Why muck about with a f150 when you can get an f650.
https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/ford/f650
Having said that my baby sized Land Rover Freelander at 4.5m long & 1.88m high with roof rack scraped the height warning bar at 1.85m (got in with a few double checks) in a Frenchs Forest, Sydney shopping centre carpark.
yobarr said
08:28 AM Apr 4, 2023
This sort of misrepresentation should be banned as neither of these two vehicles has a snowflakes chance in hell of safely towing much over 3000kg as a PIG trailer.
Because the average buyer has NO understanding of weights they get "sucked in" when they see "4500kg tow capacity" and "eats utes for breakfast" advertisements, not understanding that, because of the stupidly low rear axle carrying capacity, towing this weight can be achieved ONLY with a DOG trailer .
If a vehicle has a GVM over 4500kg ALWAYS the weight on the wheels of the tow vehicleMUSTbe MORE than the weight on the wheels of the trailer/caravan.
Simple physics, minimising the chance of the Tail wagging the Dog.
The sooner such a law is intoduced to include ALL tow vehicles the safer we all will be. Cheers
At first I thought the journalist was suffering from ED, then I thought who is this twit ? so I looked at who wrote the article, oops it has to be a them or a they.
Nether the less besides the perceived reason for a big ute, its very much akin 'to the early days of mum's shopping cart, the Toorak Tractor.
Yeah I think my first reaction was correct it's either ED or lack of endowment on the chest.
AS for the parking issues you can go to any Westfield you will see plenty of small cars failing to park in the space provided correctly.
dorian said
09:28 AM Apr 4, 2023
I haven't seen a Canyonero yet.
Whenarewethere said
09:40 AM Apr 4, 2023
We have quite a few RAMs etc on Sydney Northern Beaches for the school runs.
The ideal vehicle for Yummy Mummies strutting in pinched (on their rear end) active wear & thong beneath, & finger nails that defy logic on how to actually be capable of doing anything useful in life.
To date I have not seen one with a tow bar square socket more than 40mm.
It looks like an embarrassing joke... the car!?
Are We Lost said
10:33 AM Apr 4, 2023
Whenarewethere wrote:
Why muck about with a f150 when you can get an f650.
https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/ford/f650
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. 6.7 litre turbo yet the power and torque figures are nothing special.
One of those "I can't afford one so I'm going to whinge and complain about those that can" people?
To whom do you refer? Graham (Gundog) or the author of the fable? Just wondering. Cheers
Gundog said
11:24 AM Apr 4, 2023
you only need to look just under the headline of the article to see who the author is.
yobarr said
11:44 AM Apr 4, 2023
Gundog wrote:
you only need to look just under the headline of the article to see who the author is.
That is obvious thanks Graham. If you actually read my post you'll note that I simply was asking to whom SIMON was referring in his post. Cheers
peter67 said
11:53 AM Apr 4, 2023
I think the Dodge Rams are a bit like smoke and mirrors. While the Ram looks far bigger than a Toyota LC200 series cruiser the weights tell a different story.
Dodge Ram kerb weight 2525kg. GVM 3450KG.
Toyota LC200 Landcruiser kerb weight 2740KG. GVM 3350KG.
dorian said
11:55 AM Apr 4, 2023
peter67 wrote:
I think the Dodge Rams are a bit like smoke and mirrors. While the Ram looks far bigger than a Toyota LC200 series cruiser the weights tell a different story.
Dodge Ram kerb weight 2525kg. GVM 3450KG.
Toyota LC200 Landcruiser kerb weight 2740KG. GVM 3350KG.
Would that be metric kg or US kg?
peter67 said
12:07 PM Apr 4, 2023
It's an aussie spec sheet I quoted from.
Gundog, I just measured the average width of two different shopping centre carpark bays over here in WA at 2.3mtrs wide. The width of a Dodge Ram is 2017mm which leaves 141mm (5.5 inches ) clearance on either side in the unlikely event the vehicle is parked centrally in the bay, unlikely with the steering lock available and length of the RAM truck. No wonder people hate parking next to vehicles that size when you can't even get the drivers door open to exit your vehicle.
