What panels do the experts here use? Good or cheap?
Warren-Pat_01 said
10:11 AM Sep 14, 2021
G'day people,
I'm looking at upgrading the ET 55w panel on my pop-top & going to a larger panel. That is if I can get three of the four mounting feet off the roof without doing any damage. Output power is not a major consideration as our power needs are low, however weight is - I'm not getting any younger but a lot weaker . Living in Townsville, we get lots of sun!
Yesterday I looked at two panels of similar power here in Townsville - one was Enerdrive where the quality was obvious. It weighed 8kg (100w). The other was a BCF XTM 110w, quality is ?? & weight is 4 to 5 kg. The prices were rather different too - the latter was half the price! My current ET panel weighs 6kg. The last thing I want is to have a panel flying off the van due to flimsy manufacturing!
A friend suggested that I consider going to a 180w panel (11.1kg - an additional 5kg over what I'm lifting (straining) now. I'm open to suggestions.
Peter_n_Margaret said
11:39 AM Sep 14, 2021
Post the physical size and specs for the panels in question, or better still, a link to them.
Cheers,
Peter
Warren-Pat_01 said
01:51 PM Sep 14, 2021
Hi Peter,
I don't see that the physical size is an issue when I've already given the weights & powers - however
ET - is becoming harder to find on the internet as they are now kaput! Only one or two stores have limited numbers & are selling them a cheap prices. All of the above panels are 35mm thick. giving me adequate panel cooling on my Jaycar mounts.
Kings? I haven't checked them as yet - suspect they would be similar to BCF(?) - they don't show the weight & thickness (30mm) is less, possibly bring the panel closer to the van top.
I don't want Rolls/Royces on top - just reasonable builds & quality that I don't have to throw away after a few years & won't fall apart in the first storm or driving at 100kph.
Whenarewethere said
02:24 PM Sep 14, 2021
The first item I would cross off the list is any panel with plastic corners.
Mike Harding said
02:45 PM Sep 14, 2021
Hi Warren The panel size will give you an idea of its realistic output power. Top quality panels are currently running in the vicinity of 177W/m2 (a bit less for small panels) but it's common to find E-bay suppliers quoting 300W/m2! They are lying. Their panels are probably still OK but not of the wattage quoted. I recently did a post on this subject.
From what you have said in this post maybe just buy the, more or less, cheapest panels you can find and see how they go - you should be able to pick up 100W or less panels secondhand for around $50.
Whenarewethere said
03:05 PM Sep 14, 2021
The highest wattage I came across was 402 watts per square metre.
For a medium sized panel if it calculates at more the 150 watts per square metre, they are using a rubber ruler!
Warren-Pat_01 said
04:41 PM Sep 17, 2021
Thanks all,
I'm going back to the think tank as I first have to get the original panel off the roof (a patient, trying scrape, I believe). Trying to remove the feet is not what the glue manufacturer intended . The panel still looks stuck!
I may add one of the eBay specials to the roof of similar power & voltages to give a bit more "go".
I've got 120w in portable panels if I need them. They are just a bit heavier than a single panel.
But amortised over a decade it's barely noticeable.
I learnt a long time ago the price of an item is way down the list of factors & saves money in the long run, often in ways not seen initially.
Warren-Pat_01 said
09:50 PM Sep 19, 2021
Hi Noel,
Your panel looks impressive as far as construction goes. It's in a similar price band to the heavier Enerdrive panel. Some panels that I've looked at recently 7 seemed rather feeble as the aluminium frame is only right angled (not channel), offering minimal strength, but is cheap (& nasty?)
Mamil said
04:49 PM Sep 25, 2021
Warren, as to your original question of good or cheap, my view is that both can work for you, just so long as you know what you are getting into with the cheap ones.
For my camper trailer I have both Australian Direct (KickAss) 200W portable panels which cost me $500, and SuperCheap Auto 150W solar blanket which cost $200.
