I really admire persons who think positive about everything they do, see or feel, a bit like a dog where every next moment is the best time of their life. My job at the ripe age of 17 or 18 forgotten, my job was to find things that were wrong, my whole working life has been to find things that are wrong, so I think negatively. I used to have a similar discussion with one of my bosses, and we used to laugh at how it would go, " I have a terrible noise coming from the gearbox", reply" hey man look on the bright side, doesn't the engine sound wonderful".
So if we all had positive thoughts, would there be progress. Would we still be wearing bear skins and carrying spears, because they were wonderful.
Do we need negative thoughts to make improvements, i.e. that way is not efficient, surly we can come up with something better?
What do you think?
dabbler said
10:45 PM Nov 30, 2019
What's wrong with a neutral pov ? Systems and products improve when investigated with an open mind, preferably one that is neutral. Faulty systems and products are best remedied with a troubleshooting approach exploring possibilities not the "I've seen thousands" attitude.
Tony LEE said
03:37 AM Dec 1, 2019
Sure, look at all the pros but a smart person always considers the cons as well. Depending on how critical the outcome is, it might make a lot of sense to give far more weight to the cons
Peter_n_Margaret said
08:34 AM Dec 1, 2019
Or....the best of both worlds "Hey, that's good, but maybe there is an even better way?" . was my working life.
Cheers,
Peter
Izabarack said
09:13 AM Dec 1, 2019
iana wrote: I really admire persons who think positive about everything they do, see or feel,......
My preference is towards outcome directed thinking. Trial and error leads to a whole lot of info on what does not work. Trial and success, on the other hand, leads to desired outcomes. The lesson is in watching babies learn to walk. Through a series of successive approximations, they get closer and closer to the desired outcome until they are running around the place. Trial and success fits as a good comeback to those who go on about "if it ain't broke fix it". So, if we have something that works, can we make it work even batter? I also think that those who trot that one out are somehow saying "I am not smart enough to think of a way to do it better".
Another one I like is "that won't work, we tried that years ago". No more than a statement regarding the capabilities and competence of the last lot that tried it.
And the big one for me is the approach so often put out there by Government - "if the size of the penalty is not sufficient to stop certain behaviours, increase the penalties". The problem of use of mobile phones while driving is an example. Qld is about to more than double the dollar value of the fine. If people want to use their phones while driving, take away the opportunity; cancel their driver's license for a couple of years. Positive thinking is often achieved when we think outside the boundaries imposed by the current system.
Iza
dogbox said
09:34 AM Dec 1, 2019
iana wrote:
I really admire persons who think positive about everything they do, see or feel, a bit like a dog where every next moment is the best time of their life. My job at the ripe age of 17 or 18 forgotten, my job was to find things that were wrong, my whole working life has been to find things that are wrong, so I think negatively. I used to have a similar discussion with one of my bosses, and we used to laugh at how it would go, " I have a terrible noise coming from the gearbox", reply" hey man look on the bright side, doesn't the engine sound wonderful".
So if we all had positive thoughts, would there be progress. Would we still be wearing bear skins and carrying spears, because they were wonderful.
Do we need negative thoughts to make improvements, i.e. that way is not efficient, surly we can come up with something better?
What do you think?
if we were running around in bear skins (koala ??) what would climate change still be an issue?
rgren2 said
10:43 AM Dec 1, 2019
dogbox wrote:
iana wrote:
I really admire persons who think positive about everything they do, see or feel, a bit like a dog where every next moment is the best time of their life. My job at the ripe age of 17 or 18 forgotten, my job was to find things that were wrong, my whole working life has been to find things that are wrong, so I think negatively. I used to have a similar discussion with one of my bosses, and we used to laugh at how it would go, " I have a terrible noise coming from the gearbox", reply" hey man look on the bright side, doesn't the engine sound wonderful".
So if we all had positive thoughts, would there be progress. Would we still be wearing bear skins and carrying spears, because they were wonderful.
Do we need negative thoughts to make improvements, i.e. that way is not efficient, surly we can come up with something better?
What do you think?
if we were running around in bear skins (koala ??) what would climate change still be an issue?
Only if youre running around in bare skins.
Whenarewethere said
11:33 AM Dec 1, 2019
Over the last 5 years designing my car's setup trying to fit everything into a limited space. I have spent a lot of time designing out all the things that could go wrong. Including looking for unknown unknowns! Real negative stuff.
But I really enjoy all the positives, longer range, battery solar & fridge. High speed air for tyres & cleaning car with or without water. Acoustic insulation which was a painful job but worth every cent & minute ripping the car apart, twice!
A few things still went wrong but I don't see it as a negative. One major item was installing a roof platform then getting rid of it, but I simply see it as a learning curve.
