Who's hiding behind the bushes?

Desert Dweller · Guru

Who's hiding behind the bushes?

Dougwe · Chief one feather

Gee DD when I saw that topic heading I was expecting to see Phil C or bigB (Bruce from Bruce and Bev) jump out from behind the bushes.

Maybe the people in the van thought the sign meant " no tents" Some could read it that way.

Not saying I would though disbelief

hako · Guru

To be honest I also would read the sign as 'no tents' - if it said 'no camping' or ''no overnight camping' etc then I would not stay there but 'no tents' just means no tents. I should qualify that by adding I might stay there if there were other vans there, but then again if I could get a caravan park for $9.90 I'd prefer that.
I do understand your frustration however.
Regards

Phil C · Guru

Im here Dougwe in good old SA, the best state in OZ...

This sort of stuff boils my billy as well, what happened to civil obedience and decency? It seems that today people do what they want and its OK till they get caught..

GGGGRRRRRRrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Rant over

-- Edited by Phil C on Monday 20th of July 2015 08:24:36 PM

rockylizard · Guru

Gday...

Perhaps they arrived very late the night before after a long day's drive - were too exhausted to continue - so just pulled over, well off the road, behind the trees, and hit the hay. confuse cry

Arriving late at night sometimes it is very difficult to see any 'signage' when tired and trying to just get off the road for some rest.

I know the rest area there - stopped many times ... for a cuppa

Cheers - sorry for being full of excuses hmm - John

Phil C · Guru

OK RL, im chastised...

TheHeaths · Veteran Member

I'm sorry, but to me the sign obviously means no camping. No excuses.

I agree that this sort of flaunting the rules is what does result, and will result, in more free/low cost camps being closed.

For goodness sakes, a $10 site has got to be a bargain.

I see this as the same as those dog owners who flaunt the rules concerning pets on the basis that they will probably not be back at the site again, so if in the end the park bans dogs, wwell doesn't matter as it won't affect them. This made Kathy and I so upset when we had our 2 little dogs, as it could be difficult to find nice pet friendly parks.

Phil C · Guru

Back to my rant...

rockylizard · Guru

TheHeaths wrote:
I'm sorry, but to me the sign obviously means no camping. No excuses.

I agree that this sort of flaunting the rules is what does result, and will result, in more free/low cost camps being closed.

For goodness sakes, a $10 site has got to be a bargain. Perhaps it was too late in the night when they hit town and the van park was closed.

I see this as the same as those dog owners who flaunt the rules concerning pets on the basis that they will probably not be back at the site again, so if in the end the park bans dogs, wwell doesn't matter as it won't affect them. This made Kathy and I so upset when we had our 2 little dogs, as it could be difficult to find nice pet friendly parks.

Gday...

I too strongly dislike those who flaunt the rules and camp in No Camping areas. However, I have also had to prop late at night after a long, exhausting day's drive - anywhere I can. cry

An example, I was at Kalgoorlie in 2013, had a call that M-I-L diagnosed with bowel cancer and having an op four days later - prognosis grim.

I hit the road - drove from Kalgoorlie to Sale in Gippsland Victoria ... 3,200Km in four nights ... about 800Km per day.

I drove until late each night, and propped behind gravel dumps on side of the road and any wayside stop that I could get off the highway. Stopped by 10pm each night and on the road by 9am each morning. I never saw any signage at any stop I slept at whether it was there or not ... I certainly was NOT looking, I just needed to get to bed.

There is no evidence these people are camping there ... they may have only been there overnight and gone in the morning - after the photo was taken.

Let's not be too judgemental without knowing any facts or circumstances. It may have been better for them to 'transgress' for a few hours than run off the road or run into someone else.

Cheers - again, sorry for my excuses - John

Bruce and Bev · Guru

Im going to be a fence sitter on this one )

The sign needs to be more obvious and simply have the printed words "no camping". I haven't yet met an overseas backpacker in their whizz bangs who don't know and understand those words.