The Australian Direct panels are good build quality, relatively light, use quality materials and have thick wiring and Anderson plugs, but most importantly actually deliver a little more than the advertised output at 205W
The SuperCheap Auto solar blanket uses inferior materials, is relatively heavy, and only delivers 130W versus advertised 150W.
So, you'd think it'd be a no-brainer to go for the more expensive panels? But if you calculate the cost per watt of delivered output, the cheap ones come in at $1.5 per watt whereas the expensive ones are $2.5 per watt, so the cheaper ones are actually much better value. Or looking at it another way, you could buy two of the cheaper panels and get 260W versus 205W, and still save yourself a hundred bucks!
Of course you have to also take into account other factors like weight, longevity, and quality, and that's where the more expensive ones score better, but I wouldn't write off cheap panels as they have their advantages too.
Asutralian Direct 200W folding panels in background, and SuperCheap Auto 150W blanket in foreground:-
Australian Direct panels performance:-
SuperCheap Auto blanket performance:-
-- Edited by Mamil on Saturday 25th of September 2021 05:03:13 PM
I've recently purchased 2 x 200W ex house panels for $30 each and they are working very well, so well that I called the seller and asked him to put aside another panel for me in order to boost my winter gather.
peatop said
01:28 PM Oct 8, 2021
Mike Harding wrote:
I've recently purchased 2 x 200W ex house panels for $30 each and they are working very well, so well that I called the seller and asked him to put aside another panel for me in order to boost my winter gather.
I also looked into buying ex house panels and almost bought 2 myself, but the only issue was the voltage was to high for my existing setup and couldn't make it work without buying more than the 2 I wanted, then I came across some 145w panels that were installed on a house and then removed as they were the wrong size, I bought 2 for $80 each and they come with full 5 year warranty, tested them the other day and was getting the full stated output with midday sun. I'm a very happy camper now lol
Mike Harding said
02:53 PM Oct 9, 2021
Nice buy Peatop :)
For we caravan/campers there are some terrific bargains currently with ex. house panels. I think my 200W ones at 1580 x 808mm are about as large as is practical for a portable setup, they fit into my Holden Trailblazer with all but the two front seats removed but only just.
Due to covid my Victron 100/30 MPPT controller was delayed and only arrived one week past: a most impressive piece of kit and I would not dispute their claimed 98% efficiency.
peatop said
12:58 PM Oct 14, 2021
I managed to finally get away for my first trip to test how well my setup would work, I was shocked to find with just the 2 new 145w panels kept my 120Ah AGM full given that it was overcast for most of the 4 days I was away, I had ordered a Renogy 30A PWM controller as a backup but it hadn't arrived before I left so the Kings MPPT that came with the 200w blanket did the work. The 120w and 200w blanket never made it out of the trailer. Now I'm saving for the Victron 100/50 and I think then im covered.
Bicyclecamper said
05:54 PM Oct 14, 2021
I use Jaycar panels that I bought 6 years ago (They were not cheap back then) Portable 80 watts, as I only use 4-7 amps at night, I didn't need more. But now with the camper, am only taking a 45ah battery and only using around 4 amps at night, this these panels will be all I will need. They were $229 down from $270, and I regard them very highly.
malken said
09:49 PM Oct 26, 2021
peatop wrote:
I managed to finally get away for my first trip to test how well my setup would work, I was shocked to find with just the 2 new 145w panels kept my 120Ah AGM full given that it was overcast for most of the 4 days I was away, I had ordered a Renogy 30A PWM controller as a backup but it hadn't arrived before I left so the Kings MPPT that came with the 200w blanket did the work. The 120w and 200w blanket never made it out of the trailer. Now I'm saving for the Victron 100/50 and I think then im covered.
