"The problem with doing nothing is not knowing when you're finished" - Benjamin Franklin

Sheba · Guru

An Idea On Free Camping.

DandS · Senior Member

valnrob wrote:
I'm not sure I like to be told, " you have to stay at A Before you can stay at B" I think I would drive out of that town and stay at C if I so desired.

Agree with you.

Im going out on a limb here, but where does it stop. "Oh, sorry you cant buy fuel here unless you spend $20 in the local grocery store or hotel". Extreme I know.

I understand that cp owners invest $$$ in their parks, but ultimately they are in business to make money.

If I found I could not camp somewhere, unless I had to stay and pay at another place first. I wouldn't go there.

That vehicle, Val & Rob, that you would see behind you, would be us.

-- Edited by DandS on Tuesday 19th of February 2013 11:24:55 PM

herbie · Guru

I cannot for the life of me see how this idea would work, if we lived in a perfect world maybe !!! but sadly we don't live in that kind of world. Just say i get to x town, and have to stay in Mr xs c/ park , him knowing i am only staying in his c/ park for the night ,as i want to stay in the free camp over looking the ocean down the road , The fee for the night at the park would be inflated no doubt as if i don't stay there i don't get my permission to stay at the free camp .The other question is who would inforce all this.???? It would be like Big Brother watching over us all, and I recon we have enough in our life already.

-- Edited by herbie on Tuesday 19th of February 2013 11:47:47 PM

DandS · Senior Member

Boothie wrote:
Thats no idea, it is a way to print money for some individual who is a money grubbing sod. Had the same sort of experience in motel in Ouyen the other night. On checkout, they found out we had used the double bed and single bed for two people in a double room. Why put two beds in a double with older people when there is a chance that they can't sleep in the same bed because of recent surgery, a medical condition or the simple fact that drive has given us both the S?#t$!
Cost us an extra $15 on a lousy motel room with beds that were uncomfortable in a substandard room that cost us $125. Over priced room for a two bit town that could not even provide us with decent meal! The motel also did not provide the chance of breakfast, apparently they do not provide breakfasts on weekends! $140 dollars very badly spent
Why is it that all these money grubbing sods suggest these things?

That stinks!!!!!!!!!!, I wonder what would have happened if they only had two single beds and you both used one. I damm sure they wouldn't give you $15.00 off.

Maybe when the motel starts to go bust, they should fight to have caravan parks shutdown so they can have a monopoly and a steady flow of people to rip off.

Im not anti CPs, and have probably travelled a lot less than some of you. I have met some great Cp operators, and have returned to them.

Then there are the others, (like the one that another GN metioned, elsewhere), who says he was called a "freeloader" and a "bludger", while freecamping.

What a terrific way to promote your business. Treat the free campers like they are sh#t and less than, shut down or restrict free camping, create a monopoly, and then expect us freeloaders and bludgers to flock to their park, spend money and expect us people to be grateful. I for one wouldnt.

-- Edited by DandS on Wednesday 20th of February 2013 01:19:06 AM

NeilandRaine · Guru

Ok talking to a mate today the subject of the war between caravan parks and free spots came up.

Now thinking as both a caravan park manager and a grey nomad I made the following sugestion and now I wonder what others think.

An area has both a caravan park and a free camp close by....... Blue Water north of Townsville comes to mind. What if the local chamber of comerce

decided that the only way you can free camp in the area is to first spend a night in the local caravan park. Lets say for one night in the caravan park you can stay a maximum

of three days in the local free camp. Probably put a maximum of six days in the free camp after two days in a park.

I am sure a lot will say this isnt a good idea but to me it is a lot of give and take. I have often heard the argument that free campers spend up in the towns they camp at

on meals, groceries etc. All this means is your spending a little more with a local trader.

What do you think?

neilnruth · Guru

I think the idea has merit but also think a lot would feel frustrated at having to set up camp twice.

valnrob · Guru

I'm not sure I like to be told, " you have to stay at A Before you can stay at B" I think I would drive out of that town and stay at C if I so desired.

Happywanderer · The Master

valnrob wrote:
I'm not sure I like to be told, " you have to stay at A Before you can stay at B" I think I would drive out of that town and stay at C if I so desired.

