Looking at definitions, the tare weight is the weight of an empty container e.g. a shipping container, but what if one fits a refrigeration unit to that container, then surely the tare weight is now the container plus the refrigeration unit. The tare weight of a caravan is said to be the weight of the van when it leaves the dealer, so ours came with full gas bottles, a TV set under the bed, recliner chairs etc. that's hardly the empty weight. Now just like that shipping container, you have added more permanently fixed items of equipment e.g. solar panels, grey water tank, diesel heater for instance. Then surely the tare weight of a caravan is the weight of the van minus all removable items, regardless of what it says on the compliance plate.
So I intend to get our van weighed, and have removed all the loose items, just need to drain the water, and remove the gas bottles. That will give me the van empty weight and will let me know what weight we have to play with, I intend to do the same with the tow vehicle.
I too have weighed my van and vehicle after taking out everything removable including water and gas but with the vehicle I had full fuel tank. Since diesel weighs 832 grams per litre, I can calculate the empty weight with no fuel. Since Tare already has a definition, I can't say my empty weights are Tare as the purists amongst us would take up arms (and rightfully so). I call my empty van and vehicle weights "Empty weights". Funny about that. Armed with the knowledge of the ratings applied to my rig, I now know exactly what my payloads can be and how it can mixed and shared across the rig combination.
To me, Tare is an irrelevant number and serves no purpose once the van has left the dealer.
iana said
02:17 PM Jul 12, 2021
If you were to buy loose goods, one would have to "Tare" off the container first, then fill the container and weigh again, and be charged on the weight minus tare. The persons doing the weighing don't ask you to supply a container as it came from the supplier, they are only interested in the empty weight there and then.
montie said
03:11 PM Jul 12, 2021
Tare Mass is the total mass of the trailer when not carrying any load, but when ready for service, unoccupied (if relevant) and with all fluid reservoirs (if fitted) filled to nominal capacity except for fuel, which shall be 10 litres only, and with all standard equipment and any options fitted. This includes any mass imposed onto the drawing vehicle when the combination vehicle is resting on a horizontal supporting plane. (Fluid reservoirs do not include water tanks and waste water tanks fitted to caravans
The tare weight stamped on the compliance plate is the measured weight of the dry empty van when it leaves the manufacturer and includes all extras fitted at the factory.
-- Edited by montie on Monday 12th of July 2021 03:13:25 PM
iana said
03:25 PM Jul 12, 2021
Soooooo the empty weight of a caravan complete with all fixed modifications added since the factory roll out would be the revised tare weight, regardless of what the compliance plate reads.
Interesting with aircraft, the word tare is not used, but empty weight.
Radar said
03:33 PM Jul 12, 2021
iana wrote:
Looking at definitions, the tare weight is the weight of an empty container e.g. a shipping container, but what if one fits a refrigeration unit to that container, then surely the tare weight is now the container plus the refrigeration unit. The tare weight of a caravan is said to be the weight of the van when it leaves the dealer, so ours came with full gas bottles, a TV set under the bed, recliner chairs etc. that's hardly the empty weight. Now just like that shipping container, you have added more permanently fixed items of equipment e.g. solar panels, grey water tank, diesel heater for instance. Then surely the tare weight of a caravan is the weight of the van minus all removable items, regardless of what it says on the compliance plate.
So I intend to get our van weighed, and have removed all the loose items, just need to drain the water, and remove the gas bottles. That will give me the van empty weight and will let me know what weight we have to play with, I intend to do the same with the tow vehicle.
If you are talking about real shipping containers, those that go on ships, the tare that is marked on the side, back or front are internationally recognised whether dry or a refrigerator container, a quick glance at the scales when I have been carting boxes (containers) tells me that weight is for real, specially the reefer ones as I have done hundreds with meat in them and it needs to match the shipping manifest.
Not a good reference point. You would be a game man turning up at the wharf with a container with wrong weight, like Dougwe says, I can tell you that for free.
yobarr said
04:04 PM Jul 12, 2021
iana wrote:
Soooooo the empty weight of a caravan complete with all fixed modifications added since the factory roll out would be the revised tare weight, regardless of what the compliance plate reads.