Whenarewethere said
12:32 PM Apr 4, 2023
My Freelander's body width is 1910mm, I can only open the door to the first notch in our garage if I park to the mm.
yobarr said
01:03 PM Apr 4, 2023
dorian wrote:
peter67 wrote:
I think the Dodge Rams are a bit like smoke and mirrors. While the Ram looks far bigger than a Toyota LC200 series cruiser the weights tell a different story.
Dodge Ram kerb weight 2525kg. GVM 3450KG.
Toyota LC200 Landcruiser kerb weight 2740KG. GVM 3350KG.
Would that be metric kg or US kg?
US uses pounds, I believe, not kilograms. A KG is a KG all over the world. Cheers
yobarr said
01:11 PM Apr 4, 2023
peter67 wrote:
I think the Dodge Rams are a bit like smoke and mirrors. While the Ram looks far bigger than a Toyota LC200 series cruiser the weights tell a different story.
Dodge Ram kerb weight 2525kg. GVM 3450KG.
Toyota LC200 Landcruiser kerb weight 2740KG. GVM 3350KG.
Both cars are sold using the above sales method, and neither can safely tow much more than about 3000kg as a PIG trailer.
The sooner cars with GVM under 4500kg are included in the towing laws that apply to vehicles over 4500kg, the safer we all will be. Little twin-cabs with GCM of 6000kg towing 3500kg? Yeah, right. LaLa Land stuff. Cheers
One of those "I can't afford one so I'm going to whinge and complain about those that can" people?
To whom do you refer? Graham (Gundog) or the author of the fable? Just wondering. Cheers
I'm referring to anybody whinging about them. I can remember many years ago there was similar backlash against the "Toorak Tractors". Now, nobody bats an eyelid at a 200 series with all the fruit that obviously hasn't driven on a grass verge let alone a dirt track.
Would I buy one? Nope. Not that I can't afford one but rather because they just don't suit my current needs.
Simon
dorian said
02:17 PM Apr 4, 2023
yobarr wrote:
dorian wrote:
peter67 wrote:
I think the Dodge Rams are a bit like smoke and mirrors. While the Ram looks far bigger than a Toyota LC200 series cruiser the weights tell a different story.
Dodge Ram kerb weight 2525kg. GVM 3450KG.
Toyota LC200 Landcruiser kerb weight 2740KG. GVM 3350KG.
Would that be metric kg or US kg?
US uses pounds, I believe, not kilograms. A KG is a KG all over the world. Cheers
I thought it was obvious that I was joking.
smwhiskey said
02:21 PM Apr 4, 2023
Good comment made twice :(
-- Edited by smwhiskey on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 02:55:36 PM
One of those "I can't afford one so I'm going to whinge and complain about those that can" people?
To whom do you refer? Graham (Gundog) or the author of the fable? Just wondering. Cheers
I'm referring to anybody whinging about them. I can remember many years ago there was similar backlash against the "Toorak tractors". Now, nobody bats an eyelid at a 200 series with all the fruit that obviously hasn't driven on a grass verge let alone a dirt track.
Would I buy one? Nope Not that I can't afford one but rather because they just don't suit my current needs.
Simon
Thanks Simon, for clearing that up. Like you, I can indeed afford either of the two mentioned vehicles, and when I began searching for a suitable tow vehicle a few years past both were on my list of "maybes", along with Y61, F100, ALL the popular twin-cab lightweights and several others.
However, I soon established that neither of the subject vehicles had a snowflakes chance in hell of safely towing 3500kg as a PIG trailer, and they both were rejected.
Both are sheep in wolf's clothing, but the smoke and mirrors style of advertising seems to have worked well, with the RAM multiplying sales by 1200% in a year. Spare me! Cheers
-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 02:25:36 PM
Whenarewethere said
03:13 PM Apr 4, 2023
yobarr wrote:
Both are sheep in wolf's clothing
At least one is honest & calls itself a ram.
Gundog said
03:18 PM Apr 4, 2023
Yobarr get off your hobby horse about pig trailers and what can and cannot tow 3500kg.
In the article thats only a small portion of the story, the anti big ute is "why do you need one" which in fact is just a choice like wanting a Ranger Raptor or an F150 EV. How often do you see a Jeep or similar, with big muddies all tricked up in the city, or in regional areas young blokes with jacked up 79ers with the dog box on the back big chrome exhaust stacks (often rollin coal) when powering off the lights.