Me too!

Patto44 · Senior Member

Happywanderer wrote:
valnrob wrote:
I'm not sure I like to be told, " you have to stay at A Before you can stay at B" I think I would drive out of that town and stay at C if I so desired.
Me too!

And us!! Does that mean I can only use the freeway if I go on the toll road first?????

Baz421 · Guru

A factual experience to consider before I answer the original post;

It was 2009 VERY hot weather in SA on Eyre Peninsula,,,, 11 or so vans in free camping area near beach,,,,,,, we all clicked and had a ball,,, we all stayed about 11 days until the heatwave was over.

Discussed what could have been if no free camp. MOST said they would have spent 1 night in CP in Cowell (nearby town) and left and maybe spend a minimal amount in supermarket.

However over the 11 days we spend money at service station (diesel/petrol/2 stroke/fishing bait), supermarket, pub and lunches and coffees all over town (say 2-3 trips into town in 11 days for sighseeing etc etc), some had outboard spares sent in and other numerous expenditure in town.

Lets look at the $ for the town. If we all stayed 1 night at CP say $330 injected into CP and say $240 into supermarket etc.

HOWEVER over the 11 days we discussed what was spent and it was in the region of $9000- $11000, because we liked the place AND the people were so friendly, AND when we left we topped up fuel and supplies.

So in this instance you can see the $ value to a cross section of businesses.

I'm not anti CP so don't get me wrong but the buying power of GN's is very good and we try to support small businesses in small towns ESPECIALLY when they are friendly toward you in return and provide good service.

So I think there is a message here for all in that the economy is not just a CP in a town but a host of things for GN's to experience and if the experience is good then the rewards flow back into the local economy.

Back to the original post - I don't support this form of "if you do this,,, you can then do something else",,, imagine the problems,, ie: 10 vans for 1 night in a regulated CP and they all go to the free site for their 3 days at the same time. Next night 10 vans in CP and then you all of a sudent have 20 vans entitled to use free camp???? Seems impracticable to me.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Cheers Baz

justcruisin01 · Guru

If you are just travelling through & only want one night then what?

I think Baz said it well, IF all stayed at the c/park for the same period just how much of that would the park owner put back into the town? vers that amount of money distributed around several business to redistrubite into the town, as in rates/employment/ business & private vehicles/ & general cost of living by all their staff.

No matter how we look at it the parks seem to want it all, they are the push to close the rest areas & if we all turned up on their doorstep there is no way they can accomadate all of us as many are now full with workers.

A town cannot survive if only one business collects all the funds, the rest go broke & the place dies.

JC

gordon_adl · Senior Member

We have both a cp and free camping available in my town. In fact we have two free camps available. I find merit in both who stay. Both groups contribute to local business. The only thing that annoys me is that there are a few who overstay in the freecamps. There is very clear signage stating 3 nights. The reason why I get annoyed at people who overstay is it's not fair to keep a beachfront view free of charge for longer than invited and thus prevent others from getting that same view. With that said, there are a few clever ones who will stay 3 days at one site, then move down the road to the other site and then come back to the orginal site after a few days. Don't have any problems with that as it's technically within the rules.

Baz421 · Guru

gordon_adl wrote:
We have both a cp and free camping available in my town. In fact we have two free camps available. I find merit in both who stay. Both groups contribute to local business. The only thing that annoys me is that there are a few who overstay in the freecamps. There is very clear signage stating 3 nights. The reason why I get annoyed at people who overstay is it's not fair to keep a beachfront view free of charge for longer than invited and thus prevent others from getting that same view. With that said, there are a few clever ones who will stay 3 days at one site, then move down the road to the other site and then come back to the orginal site after a few days. Don't have any problems with that as it's technically within the rules.

