you with wisdom and
competence"

When you have the confidence and arrogance to seek the role of
leadership you assume the mantle of responsibility too. With the
current Victorian government we have been badly let down.

Whenarewethere · Guru

Around Manly area more & more shops for lease. Even though we have the freedom to move, the public places are as empty as I have ever seen it.

I think businesses will try to keep going till Christmas only because of government handouts, but then liquidate. They are probably planning ahead for this now.

4 empty premises in a row on a main road.

SouthernComfort · Guru

Mike Harding wrote:
boab wrote:
instead of blaming the pollies why not blame the nitwits that break the rules, we dont blame pollies for drunk drivers if every one had done as they were asked victoria would be as clean as wa is,i have always said west is best
Because those nitwits did not put themselves up for election and say
"Vote for me, pay me a big salary and I will lead you with wisdom and
competence"

When you have the confidence and arrogance to seek the role of
leadership you assume the mantle of responsibility too. With the
current Victorian government we have been badly let down.

Mike, I didn't have the energy to respond to boab. I'm done arguing with those who don't get it, but I will support your attempt to put the record straight.

There's a definite pattern, wherein public opinion (especially that expressed from great distance) results from mainstream media propaganda. To be fair, I suppose that's all they have to go on, having no idea what's really happening here. Andrews has consistently blamed the population for doing the wrong thing and pushed it hard through the media. We all know that is not the case and the public remains incensed by it. We know full well it's an arrogant cover up for the govt's own ineptitude, proven time and time again. Fact is, the arrogance we experience daily from the Vic govt is being emulated in other states, two of them in particular are a real worry. Despite the smugness from some quarters I see more coming unravelled as time goes on, and I'm not referring to a virus.

-- Edited by SouthernComfort on Friday 4th of September 2020 03:19:01 PM

Recoup · Guru

Hard at Work Screen Shot 2020-09-04 at 4.54.38 pm.png

oldbloke · Guru

Some here completely fail to understand what happened.
Andrews told the govt department to arrange for hotel quarantine.
MSS was contracted to do the job. All gov contracts require that the contractor abide by the required laws.
MSS, Totaly FAILED to comply with the contractual requirements.(laws)
Andrews does not spend time checking if guards ar following procedures. The company is required to supervise them.

MSS management failed to do their job. BLAME MSS.

P.S. typical of most companies.

SouthernComfort · Guru

Nope, just wasn't that simple. No oversight, buck stops at the top. More appropriate options were on the table. We know what the indisputable facts are and the trail of incompetence is long.

vince56 · Senior Member

Disagree with you oldbloke, it was incompetence and lack of oversight by the great man and his sad team. Buck stops with Andrews. Anyway, back to the caravan and getting it ready for the next trip, although I might stay here in Melbourne for a while when things get opened up, it IS the greatest city in the world!

SouthernComfort · Guru

This thread will be closed soon, no doubt.

We are also looking forward to getting out, van is ready. But even more, like you Vince, we love our city and are more inspired than ever to enjoy every element of it and help its soul to return.

montie · Guru

oldbloke wrote:
Some here completely fail to understand what happened.
Andrews told the govt department to arrange for hotel quarantine.
MSS was contracted to do the job. All gov contracts require that the contractor abide by the required laws.
MSS, Totaly FAILED to comply with the contractual requirements.(laws)
Andrews does not spend time checking if guards ar following procedures. The company is required to supervise them.

MSS management failed to do their job. BLAME MSS.

P.S. typical of most companies.

Unfortunately the buck stops at the top....as it should!

Snail · Senior Member

2,292 trained healthcare workers have contracted COVID-19 in Victoria, why is it so hard to understand that a couple of security guards working with returning travels may also catch it,

thomas01 · Senior Member

Of course you blame the governments.

They were responsible for bringing in the virus in from overseas.
They were responsible for many of the quarantined overseas travellers flaunting the rules.
They were responsible for sending you to work while you were infected with the virus.
They were responsible for organising the illegal protests and rallies that many attended.