Its all a matter of choice, the thing we wanted in my youth was a lowered EH with a 2" exhaust and tripple SU's.
yobarr said
04:42 PM Apr 4, 2023
Whenarewethere wrote:
yobarr wrote:
Both are sheep in wolf's clothing
At least one is honest & calls itself a ram.
Love it Jonathan!
One photo is how owners might like to see a particular car while the other is how people who understand weights are likely to see the same car! Cheers
-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 04:55:16 PM
Without wanting to rain on you parade Yobarr, I watched a report on the depreciation values of current new vehicles in Australia and the big ole Ram 1500 trumped the 300 and the 200 series and gained top spot as the vehicle that is recorded to be the best at maintaining their price.
I have a 200 and I dont intend to sell it even though the sale might look good on paper.
If any on here remember Rob D he sold his 200 and he lost very little from 2014 as a new vehicle purchase.
Will this continue? Who knows.
Will the Rams win out over the Toyotas? Who knows.
Will the plethora of medium utes and and SUVs be the answer? Who knows.
Who cares? Not me, but who knows.
I dont care because as an accountant I factored into my investment purchase of the vehicle for towing my van.
If the 200 maintains it value, then great.
I wont be buying a Ram and we looked at a 79 series prior to purchasing the 200 and that was enough to confirm my decision.
The 79 series ute is just not a vehicle that most people would want. Sorry Yobarr!
As it was explained to me as a bloke who knows nothing about cars is that with a combination of a caravan and a 79 series, it is the 79 that actually is the PIG.
yobarr said
07:26 PM Apr 4, 2023
RickJ wrote:
The 79 series ute is just not a vehicle that most people would want. Sorry Yobarr!
As it was explained to me as a bloke who knows nothing about cars is that with a combination of a caravan and a 79 series, it is the 79 that actually is the PIG.
In addition to pointing out that this thread is not about 79s, I'd certainly agree that there is little doubt that a 79 won't suit a lot of people. But Toyota have called a halt to taking new orders, so a standard 2nd hand one now is fetching up to $120,000. Pretty good?
Not bad for a car that has been around since the 1980s, albeit with some upgrades, one being the addition of the little V8 in 2007.
What you're paying for with this old dinosaur is the things that you don't see. Chassis, diffs, bearings, clutches, engines, steering and suspension all built for durability. Built to carry, drag, tow and haul, and do it for many years.
Only a (lucky) few truly need something like a 79, but for these people there's simply nothing that compares or competes.
Cheers
P.S "Pig" you say. Not sure about that, but I can confirm that it definitely loves playing in the mud! REAL 4wd.
On a more serious note, the chap who you say made derogatory comments about the 79 towing a van wouldn't know night from day. With a 3180mm wheelbase, short TBO and 2300kg rear axle carrying capacity there is nothing to compete unless you go to the BIG Yank Tanks like RAM 2500, Silverado 2500, F250 etc.
-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 07:59:05 PM
Ram has just announced it's new REV Ram truck, all figures here in aussie kilo's Dorian. The write ups so far are very positive and go into exhausting detail with endurance and 0 to 60 mph ( American measurement Dorian ) in 4.4 seconds etc. Trim and pricing specs BUT...no kerb weight given, how weird is that?? I've looked at Ram's official website and none of the reviews mention it either. What they do say is that with the smaller 168KWH battery the official tow rating is 6350 kg's...yes, you read that correctly.
Even in aussie kilo's that sounds like an enormous load, so what would you guess the GCM of Ram REV towing a 6350KG load total? The larger battery option is 229KWH. I note that a 212KWH battery weighs 1353kg's, roughly the same weight as a medium sized car. Can anyone find the kerb weight for the new EV Dodge ram? and just to be silly...should people driving this colossus pay truck freighting road taxes, not to mention the excess tyre and brake wear they are up for.
ps, Yobarr, the Ram REV has four wheel steering which should help in the carpark, and a maximum water crossing depth of 600mm no doubt due to the battery, would a snorkel help?? :)
yobarr said
12:30 PM Apr 6, 2023
peter67 wrote:
ps, Yobarr, the Ram REV has four wheel steering which should help in the carpark, and a maximum water crossing depth of 600mm no doubt due to the battery, would a snorkel help?? :)
Without doing a bit if research I'd say that 600mm wading depth would be to top of chassis so no snorkel would be required. My car has, from memory, 700mm wading depth, but I'll comment on tge rest of your post later.