Hi Gordon. In your example above I would not normally overstay,,, however I pose a question,,, what if no one else wanted the site would you stay????? I probably would push my luck and stay as logic says laws/rules SHOULD be flexible OR flexibly interpreted.

gordon_adl · Senior Member

I would not stay in the same site past posted signage. I consider myself a guest when I find free camping. I'm very happy when we get it however I also don't mind paying cp fees if there aren't any free camping options. In this particular situation, I'd move as you wouldn't really know if someone wants that site or not. One may stay and then if someone else drove in just to check it out, they may see someone else there and decide not to stay. I agree with you, i wouldn't over stay purely on the basis that rules are there for a reason.

Frog53 · Veteran Member

Exactly that - FREE - some of the best spots are free and you meet some beautiful people. Don't get me wrong I am not anti caravan park, we live on the road full time and I am nursing my wife but we just can't afford to stay in caravan parks full time. We have stayed in some really nice parks, Gulargambone, NSW comes to mind, if you are passing through stay and enjoy the welcome and tranquility, it is beautiful. We have stayed in the ACT at $45.00 a night and it is the pits compared to $22.00 a night for better services - if you are holidaying what the ?, but if you are full time you live within your means. As for councils supposedly winging about free camping or caravan parks winging about people free camping near there caravan park, well I'm sorry I will just give you a big wide berth and go were we and our $'s are welcome, there is plenty of word of mouth around or internet to help keep our cost down, I have driven on a short day 38KLm's and on a long day 670 klm's so I have no problem in bypassing towns that are not RV friendly, think about that - RV Friendly, it says it all and yes there are plenty of them out there.

David and Cheryl

Frogs on the pond

Esperian · Senior Member

Sheba wrote:
No way !!!!!!
I would definitely by-pass the whole area. Surely there are enough travellers who prefer to stay in C-parks ? Not every-one likes to Free-camp.
Cheers,
Sheba.

-- Edited by Sheba on Tuesday 19th of February 2013 08:01:50 PM

I fully agree...

I,d be gone myself as soon I came, heading to more friendly place, where I'd feel more welcomed.

If I'm staying any place, I must spend on fuel and other provisions, repairs, etc. This helps a local business in general. I hate to be to told, if, or what I can or can't, should or shouldnt, or must or musn't do.

Boothie · Senior Member

Thats no idea, it is a way to print money for some individual who is a money grubbing sod. Had the same sort of experience in motel in Ouyen the other night. On checkout, they found out we had used the double bed and single bed for two people in a double room. Why put two beds in a double with older people when there is a chance that they can't sleep in the same bed because of recent surgery, a medical condition or the simple fact that drive has given us both the S?#t$!

Cost us an extra $15 on a lousy motel room with beds that were uncomfortable in a substandard room that cost us $125. Over priced room for a two bit town that could not even provide us with decent meal! The motel also did not provide the chance of breakfast, apparently they do not provide breakfasts on weekends! $140 dollars very badly spent

Why is it that all these money grubbing sods suggest these things?

vk6tnc · Guru

The argument that you cant
freedom camp because
theres a caravan park within
X-kilometres is akin to saying
you cant picnic in a park
because theres a cafe across
the road.

Quoted from www.imotorhome.com.au

buffy61 · Senior Member

It sounds the answer to cp owners but to those of us that hit the road for the freedom to go where we like when we like...nah! Nobody is going to tell me I HAVE to stay one night somewhere before I can camp for free up the road. In all likelihood, we will stay in cp on occasion, but it will be on OUR terms and when we want to!

Boothie · Senior Member

I agree with vk6tnc and I would also add shove your money grubbing idea where the sun does not shine.

GaryKelly · Guru

Did you know that bikers wear their boots to bed? Well, the bikers in the next room at a hotel in Walcha did. It cost $30 for a sleepless night because the bikers (drunk) kept going to the loo in their boots... up and down the hall all night. Clump, clump, clump. When I checked the loo in the morning, it looked like they'd been swinging their willies around. The showers were also a disgrace. To make it worse, I asked a drinker at the bar the previous night if there was a decent feed in town. There was only one place open. The local chew and spew. "They serve good meals there," he said. Yeah, right. I barely ate any of it. Even then I went back to my room and emptied what I did eat into the sink. Ew! I tried to force it all down the plug hole but it got stuck in the S bend hehe, and the water kept overflowing. I guess it cost the pub $30 to fix the plumbing. Even so, it was cheaper than Boothie's motel room. I can't believe it cost them $140. Traveller beware, methinks. They're out to gitcha. Sorry if this comment is off topic but Boothie's remarks got me going.