If you believe that, you deserve to get the virus.

When many of the public decided that the rules were only for other people and the situation started getting out of hand, they tried to force you to isolate yourselves. But you still did your utmost to do things outside the guidelines because you believed your case was exceptional. The rules are only for the "bad" people.

Well guess what. The virus does not discriminated between the good and the bad. Only between the co-operative and the ignorant.

The people of Victoria, of which I am one, got into this predicament because they thought it wouldn't happen to them. It did.

Stop blaming the government. Stop blaming anyone else. Do the right thing and you can pat yourself on the back and say, "We beat this". Otherwise we will still be arguing in another six months time about the same thing.

End of rant. Stay safe.

Robert.

boab · Senior Member

agree with you 100% what a great rant

Cupie · Guru

Same old rubbish from the same old suspects who continue to push their same old anti Labor barrow.

A large dose of double standards at play here ... eg.

Using the 'buck stops at the top' logic then SlowMO should resign for his mishandling of Aged Care Centres and of course the NSW Premier Gladis whatever is responsible for the Cruise Ship fiasco. They both should go, hey? No, hang on they're right wing so it doesn't apply to them, hey?

Perhaps we should get back to discussing caravanning related stuff.

Snail · Senior Member

I going to get my caravan and hide on the Murray and demand that the lock down in Melbourne is lifted.

SouthernComfort · Guru

No amount of comments or rants are going to result in any changes of opinion in here, much less achieve a consensus. I felt the op was genuinely being magnanimous in their opening post, but alas it was inevitable it would descend into the usual bog.

Caravanning, what's that?

thomas01 · Senior Member

Tony,

I find it strange that you feel this way seeing yours was one of the replies in this post to bring political arguments into the equation. A bit hypocritical in my view.

Yes, this is fundamentally a travel/retirement forum however members are entitled to voice their views on posts as long as they stay within the rules that the forum moderators apply. Naming and shaming politicians and others in public office should not be allowed. All sides of politics are quick to point the finger at the opposition and sadly the general public seems to have taken that same view.

Every person should take the time to think about the consequences of their actions before they carry them out and not blame others for any repercussions that they may not like. Yes, we all make mistakes and without them we will never learn, but to sit back and blame others who have tried to make change but may have got it wrong, is worse than not trying anything. I'm not endorsing either side of politics and for the record have never voted Labor in my life, but the governments during this pandemic have taken, without precedent to follow, what they believed to be the right course of action. If it worked they are heroes, if it didn't they are mugs.

For those of you who believe you could do a better job, get elected.

Robert.

Wizardofoz · Guru

One State is out of control wth the virus, the others are not?

There has to be a reason, either mis-management or, Victorians are a different breed with a completely different culture....it has to be one, which one is it?

Mike Harding · Guru

thomas01 wrote:
If it worked they are heroes, if it didn't they are mugs.

That's the way the system works, we do not elect the government most likely to fail.

bgt · Guru

If anyone wants to blame the PM for age care then please explain why it isn't a stuff up in EVERY state. Or if you haven't the answer just ignore the question as usual. The captain of the Titanic wasn't a hero because some lives were saved. He took his life because ultimately he was responsible even though he wasn't at the helm.

Rob Driver · Guru

JayDee wrote:
Boy!!! who would want to be living in the city of Melbourne today.
It certainly maybe a great city, but the pain the the population of the city is suffering is unbelievable.
We are hoping to be with our family in Victoria for Christmas 2020.
But!! looking grim.
Note!!! strange for me, but I have refrained from any political comment.

Our thought are with all Vics. for a speedy end to this drama.

Jay&Dee

Hi Jay and Dee

Maybe Melbourne will once gain be voted in the most liveable city but it will take longer judging by the attitudes of some who support the premature lifting of the lockdown conditions.

The ones who are still playing the blame game are missing the point in that the numbers have now come from >700 cases a day to 76 this morning.

