Weight Distribution Hitches

Cupie · Guru

Weight Distribution Hitches

keiron · Senior Member

Cupie.

Am I stupid, or just plain dumb. I am sure that this video showed a "ball weight" of zero after the bars were fitted.

I always believed that one should have around 10% of the van weight as download on the ball. to help with road handling and stability.

Are you able to explain where I have gone wrong, please.

Cheers, KB

rockylizard · Guru

Gday....

Wry Smile.png

This could become interesting ... looking forward to how this develops.

cheers - John

Baz421 · Guru

Yes John,, it will be interesting,,, how to lose weight the easy way,, ????

KFT · Guru

I suppose what they may be intimating at is that the "ball weight" has been successfully distributed fore and aft by use of the WDH.

frank

rockylizard · Guru

KFT wrote:
I suppose what they may be intimating at is that the "ball weight" has been successfully distributed fore and aft by use of the WDH.

frank

Gday...

One MUST realise this is a Hayman Reese video .. these blokes are the ACKNOWLEDGED EXPERTS.

To some extent ....distributes weight from towball from rear wheels of vehicle to front wheels of vehicle AND to the wheels of the van. They omitted to mention the increased weight back to the van wheels.

I await for those much more knowledgeable than me ... but to have transferred 215Kg entirely confuse

Cheers - John

Olley46 · Guru

I was under the impression that the WDH does NOT alter your ball weight,is this wright or are these HR experts wright?

Lance C

Cupie · Guru

keiron wrote:
Cupie.
Am I stupid, or just plain dumb. I am sure that this video showed a "ball weight" of zero after the bars were fitted.
I always believed that one should have around 10% of the van weight as download on the ball. to help with road handling and stability.
Are you able to explain where I have gone wrong, please.
Cheers, KB

I too am not an expert on this subject, so I have posed your question to 'Outback Travel Australia' who published the article.

Should they choose to reply then I'll post it here.

I would have thought that HR who are indeed the experts would have checked the content of their video.

edit ..

If I had to have a guess then I'd say that if the jockey wheel was left in place on a scale, then before the WDH was fitted it would display a ball weight. When the WDH spring bar was fitted & correctly adjusted/pulled up then the weight is removed from the pivot point and the scale would move towards zero.

In my observations -

Before fitting the spring bars to the WDH the back of the vehicle sags.

After fitting the bars the rear of the vehicle is lifted back to normal. Surely this would reduce any measurable ball weight towards zero.

I seem to recall that there is a recommended allowable sag of around 10mm & the number of links pulled up is adjusted to meet this requirement. I suppose the this could be adjusted until there is no sag & therefore no measurable weight on the ball.

-- Edited by Cupie on Thursday 22nd of May 2014 11:44:23 PM

ozjohn · Guru

Some weight is distributed from the vehicle rear axle to its front axle and to the van axles.
Ball weight remains unchanged.
Ozjohn.

rockylizard · Guru

ozjohn wrote:
Some weight is distributed from the vehicle rear axle to its front axle and to the van axles.
Ball weight remains unchanged.
Ozjohn.

Gday...

I agree 100% Ozjohn.

However, these pics from the video are strangely interesting -

WDH 02.JPG

Hopefully Cupie's query to the publisher of this video "Outback Traveller Australia" will shed some light. Perhaps Hayman Reese need to provide comment.

[edit: Spent some time Googling. Cannot find an actual Hayman Reese produced video - this one is copyright Outback Traveller Australia. I did find that the presenter in this video is Gary Gardiner, Hayman Reese Technical Towing Expert. So does this mean HR WDH does completely remove the weight from the ball?]

Cheers - John

-- Edited by rockylizard on Friday 23rd of May 2014 09:58:29 AM

Cupie · Guru

As promised, here is the response that I got from "Outback Traveler' to my question about the ball weight becoming Zero.

........................................................................................................................................................

Graham,

The torsion bars act by rotating the tow bar in side elevation, thus transferring most of the weight from the ball to the front axle of the tow vehicle. The effective weight on the ball is then near to or actual zero. We know that zero ball weight isnt desirable without weight distribution bars, but the bars act to tie the tow vehicle and trailer together, reducing the normal wandering effects of zero ball weight.

The rotating force of the bars needs to be kept within limits, because over-tensioning of heavy bars has been known to tear the towbar and rear chassis out of some vehicles.

Cheers,

Allan Whiting

...................................................................................................................................................

ozjohn · Guru

A WDH distributes some weight from the tow vehicle rear axle to the front axle and to the van axle(s).
Ball weight remains unchanged.
Cheers, Ozjohn.

spinjohn · Member

Hi, I will suggest some thing here which may cause a stir. I contend that if you had a load cell which was able to be placed on the actual tow ball and measure the load between it and the hitch you would see an increase when the WDH bars are tensioned up.

The WDH bars stick out and are used as a fulcrum to lift the rear of the vehicle and transfer weight back onto the front axle, but they have to use the A frame of the van to get this purchase, so pulling the A frame (hitch) onto the ball and in addition to the physical hitch weight (ball weight) from the loading of the van, gas bottles etc.

Think about it ?

ozjohn · Guru

It's basic physics. The only way to reduce mass is to remove some of that mass.
A WDH actually increases the force between the coupling and the ball, but the mass remains constant.
Anyone who's really convinced that a WDH can reduce ball weight should set themselves up a weight loss clinic.
If it really works you'll make a fortune and be the worlds wealthiest person.
All you'll have to do is sit overweight people on the trailer Drawbar, engage the WDH, and they'll weigh less. Even zero.
I think not.
Ozjohn.

spinjohn · Member

Ozjohn agreed.

Simply put if you have 200kg acting down on the ball and lifting your vehicle nose, you need 200kg force up from the ball to compensate, so possibly 400kg between ball and coupling. !

John.

PJK · Senior Member

Looks like Ozjohn and Spinjohn have this sorted out.
The video probably had a load cell under the jockey wheel, measuring the weight transferred to the ground.
When they tightened the WDH, they effectively created a bridge over the area, removing the weight under the jockey wheel and transferring it to the front wheels of the tug, and the rear wheels of the van.

If you actually had the load cell between the ball and the coupling, the weight at that point would have increased.

Peter
PJK

ozjohn · Guru

PJK wrote:
Looks like Ozjohn and Spinjohn have this sorted out.
The video probably had a load cell under the jockey wheel, measuring the weight transferred to the ground.
When they tightened the WDH, they effectively created a bridge over the area, removing the weight under the jockey wheel and transferring it to the front wheels of the tug, and the rear wheels of the van.

If you actually had the load cell between the ball and the coupling, the weight at that point would have increased.

Peter
PJK

Correct Peter, but between the ball and the coupling is an increase in pressure produced by the force applied by the application od the WDH, not an increase in weight.

Cheers, ozjohn. wink

PJK · Senior Member

ozjohn wrote:
PJK wrote:
Looks like Ozjohn and Spinjohn have this sorted out.
The video probably had a load cell under the jockey wheel, measuring the weight transferred to the ground.
When they tightened the WDH, they effectively created a bridge over the area, removing the weight under the jockey wheel and transferring it to the front wheels of the tug, and the rear wheels of the van.

If you actually had the load cell between the ball and the coupling, the weight at that point would have increased.

Peter
PJK
Correct Peter, but between the ball and the coupling is an increase in pressure produced by the force applied by the application od the WDH, not an increase in weight.
Cheers, ozjohn.

Damn - mixed up my terms again. furious biggrin biggrin

You are correct Ozjohn.

"I know what I thought I meant, but I am not sure you heard what I think I said."

Can't remember who said that, but it sort of suits the situation.

PJK