Interesting with aircraft, the word tare is not used, but empty weight.
After the caravan has been tared,and leaves the factory,ALL added weight is part of its carrying capacity.There is no such thing as "revised tare". Cheers
montie said
04:36 PM Jul 12, 2021
yobarr wrote:
iana wrote:
Soooooo the empty weight of a caravan complete with all fixed modifications added since the factory roll out would be the revised tare weight, regardless of what the compliance plate reads.
Interesting with aircraft, the word tare is not used, but empty weight.
After the caravan has been tared,and leaves the factory,ALL added weight is part of its carrying capacity.There is no such thing as "revised tare". Cheers
The plated tare weight when subtracted from the ATM gives you the van's gross payload.
This gross payload must accommodate water and gas, any after market accessories and all your gear.
dabbler said
05:20 PM Jul 12, 2021
IMO unless you have a recent measure, there's no point worrying about Tare Wt. We're legally restricted by actual laden wt. If your ATM is too high then you need a remedy but Tare wt isn't typically a legal or practical barrier. I read a recent thread somewhere that the OP was discussing the Tare Wt of a 10yr van and their first trip.
iana said
06:51 PM Jul 12, 2021
I read on here by someone, that for a van you need the empty weight plus about 500 kg to have a chance of being legal. I can't see the point of loading the van to go away, weighing and finding your over weight. If our empty weight is too high, then I have to remove some of that weight.
Interesting though, the tare of the ute includes the tray, and the tray was one of the items I was eyeing off to remove, and fit the canopy direct to the tray channels, this would remove about 80 kg me thinks. But it may not be a legal move, you just cant win.
When it comes to selling which may be on the cards, I just tell the prospective buyers the tare weight, they can tow anything (that's what they told me at the caravan sales).
Craig1 said
09:55 PM Jul 12, 2021
With a cab,chassis you can bolt onto oem mounting points whatever you like.justcant exceed gvm,width,height,,length overall allowed. Andmust use approved fastners, correctly torqued. Then comes thecan of worms.ball weight, diwnloads, wdh, chains that are angry or not XX, ETC
Radar said
06:52 AM Jul 13, 2021
iana wrote:
I read on here by someone, that for a van you need the empty weight plus about 500 kg to have a chance of being legal. I can't see the point of loading the van to go away, weighing and finding your over weight. If our empty weight is too high, then I have to remove some of that weight. Interesting though, the tare of the ute includes the tray, and the tray was one of the items I was eyeing off to remove, and fit the canopy direct to the tray channels, this would remove about 80 kg me thinks. But it may not be a legal move, you just cant win. When it comes to selling which may be on the cards, I just tell the prospective buyers the tare weight, they can tow anything (that's what they told me at the caravan sales).
Iana, your idea about bolting the tray to chassis is to me with no numbers after my name is great start to reducing weight on your ute. Take a step back in time and put wooden runners on also, I can not see it being illegal.
If you are selling the vehicle, sell the vehicle not its physical faults to you and certainly dont offer tare weights.
montie said
06:55 AM Jul 13, 2021
dabbler wrote:
IMO unless you have a recent measure, there's no point worrying about Tare Wt. We're legally restricted by actual laden wt. If your ATM is too high then you need a remedy but Tare wt isn't typically a legal or practical barrier. I read a recent thread somewhere that the OP was discussing the Tare Wt of a 10yr van and their first trip.
Absolutely correct.
At the end of the day the only rating that matters is the ATM. Keep your van's measured weight under that and you won't have a problem provided you manage your ball weight. Plated tare assists in the calculation of gross payload at the outset so you can manage ATM.
Ram Man said
09:30 AM Jul 23, 2021
Tare is easy, it's the vehicle with 20 litres of fuel this will be in the fine print contained within the vehicle brochure. sometime they put only 10 litres of fuel.