As to staying in a CP one night in exchange for 3 nights at a free camp, the idea is flawed for all the reasons previous posters have outlined.

Golddetectornomad · Senior Member

Neiland Raine, what about coming up with an idea on how to attract clients to the Caravan Park....so they actually WANT to stay there rather than try and force them to stay there. As a former seller of Caravan Parks I am acutely aware of how many overnight sites are being reduced so extra cabins can be installed as soon as the owners have the financial ability to do so....when will the majority of Caravan Park operators work out they should actually offer what the paying public want and not what they simmply want to offer?...many Parks are overcapitalised with ""attractions"" that the majority dont seek or need,that's your problem not ours following poor business decisions....here's an idea for starters...set aside an area in your hallowed Parkls that is secure has all weather access to it....AND NOTHING ELSE... and price it accordingly.....you would be amazed which area was filled.....and which remains with poor occupancy percentage on yearly basis....hardly rocket science....move with the times..the times are, most RV's are now self contained meaning theyno longer need your facilities until they chose to..I dont need your swimming pool and kids play grounds..etc....
Whats this supposed "war" you mention between Caravan Parks and Free Camping its only those with their own Agendas that call it free camping...surely any "war" should be between those competing for the paying overnight accomodation...Motels, Hotels, Caravan Parks which are now actually cabin parks with some Caravan sites set aside at this stage before they too are filled with cabins.....something has to give....and I can tell you this....masses of Independant living RV's with Baby Boomers intent on enjoying the best Australia has to offer while we still can and before the beaureaucrats remove it progressively from our grasp....will continue to put pressure on a system that will not adapt to the changing demographics...Caravan Park cartels change your business plans....or go the way of many Australian Companys that no longer exist because they did not know HOW to compete....you will not be protected any longer...we will now allow it......Hoo Roo and have a nice day ya'll......

P.S. I'll stay in the Independant stay areas first then I will consider staying with you after depending on your tariff and hospitality....

-- Edited by Golddetectornomad on Wednesday 20th of February 2013 09:29:56 AM

vk6tnc · Guru

DandS wrote:
What a terrific way to promote your business. Treat the free campers like they are sh#t and less than, shut down or restrict free camping, create a monopoly, and then expect us freeloaders and bludgers to flock to their park, spend money and expect us people to be grateful. I for one wouldnt.

-- Edited by DandS on Wednesday 20th of February 2013 01:19:06 AM

You get what you pay for when free camping. Therefore a CP should offer something you can't get at a free camp. Piping hot showers and immaculately clean toilet and kitchen facilities, grassed well kept grounds and maybe a pool to relax in. The CP should give us a sense of security too, so we don't worry about something that goes bump in the night. The staff should treat us well because we are their only source of income.

If our stay is a pleasurable one, and we believe we got value for money, then word of mouth advertising would be better than anything the CP owner could pay for.

Unfortunately some CP owners believe their business should be protected, maybe they should sell up and buy a video library, something that is guaranteed to fail !!!

wasn_me · Guru

gordon_adl wrote:
I really can't understand some of the remarks made towards cp's. The amazing level of animosity displayed is quite disgusting. 'freedom camping', war, money grubbing sods and other such venomous and vitriol language is off the charts. Seriously, there is no war, go to a war zone and see and smell the dead, then you'll really know what a war is. 'freedom camping', ffs, this not braveheart! We have more freedom than 90% of the world.

At times I'm quite disgusted by some of you. You're worse then a spoilt 2yr old sometimes. Comparing this issue to a war is a complete smear against those of us who actually have fought a war for our freedom so that we can actually afford a van and travel freely in this great country!

It's quite simply really, if you don't find a town or council willing to accommodate your needs, move on. You're either willing to pay for sites or you're not. Nobody at all in this country is putting a gun to your head and threatening you. Thinking you don't have a free choice is embarrassing to other gn's who move about this country in a polite manner and accept that the world is not perfect and you can't always get everything you want for free! Grow up and have a relearn of your manners and learn what freedom of choice really is. Remember to be thankful for what you have compared to many, and not even other countries, but australia too. Many people would be thankful to even own a half rotten van to sleep in, never mind a van and petrol money to travel.