But too many flaunt the rules of the local shires and councils (even if we disagree with them - Broome in WA being a great example with free camping banned) and this gives the big fish in very little ponds (council CEO's and councilors) the excuse they need to ban us altogether. In this case $10 a night for a council camp is surely affordable by all for goodness sake.

We recently stayed for a week in Showgrounds about an hour east of Wagga Wagga (given those in Wagga are so rundown and dirty). The show committee supplied quality 4 ply toilet paper and every night every single roll of it (there were 2 spare in each cubicle) was pinched by the cheap arses that stayed there - I cant figure out where the thieves and those who camp where there are signs saying not to get their rocks off. Are they really that hard up for money or just cheap skates who don't care about what happens to future RV users??

And Doug - if I jumped out on you, you would feel so inadequate that you would never stand in front of a mirror again - gotcha LOL

TheHeaths · Veteran Member

Fine John.

But if just propping due to fatigue, and having not seen any signs, why then appear to try and "hide" up the back behind the bushes.

I understand extenuating circumstances for things at times, but a great many people who are flaunting the rules, and giving reasons to councils to close sites, are just selfish and doing just that, saying the rules don't apply to me.

And camping, stopping or resting, the council obviously don't want people stopping in this park, and will not see any distinction between any of those activities. I do understand the distinction, but feel the difference is more applicable when in nominated rest areas on highways.

Anyway, too late to do anything about them now, and as I wouldn't do this, it isn't worth arguing about with another member of the forum.

03_Troopy · Guru

Maybe they were behind the bushes shielding themselves from roadnoise and headlights so they could get some sleep?

Hey Jim · Guru

Phil C wrote:
Im here Dougwe in good old SA, the best state in OZ...

This sort of stuff boils my billy as well, what happened to civil obedience and decency? It seems that today people do what they want and its OK till they get caught..

GGGGRRRRRRrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Rant over

-- Edited by Phil C on Monday 20th of July 2015 08:24:36 PM

Oh no Phil not again, Centrelink might think you are sending another coded message (Boiling the Billy / Cooking the Books) Your mincing your words again Phil. biggrin biggrin biggrin

ha ha wink

JackoFJR · Senior Member

Do you know when they got there , how long they were there .

Goldfinger · Senior Member

Who's hiding behind the bushes?....I guess you were if you knew they were still asleep....

Without knowing how long they were there surely they receive the benefit of doubt...in by a very late and very tired say 10.pm..pitch dark in unfamiliar territory...caravan park closed at say 6.30...don't see any signs in the dark.... quietly out without causing any disturbance to grounds or roads.. by say 7 or 8 am....
I just got a very curt "We're full" from Leonora Caravan Park....its dark...unknown grounds...much rain and red mud on roadside stops...we drive on for hours until we see Gwalia mine...and voila! we were lucky they had a free camping area above the mine...we were in by 10p.m. and out by 7.a.m. refreshed and not a road hazard for the rest of the day...so glad no-one was hiding behind the bushes...live and let live....aren't we getting too precious at times....if they are breaking/flaunting the Local Gov't Laws by remaining there..let them deal with it..let them receive a fine....they don't look like travelling vandals...my thoughts anyway....Hoo Roo

-- Edited by Goldfinger on Tuesday 21st of July 2015 12:03:52 AM

-- Edited by Goldfinger on Tuesday 21st of July 2015 09:52:43 AM

Desert Dweller · Guru

What's all this rubbish about arriving late after a hard days drive & not seeing the no tents signs!
The tent sign is a common NO CAMPING OVERNIGHT sign in VIC. It applies to all modes of camping.
As for not seeing the signs, you have to drive past 2 of the 3 to get where they propped for the night.
If you're the type that uses the excuse that you arrived late, organize your day better. Most of us are retired & don't really need to be in a certain place by a certain time.
Looking at many of the replies here is it any wonder that Grey nomads are getting a bad name?
It was a blatant case of STEALTH CAMPING.
They are parked right near the sign that says CARAVAN PARK 300MTRS ON THE RIGHT.