Just got pins and bushes back from machining shop so now have to put earthmoving machine back together. Cheers
https://www.news.com.au/technology/motoring/on-the-road/stupid-american-trucks-aussies-erupt-as-hated-us-trend-takes-over/news-story/7d27bb85b33782ab28acfd18d29bda2d
Why muck about with a f150 when you can get an f650.
https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/ford/f650
Having said that my baby sized Land Rover Freelander at 4.5m long & 1.88m high with roof rack scraped the height warning bar at 1.85m (got in with a few double checks) in a Frenchs Forest, Sydney shopping centre carpark.
This sort of misrepresentation should be banned as neither of these two vehicles has a snowflakes chance in hell of safely towing much over 3000kg as a PIG trailer.
Because the average buyer has NO understanding of weights they get "sucked in" when they see "4500kg tow capacity" and "eats utes for breakfast" advertisements, not understanding that, because of the stupidly low rear axle carrying capacity, towing this weight can be achieved ONLY with a DOG trailer .
If a vehicle has a GVM over 4500kg ALWAYS the weight on the wheels of the tow vehicle MUST be MORE than the weight on the wheels of the trailer/caravan.
Simple physics, minimising the chance of the Tail wagging the Dog.
The sooner such a law is intoduced to include ALL tow vehicles the safer we all will be. Cheers
At first I thought the journalist was suffering from ED, then I thought who is this twit ? so I looked at who wrote the article, oops it has to be a them or a they.
Nether the less besides the perceived reason for a big ute, its very much akin 'to the early days of mum's shopping cart, the Toorak Tractor.
Yeah I think my first reaction was correct it's either ED or lack of endowment on the chest.
AS for the parking issues you can go to any Westfield you will see plenty of small cars failing to park in the space provided correctly.
We have quite a few RAMs etc on Sydney Northern Beaches for the school runs.
The ideal vehicle for Yummy Mummies strutting in pinched (on their rear end) active wear & thong beneath, & finger nails that defy logic on how to actually be capable of doing anything useful in life.
To date I have not seen one with a tow bar square socket more than 40mm.
It looks like an embarrassing joke... the car!?
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. 6.7 litre turbo yet the power and torque figures are nothing special.
One of those "I can't afford one so I'm going to whinge and complain about those that can" people?
To whom do you refer? Graham (Gundog) or the author of the fable? Just wondering. Cheers
you only need to look just under the headline of the article to see who the author is.
That is obvious thanks Graham. If you actually read my post you'll note that I simply was asking to whom SIMON was referring in his post. Cheers
Dodge Ram kerb weight 2525kg. GVM 3450KG.
Toyota LC200 Landcruiser kerb weight 2740KG. GVM 3350KG.
Would that be metric kg or US kg?
Gundog, I just measured the average width of two different shopping centre carpark bays over here in WA at 2.3mtrs wide. The width of a Dodge Ram is 2017mm which leaves 141mm (5.5 inches ) clearance on either side in the unlikely event the vehicle is parked centrally in the bay, unlikely with the steering lock available and length of the RAM truck. No wonder people hate parking next to vehicles that size when you can't even get the drivers door open to exit your vehicle.
My Freelander's body width is 1910mm, I can only open the door to the first notch in our garage if I park to the mm.
US uses pounds, I believe, not kilograms. A KG is a KG all over the world. Cheers
Both cars are sold using the above sales method, and neither can safely tow much more than about 3000kg as a PIG trailer.
The sooner cars with GVM under 4500kg are included in the towing laws that apply to vehicles over 4500kg, the safer we all will be. Little twin-cabs with GCM of 6000kg towing 3500kg? Yeah, right. LaLa Land stuff. Cheers
I'm referring to anybody whinging about them. I can remember many years ago there was similar backlash against the "Toorak Tractors". Now, nobody bats an eyelid at a 200 series with all the fruit that obviously hasn't driven on a grass verge let alone a dirt track.
Would I buy one? Nope. Not that I can't afford one but rather because they just don't suit my current needs.
Simon
I thought it was obvious that I was joking.