It's just the vehicle weight, no passengers, no accessories the unladen weight and minimal fuel.
Looking at definitions, the tare weight is the weight of an empty container e.g. a shipping container, but what if one fits a refrigeration unit to that container, then surely the tare weight is now the container plus the refrigeration unit. The tare weight of a caravan is said to be the weight of the van when it leaves the dealer, so ours came with full gas bottles, a TV set under the bed, recliner chairs etc. that's hardly the empty weight. Now just like that shipping container, you have added more permanently fixed items of equipment e.g. solar panels, grey water tank, diesel heater for instance. Then surely the tare weight of a caravan is the weight of the van minus all removable items, regardless of what it says on the compliance plate.
So I intend to get our van weighed, and have removed all the loose items, just need to drain the water, and remove the gas bottles. That will give me the van empty weight and will let me know what weight we have to play with, I intend to do the same with the tow vehicle.
I too have weighed my van and vehicle after taking out everything removable including water and gas but with the vehicle I had full fuel tank. Since diesel weighs 832 grams per litre, I can calculate the empty weight with no fuel. Since Tare already has a definition, I can't say my empty weights are Tare as the purists amongst us would take up arms (and rightfully so). I call my empty van and vehicle weights "Empty weights". Funny about that. Armed with the knowledge of the ratings applied to my rig, I now know exactly what my payloads can be and how it can mixed and shared across the rig combination.
To me, Tare is an irrelevant number and serves no purpose once the van has left the dealer.
Tare Mass is the total mass of the trailer when not carrying any load, but when ready for service, unoccupied (if relevant) and with all fluid reservoirs (if fitted) filled to nominal capacity except for fuel, which shall be 10 litres only, and with all standard equipment and any options fitted. This includes any mass imposed onto the drawing vehicle when the combination vehicle is resting on a horizontal supporting plane. (Fluid reservoirs do not include water tanks and waste water tanks fitted to caravans
The tare weight stamped on the compliance plate is the measured weight of the dry empty van when it leaves the manufacturer and includes all extras fitted at the factory.
-- Edited by montie on Monday 12th of July 2021 03:13:25 PM
Interesting with aircraft, the word tare is not used, but empty weight.
If you are talking about real shipping containers, those that go on ships, the tare that is marked on the side, back or front are internationally recognised whether dry or a refrigerator container, a quick glance at the scales when I have been carting boxes (containers) tells me that weight is for real, specially the reefer ones as I have done hundreds with meat in them and it needs to match the shipping manifest.
Not a good reference point. You would be a game man turning up at the wharf with a container with wrong weight, like Dougwe says, I can tell you that for free.
After the caravan has been tared,and leaves the factory,ALL added weight is part of its carrying capacity.There is no such thing as "revised tare". Cheers
The plated tare weight when subtracted from the ATM gives you the van's gross payload.
This gross payload must accommodate water and gas, any after market accessories and all your gear.
Interesting though, the tare of the ute includes the tray, and the tray was one of the items I was eyeing off to remove, and fit the canopy direct to the tray channels, this would remove about 80 kg me thinks. But it may not be a legal move, you just cant win.
When it comes to selling which may be on the cards, I just tell the prospective buyers the tare weight, they can tow anything (that's what they told me at the caravan sales).
Iana, your idea about bolting the tray to chassis is to me with no numbers after my name is great start to reducing weight on your ute. Take a step back in time and put wooden runners on also, I can not see it being illegal.
If you are selling the vehicle, sell the vehicle not its physical faults to you and certainly dont offer tare weights.
Absolutely correct.
At the end of the day the only rating that matters is the ATM. Keep your van's measured weight under that and you won't have a problem provided you manage your ball weight. Plated tare assists in the calculation of gross payload at the outset so you can manage ATM.
Tare is easy, it's the vehicle with 20 litres of fuel this will be in the fine print contained within the vehicle brochure. sometime they put only 10 litres of fuel.
It's just the vehicle weight, no passengers, no accessories the unladen weight and minimal fuel.