I was the first to blame those in charge for the original lockdown not working in Vic when it clearly worked in most other states but in the interest of bringing the numbers to a manageable level the current process is proving with day by day positive results.

Why would anyone want to stop the process when there is a light at the end of the tunnel. It has all been said how we all feel for those businesses that are affected but if compared to the loss which would occur should the virus become rampant throughout the entire country, the current inconvenience is small.

If we did open all the country up again and let all the elderly die as has been suggested, has anyone stopped to think that when someones child or brother or sister or wife or husband needs a spot in a hospital due to an accident or other illness then those hospital beds will be occupied by those young folk who have contracted the virus on mass.

So then who makes the decision to let those with the virus suffer and possibly die at home while the bed is made available to a patient with another need. Will this then be the responsibility of the newly instated political leader brought to the helm by those who want the country opened up?

Our medical and hospital system will not cope if this is allowed to run rampant again.

While most of us observe that any lockdown is an inconvenience and yes, it may cause loss of jobs in certain sectors, the states can operate as a micro economy as has been shown in SA NT WA Tas and Qld. WA has not had one case in over 100 days.

There will be inconvenience but nothing like the inconvenience that we all all experience if we allow the virus to take hold.

Stay safe and stay home,

Regards

Angie

yobarr · Guru

bgt wrote:
If anyone wants to blame the PM for age care then please explain why it isn't a stuff up in EVERY state. Or if you haven't the answer just ignore the question as usual. The captain of the Titanic wasn't a hero because some lives were saved. He took his life because ultimately he was responsible even though he wasn't at the helm.

Won't happen Bruce....too much thinking involved for many.Once the 'Mob mentality' has set in,logic disappears.Cheers

Santa · Guru

Idiots like this don't do the Victorian cause any good.

SouthernComfort · Guru

Wizardofoz wrote:
One State is out of control wth the virus, the others are not?

There has to be a reason, either mis-management or, Victorians are a different breed with a completely different culture....it has to be one, which one is it?

Wizard, may I assure you there is no empirical evidence to suggest that the people of Victoria are a different breed to the rest of the country!

Snail · Senior Member

Victorian-owned public aged care homes, which operate under the Safe Patient Care Act. This act prescribes ratios of registered nurses. On the morning shift, one registered nurse is required for every seven residents; in the afternoon, one registered nurse for every eight residents; and on the night shift, one registered nurse for every 15 residents.

Compare this with staffing in federal government residential aged care homes, where a single registered nurse is often required to look after more than 100 residents. The federal government recognised the need to hire more staff in private aged care homes. It began promoting The national COVID-19 redeployment program, which aims to train a large numbers of unemployed people to work in aged care homes and the training required? A 10-hour online course. Considering the complexities of working in an aged-care home during a pandemic, it is inconceivable that someone with 10 hours of training is qualified to provide competent care. You simply cant learn how to use PPE safely in an online video

Not surprisingly, data from the Aged Care Quality and Safety Commission indicates outbreaks in Victoria are almost exclusively a federal government sector aged-care issue. State-owned nursing homes comprise about 200 of the 750 in Victoria, but of the 66 aged care homes that have reported a COVID case since June, just six are state-government run.

Rob Driver · Guru

Fortunately our country does permit elections that enable the people to vote with their pencil approx every four years.

Unlike some other countries which are really a dictatorship there are some that think the arrest of someone who is breaking the law is unjust.
Well anyone in a democracy who doesnt agree with a law can be arrested for breaking that same law.
Without law and order we would have a dictatorship.

Remember the shootings of the protesting students in China.......that is a dictatorship.
The arresting of someone who is breaking a law is the basic control of a democracy.

I for one would rather see an ill informed although pregnant girl be arrested than shot.

Anyone wonder why China has no cases of Corona virus? Think back to when they claimed they built hospitals in 5 days.
One may ask the question, were they really hospitals?
None of us may never know because China is a dictatorship.

Stay safe and stay home,

Regards

Angie