Water filtration in caravan

Regis · Newbie

Water filtration in caravan

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Do you want to be assured safe and nice to consume water wherever you go?

We do the following.
1. We add chlorine to all the water we put into or tanks. We do NOT filter it on the way into the tanks (the quality of the water in the tanks is of no consequence. What is important is what comes out of the taps). There are some bugs that happily grow in the tanks, in the dark. The chlorine takes care of almost all of these.

2. We then pass all drinking water through twin 10" filters. This filter is after the pump and before the taps. The first filter is a 5um sediment filter (it costs about $10/year to replace the element). The second filter is a 1um or 0.5um active carbon filter with silver (it costs about $30/year to replace the element). The carbon filter removes any residual chlorine.

The result is safe, pleasant tasting water from almost any source.
Cheers,
Peter

Possum3 · Guru

Peter, would you need to upgrade your pump? 0.5micron filter would cause difficulties with most pumps I believe.

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Possum3 wrote:
Peter, would you need to upgrade your pump? 0.5micron filter would cause difficulties with most pumps I believe.

Not at all. We use a typical RV style 12V pump. 10" filter cartridges have large surface area and therefore long life and relatively low resistance. They are also much cheaper and more available than some that are highly promoted for RVs.

Cheers,

Peter

Cadpete · Guru

G'day Regis and welcome to the forum. Don't forget to try the two ongoing games here - 'Who is This' in the 'I Digress' section and 'Pick this Place' in the 'General' Section - a great source to find new places to visit. Depends on your water sources and tastes - personnally we filter all scheme water, even at home! Tastes way too minerally straight from the tap!

Pete & Marion

Possum3 · Guru

Thanks Peter, The only reason we didn't fit one was my concerns re pressure.

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

When I initially installed them, I did discover that they needed to be on the outlet side of the pump (between the pump and the taps), not the inlet side (between the pump and the tank).
Twin 10" filter housings can be purchased for between $100 and $150.
Cheers,
Peter

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

At the start of every trip we empty tank . Fill about 1/4 full . Add two Cups of pool liquid chlorine. Drive around the bloke . Run water through system . Leave over night . Flush and fill with fresh tap water . We have a seperate pump and three filter system near sink for direct drinking water., I prefere not to drink water with added chlorine from a water that has already been treated . Maybe if it was from river out in centre ? We take Aldi bottled water for emergencies. Just be careful what goes in tanks . We treat once or twice a year often after not been used for a while ? Bacteria can breed in warm water .

Dougwe · Chief one feather

Welcome to the gang Regis, enjoy here and out in the playground.

I have been using a B.E.S.T. in-line filter just before water inlet on the aluminium teepee for ages and was happy with it. However, recently and as we speak I am hooked up to bore water and have a 10" twin water filter at tap, the first filter is a 5 micron Sediment Removal Pleated Cartridge and the second is a 1 micron Taste and Odour Removal (with silver) Cartridge. I then have the B.E.S.T. filter as before. Surprisingly I still get a slight funny taste and marks on the stainless steel sink so I am not drinking it, just using for all washing including me.

There is about 25mts of drinking water hose between the twin filter and the teepee so that could be the problem. I am going to hook up the other way around next time so the twin is just before entering the teepee, to see if that makes any difference.

Maybe someone on our great forum could advise here so we all know.

Keep Safe on the roads and out there.

Edit....I have just changed it all around and now have hose direct from tap, 25mts, then the BEST filter then with a small section of hose to join, the twin filter system. Time will now tell if it is better that way.

-- Edited by Dougwe on Friday 9th of November 2018 02:47:51 PM

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Aus-Kiwi wrote:
At the start of every trip we empty tank . Fill about 1/4 full . Add two Cups of pool liquid chlorine. Drive around the bloke . Run water through system . Leave over night . Flush and fill with fresh tap water . We have a seperate pump and three filter system near sink for direct drinking water., I prefere not to drink water with added chlorine from a water that has already been treated . Maybe if it was from river out in centre ? We take Aldi bottled water for emergencies. Just be careful what goes in tanks . We treat once or twice a year often after not been used for a while ? Bacteria can breed in warm water .

2 cups of pool chlorine is a huge amount.

The minimum dose (12g/L strength) is 5ml (a couple of tea spoons full) per 100L. of water. I typically use double that, more if the water is suspect, but I leave it in the tank and add the same quantity every time the tank is topped up. It naturally breaks down and disappears in a few days and its protection stops when that happens, so needs re-dosing on a regular basis.

It also breaks down quicker if the water is warm or contaminated. Warm water provides the ideal breeding conditions for bacteria and the water in RV tanks often gets quite warm.

Having chlorine always in the water is also important to prevent bacteria collecting and growing inside the fine filters. The silver does this too.

Instead of pool chlorine you can also use common household bleach (provided it has no other additives - usually cheaper is better). That is typically half the strength of liquid pool chlorine, so double the addition rate is required.

A good quality active carbon filter will remove all residual chlorine from the water.