In general looking for all the negative things makes things positive in the long run.
iana said
09:08 PM Dec 1, 2019
I'm still reading the posts, interesting so far.
Radar said
11:00 PM Dec 1, 2019
Very interesting.
vanTas said
11:28 PM Dec 1, 2019
Hi Iana,
Your quoted example was not one of negative thinking. It was in fact positive, in that you were already seeking a better way.
A negative thinker says "That is bound to fail. We can't fix it here. It is going to be too costly to fix it anyway. We are all doomed"
Your job was to find the faults before they became a problem. Things could then be put right, even if by someone else. So you were part of the "road to improvement".
It takes a positive thinker to see that things can be done better, whereas a critical thinker sees things as better than they were or could have been and a negative thinker sees only disaster and no chance of progress at all.
Someone who blindly thinks that everything is fine and will be alright, while being a positive thinker, is often also not alert to the possibility of a failure/error. Some will consider these people to be fools.
The trick is to know the situation, realise the possibilities, have a plan B, or C and convince others that all will be ok.
Even a status quo outcome can be better than a small possible improvement in that it is then a known condition. Turn the possible improvement into a certainty if you can and we all win.
villatranquilla said
11:52 PM Dec 1, 2019
I like to turn a negative situation by looking at the positive. An example was on our last trip in QLD spent the night free camping at Jericho. When the car started next morning a noise from the engine bay pointed to a very sick alternator. Thought we'd head back to Barcaldine but as e left Jericho noticed the RACQ depot. Very obliging mechanic said he could have a replacement overnight - so booked into the showgrounds expecting to probably be there at least a couple of days. Knock on the door next morning at 8am - mechanic had the alternator and if we took the car down would fit it straight away. 2 hrs and $600 later we were on our way. Yes it was a pain having to spend $600 but at least we didn't break down away from civilisation as could have easily been the case. Another time when living in Perth the Navara developed a major fuel problem that took 2 weeks to sort and cost $2000 to fix but we had just crossed the Nullabor the week before the vehicle broke down so we were lucky it happened when we got home from our trip and not a week before on the Nullabor.
No matter what happens things could always be worse
-- Edited by villatranquilla on Sunday 1st of December 2019 11:52:45 PM
Whenarewethere said
04:41 PM Dec 2, 2019
This negative situation turned positive when I got it outside permanently!
-- Edited by Whenarewethere on Monday 2nd of December 2019 04:41:49 PM
I think that I am a positive thinker, in respect that if what I had done, does not work out, I am prepared to have another go
I also worry, about stuff, which some may look upon, as negative thinking
I think, (perhaps that is not the correct word to use), I know, (that is a better word), that worrying about stuff, allows me to see that something is wrong, and perhaps think how to try and rectify it
JayDee said
08:56 AM Dec 4, 2019
My view is that perhaps Positive thinking verses Negitive thinking.
is much better summed up by using the old
R.M.A.
R...Right
M...Mental
A...Attitude.
I always used the R.M.A approach in my life and it seems to work for me .
There is also a great saying.
"" Things works out best....for those who make to best ... out of how this work out.""
Jay&Dee
MapleHunter25 said
03:57 PM Dec 5, 2019
You are not talking about negative thinking, you give examples of critical thinking, that is examining information, processes or methods with a view to establishing credibility or validity and identifying possible improvements, in other words professionalism.
I hope we never fully embrace the American approach of 'positive' thinking over all else, although we seem to be working on it. It leads to terrible consequences eg. Trump.
-- Edited by MapleHunter25 on Thursday 5th of December 2019 04:00:21 PM
Valkie said
08:58 PM Dec 5, 2019
Pessimists can be pleasantly surprised, or even ecstatic in their situation.
Optimists can only be disappointed.
montie said
07:48 AM Dec 15, 2019
There's a positive outlook, a negative outlook, and then there's reality.
Aus-Kiwi said
12:46 PM Dec 15, 2019
My glass is half full
-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Sunday 15th of December 2019 12:48:36 PM
I really admire persons who think positive about everything they do, see or feel, a bit like a dog where every next moment is the best time of their life. My job at the ripe age of 17 or 18 forgotten, my job was to find things that were wrong, my whole working life has been to find things that are wrong, so I think negatively. I used to have a similar discussion with one of my bosses, and we used to laugh at how it would go, " I have a terrible noise coming from the gearbox", reply" hey man look on the bright side, doesn't the engine sound wonderful".
So if we all had positive thoughts, would there be progress. Would we still be wearing bear skins and carrying spears, because they were wonderful.
Do we need negative thoughts to make improvements, i.e. that way is not efficient, surly we can come up with something better?
What do you think?