brickies · Guru

Some wont pay a donation so why should they be forced to pay $10 a night , I think you would find it's a game of how cheap they can live on the road and get all you can for free

03_Troopy · Guru

On our last trip out west last month, we were in the unfortunate circumstances of needing to be in a certain place by a certain time. Just on dark looking for a place to camp for the night, we passed 2 camps that were chokkers with grey nomads tucked up in bed. We made the unfortunate decision to push on to another one a bit further up the road, and hit a small steer. Killed the steer, but did minimal damage to the vehicle considering. It could have been much worse though. If they aren't causing a problem, then better off there than in the same predicament we found ourselves in.

Hey Jim · Guru

Desert Dweller wrote:
Took this photo on our morning walk today, they were still asleep.
Taken in Murrayville VIC. just a couple of minutes walk away from the small immaculate community caravan park that we're staying in is.
$9.90 per night for a powered site.
When are these morons going to stop giving the rest of us a bad name?
There were 3 NO CAMPING signs covering the whole area!

-- Edited by Desert Dweller on Monday 20th of July 2015 07:33:01 PM

-- Edited by Desert Dweller on Monday 20th of July 2015 07:35:11 PM

Come on Keith, Be Happy smile

This is Australia, There's plenty of room for one more in the playground.

I'm with Goldfinger on this one. We tend to travel offen into the night, as we travel up to 1100km in a day crossing from East to West. we are both still working full time an want maxium down time in our time away.( Yes we do take regular breaks throughout the day).

If it helps, Keith you and your misses are welcome to pull up at our digs here in the big smoke for the night (NO CHARGE) if you get caught short.

PS: No camera's please! we have lots of fun with friends & guests staying over, and respect their privacy. Enjoy your travels. smile

Regards Jim & Lambie

dING · Senior Member

Seems to me that the "Wowser" or "Stickybeak " culture is alive and well

Wonder what happened to the good ol Aussie culture of live and

Let live seems everyone is brainwashed in believing rules are made

To be obeyed cause rules are only made to be broken wake up to yaselfs

And do the right thing break a few rules and learn how to enjoy yourself

brickies · Guru

1100 KLM a day and plenty of stop must have a helicopter

TheHeaths · Veteran Member

As I said, it's not worth arguing over. I know that we have a range of views, and that is fine.

I just ask this. When does it become unacceptable to "break the rules"? What rules are acceptable to ignore? Remember, there are those in society who feel rules regarding shoplifting, stealing and violence are not reasonable. Is it ok for them to apply this logic!

Enjoy yourselves by all means, rest where it is ok. But if a community doesn't want you stopping in certain spots, don't do it. It is not us who suffer, it is those who follow.

And dING, I am awake to myself, and do not consider myself either a wowser of stickybeak, but I certainly don't need to break the rules to enjoy myself. I take responsibility that my actions could have an effect eventually on the regulations that affect others. Perhaps you could consider that the next time you decide to enjoy yourself outside the rules.

Dougwe · Chief one feather

Mmmmm, no camera hey Jim, the mind is running wild mate confuse disbelief confuse hmm blankstare

Hendo · Guru

If you obey all the rules you miss all the fun

rockylizard · Guru

Gday...

Again, clearly stated upfront, I do not condone camping in areas that have been designated as No Camping.

However, it does come back to the lack of a clearly stated, accepted and agreed definition of No Camping - by the authorities, in all their guises - as well as we travellers. cry

Let's assume the photo that has sparked the discussion on this thread had been taken at 4pm on that day. Let's also assume that van had been parked there since 10am that morning. Perfectly legal and, especially as they are parked completely out of the way of passing users of the rest stop, would not have raised the slightest ire in anyone's mind. In fact the locals would perhaps have welcomed them and assumed they were patronising the town.