Cheers,

Peter

-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Friday 9th of November 2018 01:41:17 PM

Whenarewethere · Guru

I installed a Stiebel Eltron filter at home. It is pretty easy to install, the most difficult thing is to remember to MEASURE three time which is quite challenging for us oldies! Each of the filters clips in so less mess from spilled water. Probably the most compact 4 stage filter you can get. They also do a 3 stage, without the carbon filter if you are really tight on space. The 4 replacement filters I last bought from Energy Hub in 2017 were $132 a set. I bought 3 set so I have plenty! Have been using this filter for about a decade now. The filters swing forward for easier clipping in and out for easier replacement!

Whenarewethere · Guru

Not to forget with chlorine once it has gone it's gone. You need to keep adding small regular amounts to keep everything under control.

Chlorine is NOT a once in and forget!

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Whenarewethere wrote:
They also do a 3 stage, without the carbon filter if you are really tight on space.

The carbon is the most important one of all. The sediment filter usually put in front of the carbon is simply to give more life to the carbon filter by removing some of the bigger crud before it gets to the carbon and blocks it up.

Cheers,

Peter

Tony Bev · Guru

Regis wrote:
Is it worth it?

Welcome to the forum, Regis

In my opinion, so I could be wrong
It depends on your future travelling destinations

If you plan to go mainly off road, then the system which Peter (Peter n Margaret), has described is a must

If you are staying on the bitumen, but mainly free camping, and getting water from town tap supplies, then what Dougwe has suggested is OK

If you are using caravan parks, all the time, then you probably do not require any filter

My own situation is that I travel about 50% of the year, travel on the bitumen, and use free/donation/low cost camps
Living in the west, I am use to travelling longish distances, and therefore filling with a lot of different town water supplies
I have the same B.E.S.T (Bacteria Eliminating Silver Treatment), filter as Dougwe
I drain and replenish the fresh water tanks, before I leave home, and that water is used for coking and washing
I purchase bottled drinking water, and use it only for drinking, some may see this as an unwanted expense, but I have yet to get stomach problems, while travelling

PeterD · Guru

Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
When I initially installed them, I did discover that they needed to be on the outlet side of the pump (between the pump and the taps), not the inlet side (between the pump and the tank).

I suggest they should also not be placed just after the pump. They need to be further down the line where they filter the town water as well. In some towns you need the carbon filter to deal with the sulphurous bore water.

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

Peter . Pool liquid chlorine in 300L to sterilise . We are not drinking it !!

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Aus-Kiwi wrote:
Peter . Pool liquid chlorine in 300L to sterilise . We are not drinking it !!

Chlorine is very powerful stuff. I suggest that 1/2 a cup would be plenty.

Cheers,

Peter

iana · Guru

After reading the comments here, and having talked to person who traveled up north, I am wondering about the idea of fitting a 10l container that one can buy from the supermarket under the kitchen bench. Then just using that for drinking water. These are sold for less than $1 / lt. Saves buying filters etc.

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Every now and again, we hear of people contracting Legionella infections. They often result in death. The most common source is from hospital showers where the water has been kept warm, not hot, allowing the bacteria to multiply rapidly. The infected water comes from treated town supplies.
The risk of Legionella infection is greatest in older people - us.
I believe this is a real risk in RV showers (we often provide the perfect conditions) and is reason enough to keep the chlorine levels up in RV water tanks.
The filters allow that chlorine (and many other bacterior) to be removed before the water is used, especially for drinking, cooking, washing up, whatever the water is used for.
Chlorination and micro filtration is not an expensive proposition. It is certainly cheaper than buying bottled water of any type.
Cheers,
Peter

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

Why HWS are 60* and have temp reg to drop it to about 50* to prevent scalding in shower . 60* kills bacteria. Yes why I treat good and strong to kill legionnaires etc . It happens in water cooled AC systems too .

PeterD · Guru

Aus-Kiwi wrote:
Why HWS are 60* and have temp reg to drop it to about 50* to prevent scalding in shower . 60* kills bacteria. Yes why I treat good and strong to kill legionnaires etc . It happens in water cooled AC systems too .

All very well in theory. Tempering valves came in only late last century. The regs were not retrospective so the older parks have not been updated. Most caravan parks date from well before the introduction date. Even with the newer parks with tempering valves, who says the owners have not fiddled with the water heater temperature. There were a few hospitals in Brisbane that die and killed a few of their patients with legionaries disease.

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

And often RV HW systems are not kept hot for long periods. Ours was not.
Having a HWS at 60C for half an hour won't do the job.
Having chlorine in the water constantly will. Problem is the chlorine disappears and needs to be replaced regularly.

A combination of chlorine and micro active carbon filters is a good one.
It is like many things in life. The chances of having a problem, at least in Australia, is quite small, but the consequences if you do have that problem can be very serious.
We used the same treatment combination of chlorine and filters when we toured places like Turkey, Albania & Montenegro in a MH in 2013 where the potential risks are much higher. We have never purchased bottled water, anywhere. In fact that is not always guaranteed safe in some places either.
Cheers,
Peter

Mike Harding · Guru

Some good knowledge in this thread.