Cheers,
Peter
My preference is towards outcome directed thinking. Trial and error leads to a whole lot of info on what does not work. Trial and success, on the other hand, leads to desired outcomes. The lesson is in watching babies learn to walk. Through a series of successive approximations, they get closer and closer to the desired outcome until they are running around the place. Trial and success fits as a good comeback to those who go on about "if it ain't broke fix it". So, if we have something that works, can we make it work even batter? I also think that those who trot that one out are somehow saying "I am not smart enough to think of a way to do it better".
Another one I like is "that won't work, we tried that years ago". No more than a statement regarding the capabilities and competence of the last lot that tried it.
And the big one for me is the approach so often put out there by Government - "if the size of the penalty is not sufficient to stop certain behaviours, increase the penalties". The problem of use of mobile phones while driving is an example. Qld is about to more than double the dollar value of the fine. If people want to use their phones while driving, take away the opportunity; cancel their driver's license for a couple of years. Positive thinking is often achieved when we think outside the boundaries imposed by the current system.
Iza
if we were running around in bear skins (koala ??) what would climate change still be an issue?
Only if youre running around in bare skins.
Over the last 5 years designing my car's setup trying to fit everything into a limited space. I have spent a lot of time designing out all the things that could go wrong. Including looking for unknown unknowns! Real negative stuff.
But I really enjoy all the positives, longer range, battery solar & fridge. High speed air for tyres & cleaning car with or without water. Acoustic insulation which was a painful job but worth every cent & minute ripping the car apart, twice!
A few things still went wrong but I don't see it as a negative. One major item was installing a roof platform then getting rid of it, but I simply see it as a learning curve.
In general looking for all the negative things makes things positive in the long run.
Very interesting.
Hi Iana,
Your quoted example was not one of negative thinking. It was in fact positive, in that you were already seeking a better way.
A negative thinker says "That is bound to fail. We can't fix it here. It is going to be too costly to fix it anyway. We are all doomed"
Your job was to find the faults before they became a problem. Things could then be put right, even if by someone else. So you were part of the "road to improvement".
It takes a positive thinker to see that things can be done better, whereas a critical thinker sees things as better than they were or could have been and a negative thinker sees only disaster and no chance of progress at all.
Someone who blindly thinks that everything is fine and will be alright, while being a positive thinker, is often also not alert to the possibility of a failure/error. Some will consider these people to be fools.
The trick is to know the situation, realise the possibilities, have a plan B, or C and convince others that all will be ok.
Even a status quo outcome can be better than a small possible improvement in that it is then a known condition. Turn the possible improvement into a certainty if you can and we all win.
I like to turn a negative situation by looking at the positive. An example was on our last trip in QLD spent the night free camping at Jericho. When the car started next morning a noise from the engine bay pointed to a very sick alternator. Thought we'd head back to Barcaldine but as e left Jericho noticed the RACQ depot. Very obliging mechanic said he could have a replacement overnight - so booked into the showgrounds expecting to probably be there at least a couple of days. Knock on the door next morning at 8am - mechanic had the alternator and if we took the car down would fit it straight away. 2 hrs and $600 later we were on our way. Yes it was a pain having to spend $600 but at least we didn't break down away from civilisation as could have easily been the case.
Another time when living in Perth the Navara developed a major fuel problem that took 2 weeks to sort and cost $2000 to fix but we had just crossed the Nullabor the week before the vehicle broke down so we were lucky it happened when we got home from our trip and not a week before on the Nullabor.
No matter what happens things could always be worse
-- Edited by villatranquilla on Sunday 1st of December 2019 11:52:45 PM
This negative situation turned positive when I got it outside permanently!
-- Edited by Whenarewethere on Monday 2nd of December 2019 04:41:49 PM
I also worry, about stuff, which some may look upon, as negative thinking
I think, (perhaps that is not the correct word to use), I know, (that is a better word), that worrying about stuff, allows me to see that something is wrong, and perhaps think how to try and rectify it
My view is that perhaps Positive thinking verses Negitive thinking.
is much better summed up by using the old
R.M.A.
R...Right
M...Mental
A...Attitude.
I always used the R.M.A approach in my life and it seems to work for me .
There is also a great saying.
"" Things works out best....for those who make to best ... out of how this work out.""
Jay&Dee
You are not talking about negative thinking, you give examples of critical thinking, that is examining information, processes or methods with a view to establishing credibility or validity and identifying possible improvements, in other words professionalism.
I hope we never fully embrace the American approach of 'positive' thinking over all else, although we seem to be working on it. It leads to terrible consequences eg. Trump.
-- Edited by MapleHunter25 on Thursday 5th of December 2019 04:00:21 PM
-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Sunday 15th of December 2019 12:48:36 PM