Good comment made twice :(
-- Edited by smwhiskey on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 02:55:36 PM
Thanks Simon, for clearing that up. Like you, I can indeed afford either of the two mentioned vehicles, and when I began searching for a suitable tow vehicle a few years past both were on my list of "maybes", along with Y61, F100, ALL the popular twin-cab lightweights and several others.
However, I soon established that neither of the subject vehicles had a snowflakes chance in hell of safely towing 3500kg as a PIG trailer, and they both were rejected.
Both are sheep in wolf's clothing, but the smoke and mirrors style of advertising seems to have worked well, with the RAM multiplying sales by 1200% in a year. Spare me! Cheers
-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 02:25:36 PM
At least one is honest & calls itself a ram.
Yobarr get off your hobby horse about pig trailers and what can and cannot tow 3500kg.
In the article thats only a small portion of the story, the anti big ute is "why do you need one" which in fact is just a choice like wanting a Ranger Raptor or an F150 EV. How often do you see a Jeep or similar, with big muddies all tricked up in the city, or in regional areas young blokes with jacked up 79ers with the dog box on the back big chrome exhaust stacks (often rollin coal) when powering off the lights.
Its all a matter of choice, the thing we wanted in my youth was a lowered EH with a 2" exhaust and tripple SU's.
Love it Jonathan!
One photo is how owners might like to see a particular car while the other is how people who understand weights are likely to see the same car! Cheers
-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 04:55:16 PM
I have a 200 and I dont intend to sell it even though the sale might look good on paper.
If any on here remember Rob D he sold his 200 and he lost very little from 2014 as a new vehicle purchase.
Will this continue? Who knows.
Will the Rams win out over the Toyotas? Who knows.
Will the plethora of medium utes and and SUVs be the answer? Who knows.
Who cares? Not me, but who knows.
I dont care because as an accountant I factored into my investment purchase of the vehicle for towing my van.
If the 200 maintains it value, then great.
I wont be buying a Ram and we looked at a 79 series prior to purchasing the 200 and that was enough to confirm my decision.
The 79 series ute is just not a vehicle that most people would want. Sorry Yobarr!
As it was explained to me as a bloke who knows nothing about cars is that with a combination of a caravan and a 79 series, it is the 79 that actually is the PIG.
In addition to pointing out that this thread is not about 79s, I'd certainly agree that there is little doubt that a 79 won't suit a lot of people. But Toyota have called a halt to taking new orders, so a standard 2nd hand one now is fetching up to $120,000. Pretty good?
Not bad for a car that has been around since the 1980s, albeit with some upgrades, one being the addition of the little V8 in 2007.
What you're paying for with this old dinosaur is the things that you don't see. Chassis, diffs, bearings, clutches, engines, steering and suspension all built for durability. Built to carry, drag, tow and haul, and do it for many years.
Only a (lucky) few truly need something like a 79, but for these people there's simply nothing that compares or competes.
Cheers
P.S "Pig" you say. Not sure about that, but I can confirm that it definitely loves playing in the mud! REAL 4wd.
On a more serious note, the chap who you say made derogatory comments about the 79 towing a van wouldn't know night from day. With a 3180mm wheelbase, short TBO and 2300kg rear axle carrying capacity there is nothing to compete unless you go to the BIG Yank Tanks like RAM 2500, Silverado 2500, F250 etc.
-- Edited by yobarr on Tuesday 4th of April 2023 07:59:05 PM
Even in aussie kilo's that sounds like an enormous load, so what would you guess the GCM of Ram REV towing a 6350KG load total? The larger battery option is 229KWH. I note that a 212KWH battery weighs 1353kg's, roughly the same weight as a medium sized car. Can anyone find the kerb weight for the new EV Dodge ram? and just to be silly...should people driving this colossus pay truck freighting road taxes, not to mention the excess tyre and brake wear they are up for.
ps, Yobarr, the Ram REV has four wheel steering which should help in the carpark, and a maximum water crossing depth of 600mm no doubt due to the battery, would a snorkel help?? :)
Without doing a bit if research I'd say that 600mm wading depth would be to top of chassis so no snorkel would be required.
My car has, from memory, 700mm wading depth, but I'll comment on tge rest of your post later.
Just got pins and bushes back from machining shop so now have to put earthmoving machine back together. Cheers