Let's also assume that the van's occupants did not roll out the awning and/or set up a table and deck chairs, were they camping or resting? Six hours at the rest area - legal.

We are unable to determine what time the van first stopped at the rest area - in fact we do not know the time the photo was taken. So each of us are assuming the facts and circumstances from our own pious opinion without anything to base our judgements on ... that includes my own pious opinion.

This van has been parked completely out of the way of the area travelling users of the rest area need to access, and, from the "evidence" provided by the photo, did not roll out the awning and/or set up a table and deck chairs.

I have postulated earlier they stopped very late, tired and needing rest - saw the area, parked completely out of the way of users - and hit the hay.

Perhaps, these travellers were having some 'trouble' and 'limped' into town and will need to avail themselves of mechanical or other help during the coming day.

As most travellers know, van parks are rarely open after dark to travellers - this is especially so in small community parks where the caretaker may not even live on-site. We know nothing about the hours the Murrayville van park opens or shuts.

I have travelled through Murrayville many, many times. I am fully aware of that rest stop and have stopped there many, many times to use the loo and have a cuppa and a leg stretch. Sometimes I have stayed there for an hour - during the day.

Until this thread, I as unaware of a van park in Murrayville ... and have not seen the apparently obvious signs. I offer that most of us only see what we either want to see, or need to see.

Again, without knowing the facts and/or circumstances that had caused this van be to parked where it is, we should simply assume the best of people rather than castigate them for our opinion - however righteous we feel.

Cheers - and, yep, still apologising for my excuses - John

rockylizard · Guru

Gday...

Yep ... me again

We do not know the time the photo was taken ... perhaps these travellers had camped on the side of the road before getting to Murrayville and rose very early to hit the road. I've done that many times too.

Let's assume they arose and hit the road at 6am .... arriving at Murrayville at 8am ... and decided to take a loo stop and have another cuppa.

It's daylight when the photo was taken ... how do we know they were "still asleep" in the van? Was a peek taken through the window? Was the sound of snoring loud enough to hear? Could the lack of noise in the van be because they were over in the loo?

Again, without knowing the facts and/or circumstances that had caused this van be to parked where it is, we should simply assume the best of people rather than castigate them for our opinion - however righteous we feel.

Cheers - and OK ... I'll shut up now - John

Phil C · Guru

Hey Jim wrote:
Phil C wrote:
Im here Dougwe in good old SA, the best state in OZ...

This sort of stuff boils my billy as well, what happened to civil obedience and decency? It seems that today people do what they want and its OK till they get caught..

GGGGRRRRRRrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Rant over

-- Edited by Phil C on Monday 20th of July 2015 08:24:36 PM
Oh no Phil not again, Centrelink might think you are sending another coded message (Boiling the Billy / Cooking the Books) Your mincing your words again Phil.
ha ha

Bugga... caught out again..

Phil C · Guru

Hi again,

I can agree that if you are knackered pull over and have a sleep. There are, unfortunately, too many others that choose to ignore signs. eg red lights etc.

Cheers

Hylda&Jon · Guru

The way I look at it is if there are tables, chairs, awning out TV aerial up etc then that's camping but if they haven't gone to the trouble to set up then it's ok for a night as they have probably stopped for a much needed sleep.

Cheers

Jon.

03_Troopy · Guru

03_Troopy wrote:
On our last trip out west last month, we were in the unfortunate circumstances of needing to be in a certain place by a certain time. Just on dark looking for a place to camp for the night, we passed 2 camps that were chokkers with grey nomads tucked up in bed. We made the unfortunate decision to push on to another one a bit further up the road, and hit a small steer. Killed the steer, but did minimal damage to the vehicle considering. It could have been much worse though. If they aren't causing a problem, then better off there than in the same predicament we found ourselves in.

Just found the pics of the cow we hit.