I did a study about six months ago on purifying water and gained some good info. - a couple of things I would add to what has been said so far:

For the chlorine additive I suggest you use the product Milton at 0.5mL/L. Milton has been around for 100+ years for cleaning baby feeding bottles and contains only sodium hypochlorite and sodium hydroxide - which is exactly what you want. Most domestic bleachs contain additional stuff to make them smell nice or last longer. As Peter said; cheap bleach is your best bet but *check* the label to ensure *only* the above two chemicals - go Milton, it's cheap enough.

Note that bleach/Milton has a limited life - 12 months is a good time to buy new.

Bleach will not kill the Protozoas (Cryptosporidium and Giardia mainly) in any sensible concentration or time frame. Very fine filters (can't remember the size) will stop them but boiling is the only easy way to kill them.

CHEMICALS - water taken from sources in area where agriculture or industry is present may well contain chemicals from fertilisers, pesticides or God knows what! There is no easy way to remove such chemicals - neither bleach nor boiling nor filters will have any effect upon them. Take care from where you draw your water.

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

Pete D exactly the HWS needs to be Atleast 60* like the old systems . In houses anyway . Was explaining the heat killing bacteria. No shooting the messenger . Thing is most Water heaters in vans are instantaneous. .or not stored for too long . The warm water in storage tank is at ambiant temps . If left too long or not treated ? Bad news . I guess filling often with fresh and hopefully some active chlorine keeps system ok .

Dick0 · Guru

Hi and welcome Regis,

Yes, I think a water filtration system is worth it.

I fitted a single cartridge "Stefani" undersink 10" filtration system (from Bunnings) to the Dens kitchen sink. Comes complete and easy to fit. Need to drill hole in corner of sink to fit the supplied tap. Connects to existing cold water line under sink between "John Guest" and flexible mixer tap connector. Stefani supply a 5 micron carbon filter which I replaced with a 0.5 micron filter cartridge bought on Ebay (seller was "watercircle").

I use an in line hose carbon filter (sediment filter) when filling tanks or connected to mains, like most in the Playground do.

During the Dens annual hibernation time I fill the tanks and add 2 tablespoons of diluted granular pool chlorine to each tank, let it settle for a couple of days, open the drains and flush the tanks. Use this water on the garden so no wastage.

Result, clear and odourless sweet tasting water when travelling.

smile

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Dick0 wrote:
During the Dens annual hibernation time I fill the tanks and add 2 tablespoons of diluted granular pool chlorine to each tank, let it settle for a couple of days, open the drains and flush the tanks. Use this water on the garden so no wastage.

DO NOT use granular pool chlorine to treat drinking water.

DO use liquid pool chlorine or common household chlorine which is sodium hypochlorite.

Cheers,

Peter

Aus-Kiwi · Guru

Use it STRONG to kill overnight . 6 to 12,hours The mild strength suggested is for long term or left in drinking water . On dairy we used chloride of line washing the water tanks walls with brush . That was hard work .

Dick0 · Guru

Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Dick0 wrote:
During the Dens annual hibernation time I fill the tanks and add 2 tablespoons of diluted granular pool chlorine to each tank, let it settle for a couple of days, open the drains and flush the tanks. Use this water on the garden so no wastage.
DO NOT use granular pool chlorine to treat drinking water.
DO use liquid pool chlorine or common household chlorine which is sodium hypochlorite.
Cheers,
Peter

Hi Peter,

The active constituent I use is "Calcium Hypochlorite"...it is commercially used to disinfect drinking water.

The quantity I use is to disinfect the tanks and lines. I don't drink it but I could without harm.

I flush the tanks and then refill with fresh town water. From there on I drink the water via a 0.5 micron filter system.

Cheers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Calcium_hypochlorite

https://chlorine.americanchemistry.com/Science-Center/Chlorine-Compound-of-the-Month-Library/Calcium-Hypochlorite-A-Pool-Chemical-And-Much-More/

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

I am not a chemist Richard, but I did my research carefully when I established our protocols for travel and the chemists that I consulted were adamant that sodium hypochlorite was the chemical of choice. Clearly calcium hypochlorite will also disinfect water effectively (and it is the material of choice for swimming pools), so I am not sure what the differences are between the two from the perspective of treating drinking water. Maybe it is to do with the break down compounds that are produced?
Cheers,
Peter

Peter_n_Margaret · Guru

Today's news.....
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-11-14/legionella-detected-hospitals-nursing-homes-queensland-tests/10494278Legionnaires' disease is a severe and occasionally lethal form of pneumonia that people can contract by breathing in small droplets of water that contain the bacteria.Queensland Health said when legionella was detected, hospitals were required to develop action plans to reduce patient exposure and fix the problem.That included flushing the water system with chlorinated water, cleaning and disinfecting shower heads, and using temporary bacterial filters on outlets where legionella could not be eradicated.

Cheers,

Peter