Ive got one of the Kings MPPT and 200w blanket also. I hooked it up and looked at the instructions to see what the lights meant and noticed they said this MPPT is not suitable with lithium batteries which I have. The store advised otherwise but Ive rewired the input directly to my Enerdrive dc2dc. Lucky I saw the comment in the instructions. unusual for the MPPT to not be compatible but thats what it says so buyers be aware
valiant81 said
09:18 AM Oct 27, 2021
Hi all; Warren I also have my solar panels ( 2 X 120 Watt ) on the pop top of the roof of my caravan. Mounted them both at the drawbar end of the van. They work fine and at nearly 9 years old still work. One problem that i did not forsee was the weight of the panels and the extra amount of energy required to lift the roof up !! Whatever size panels you end up with try and find the total weight of the panels and put that amount of weight on your roof and then try and lift the roof up with the added weight. You might be surprised !! I also changed over the solar controller to a MPPT type controller and have found that far more efficient.
Whenarewethere said
03:54 PM Oct 27, 2021
A rough rule of thumb is about 15kg per square metre of panel including a bit of mounting furniture.
Aus-Kiwi said
06:51 PM Oct 27, 2021
I have 3 sets ( 3 X2) in parallel on roof 2 are cheapies and still working after 5 years .
Izabarack said
05:08 PM Dec 16, 2021
Ive gone to semi-flex panels on the Campervan. Weight was the main consideration I wanted to deal with. 2Kg per panel and using the comparison to the rigid panels on the van, a total saving of 12 Kg. I went Sunyee (under $100) after seeing a in-the-field comparison to a similar spec Brand name panel ($310).
G'day people,
I'm looking at upgrading the ET 55w panel on my pop-top & going to a larger panel. That is if I can get three of the four mounting feet off the roof without doing any damage. Output power is not a major consideration as our power needs are low, however weight is - I'm not getting any younger but a lot weaker . Living in Townsville, we get lots of sun!
Yesterday I looked at two panels of similar power here in Townsville - one was Enerdrive where the quality was obvious. It weighed 8kg (100w). The other was a BCF XTM 110w, quality is ?? & weight is 4 to 5 kg. The prices were rather different too - the latter was half the price! My current ET panel weighs 6kg. The last thing I want is to have a panel flying off the van due to flimsy manufacturing!
A friend suggested that I consider going to a 180w panel (11.1kg - an additional 5kg over what I'm lifting (straining) now. I'm open to suggestions.
Cheers,
Peter
I don't see that the physical size is an issue when I've already given the weights & powers - however
Enerdrdrive - enerdrive.com.au/product-category/products/solar/fixed-solar-panels/
BCF - www.bcf.com.au/p/xtm-110w-fixed-solar-panel/563065.html
ET - is becoming harder to find on the internet as they are now kaput! Only one or two stores have limited numbers & are selling them a cheap prices. All of the above panels are 35mm thick. giving me adequate panel cooling on my Jaycar mounts.
Kings? I haven't checked them as yet - suspect they would be similar to BCF(?) - they don't show the weight & thickness (30mm) is less, possibly bring the panel closer to the van top.
I don't want Rolls/Royces on top - just reasonable builds & quality that I don't have to throw away after a few years & won't fall apart in the first storm or driving at 100kph.
The first item I would cross off the list is any panel with plastic corners.
Hi Warren The panel size will give you an idea of its realistic output power. Top quality panels are currently running in the vicinity of 177W/m2 (a bit less for small panels) but it's common to find E-bay suppliers quoting 300W/m2! They are lying. Their panels are probably still OK but not of the wattage quoted. I recently did a post on this subject.
From what you have said in this post maybe just buy the, more or less, cheapest panels you can find and see how they go - you should be able to pick up 100W or less panels secondhand for around $50.
The highest wattage I came across was 402 watts per square metre.
For a medium sized panel if it calculates at more the 150 watts per square metre, they are using a rubber ruler!
I'm going back to the think tank as I first have to get the original panel off the roof (a patient, trying scrape, I believe). Trying to remove the feet is not what the glue manufacturer intended . The panel still looks stuck!