Fark me some of you people piss me off sometimes with your self righteous bullsh*t sometimes!

Totally agree. We don't know how lucky we are to have freedom & the freedom to make choices

Cheers Pete

-- Edited by wasn_me on Wednesday 20th of February 2013 01:08:26 PM

Dougwe · Chief one feather

I think CV parks get their share of the travellers anyway. I got a email from friends of mine yesterday with a photo of what is actually my favourite CV park in Lakes Entrance, Vic. The photo was taken from across the road looking into the park, wow, chockers, no room to swing a cat (so to speak).

I am booked in there with other friends on the 14th March for 5 nights and sure hope it's not that crowded.

Big Gorilla · Guru

One Council Officer from a small town here in Tasmania I spoke to about the subject of Caravan Parks and Free Camping and the money we spend in towns remarked that we really spend very little for the benefit of the Town. Food and groceries are purchased from Woolworths and Coles and petrol/diesel is purchased from Woolworths and Coles Service Stations. That money spent doesn't benefit the Town to any great extent, it benefits the conglomerates such as the two major Supermarkets... Yes I know these Supermarkets/service stations employ local staff but I didn't bother to pursue the argument...

jetj · Guru

florinhill wrote:
When we do our small trips away from home base we shop in IGA stores, usually locally owned and away from the big guys, we also let them know we are travelling and spending with them by choice due to RV status facilities stc. We do pay modest freedom camping fee,s/donations where applicable. Very seldom do we use Caravan parks as we do not need the bells and whistles that they charge for.
I have used a CP in Tassie who has had the forsight to provide space within the complex for units like ours at a modest rate, from memory $12.0. WAs a safe secure quiet area within the park.

Bob

I stayed near Blayney for a couple of weeks and was disappointed there wasn't a W/W or Coles but after shopping in the IGA, I thought it was a wonderful store, had what I needed, fair price and lots of variety of stuff. I'm hooked!

I doubt we are ever going to agree about free camping and CPs, each to their own.

-- Edited by jetj on Wednesday 20th of February 2013 03:51:34 PM

biggles · Senior Member

.. I have to agree .. Blayney is a good spot .. great new vehicle wash point installed at northern end of town .. very handy dumpsite just down the road from the IGA .. A tyrepower store that is the only place I will go for tyres because of attitude and value .. but has one drawback .. it gets B****y cold ..

Jon

-- Edited by biggles on Wednesday 20th of February 2013 04:03:29 PM

beiffe · Guru

I won't spend in the large supermarkets if there is a small store available.

I always use food works or IGA or similar and I often buy my meat from the local butcher.

Same I never buy my fuel from the large dealerships if possible but it is getting harder to find the independents.

Same as I don't go to the large cities etc to buy my food and products when I can get them in the town I am in.

BUT I did try and spend money in the town I am in now and went to a local auto supplier and asked if he sold too items total over $1000 and was told "WE DON'T SELL THAT STUFF NOT ENOUGH TURNOVER" would not order in and was very rude in the process so will go to Melbourne, 45 minutes away and spend more than that total as there was other things I need.

I think much of this argument goes both ways the locals have to make us FEEL welcome and we also have to THANK the locals by telling them that we are buy because of their free/independent camping spot.

I have also advised a fuel depot I needed $15 of fuel to get to the next town to see if I could camp in their area and then I would spend money on fuel and food etc.

I wonder how the CP owners would feel if they were told that they had to eat at the restaurant for two nights before they could buy food to prepare in their kitchen, also one use of local Laundromat before they use their own washing machine.

Anyway the best way is to do what YOU feel is right and enjoy every day you have left.

Regards
Brian

ROWDYRABBIT1 · Senior Member

i think if the c/parks provided a value for money place to stay at at a reasonable price and clean facilites then they may get a few more stayers.the main trouble is a lot of c/parks just want to sit back and watch the money roll in

ROD