I may add one of the eBay specials to the roof of similar power & voltages to give a bit more "go".
I've got 120w in portable panels if I need them. They are just a bit heavier than a single panel.
That's a considerable premium to save 4kg:
100W panel
But amortised over a decade it's barely noticeable.
I learnt a long time ago the price of an item is way down the list of factors & saves money in the long run, often in ways not seen initially.
Your panel looks impressive as far as construction goes. It's in a similar price band to the heavier Enerdrive panel. Some panels that I've looked at recently 7 seemed rather feeble as the aluminium frame is only right angled (not channel), offering minimal strength, but is cheap (& nasty?)
Warren, as to your original question of good or cheap, my view is that both can work for you, just so long as you know what you are getting into with the cheap ones.
For my camper trailer I have both Australian Direct (KickAss) 200W portable panels which cost me $500, and SuperCheap Auto 150W solar blanket which cost $200.
The Australian Direct panels are good build quality, relatively light, use quality materials and have thick wiring and Anderson plugs, but most importantly actually deliver a little more than the advertised output at 205W
The SuperCheap Auto solar blanket uses inferior materials, is relatively heavy, and only delivers 130W versus advertised 150W.
So, you'd think it'd be a no-brainer to go for the more expensive panels? But if you calculate the cost per watt of delivered output, the cheap ones come in at $1.5 per watt whereas the expensive ones are $2.5 per watt, so the cheaper ones are actually much better value. Or looking at it another way, you could buy two of the cheaper panels and get 260W versus 205W, and still save yourself a hundred bucks!
Of course you have to also take into account other factors like weight, longevity, and quality, and that's where the more expensive ones score better, but I wouldn't write off cheap panels as they have their advantages too.
Asutralian Direct 200W folding panels in background, and SuperCheap Auto 150W blanket in foreground:-
Australian Direct panels performance:-
SuperCheap Auto blanket performance:-
-- Edited by Mamil on Saturday 25th of September 2021 05:03:13 PM
I've recently purchased 2 x 200W ex house panels for $30 each and they are working very well, so well that I called the seller and asked him to put aside another panel for me in order to boost my winter gather.
I also looked into buying ex house panels and almost bought 2 myself, but the only issue was the voltage was to high for my existing setup and couldn't make it work without buying more than the 2 I wanted, then I came across some 145w panels that were installed on a house and then removed as they were the wrong size, I bought 2 for $80 each and they come with full 5 year warranty, tested them the other day and was getting the full stated output with midday sun. I'm a very happy camper now lol
Nice buy Peatop :)
For we caravan/campers there are some terrific bargains currently with ex. house panels. I think my 200W ones at 1580 x 808mm are about as large as is practical for a portable setup, they fit into my Holden Trailblazer with all but the two front seats removed but only just.
Due to covid my Victron 100/30 MPPT controller was delayed and only arrived one week past: a most impressive piece of kit and I would not dispute their claimed 98% efficiency.
I managed to finally get away for my first trip to test how well my setup would work, I was shocked to find with just the 2 new 145w panels kept my 120Ah AGM full given that it was overcast for most of the 4 days I was away, I had ordered a Renogy 30A PWM controller as a backup but it hadn't arrived before I left so the Kings MPPT that came with the 200w blanket did the work. The 120w and 200w blanket never made it out of the trailer. Now I'm saving for the Victron 100/50 and I think then im covered.
Ive got one of the Kings MPPT and 200w blanket also. I hooked it up and looked at the instructions to see what the lights meant and noticed they said this MPPT is not suitable with lithium batteries which I have. The store advised otherwise but Ive rewired the input directly to my Enerdrive dc2dc. Lucky I saw the comment in the instructions. unusual for the MPPT to not be compatible but thats what it says so buyers be aware
A rough rule of thumb is about 15kg per square metre of panel including a bit of mounting furniture.