I am seeking to see if anyone out there, has come up with a good idea to purify water from the likes of Dams, Creeks, Rivers etc.. I can pump into the tanks using a 12V pump, but wanting to see if there is a good system to use to purify the water before it heads into the tanks.. Something that's works well and is cheap.
Branchie
Whenarewethere said
07:18 AM Mar 29, 2019
At home our 4 stage under bench filter is not cheap. But probably worth taking into consideration is the life of a filter.
Our filter says to replace the filter after 2000 litres of water from a clean supply. ie good town water. If the water is of poorer quality replace it more often.
$140 each time!
Also it takes 3 minutes to fill a 5 litre container! I fill quite a few of these when we head off to the bush.
Izabarack said
08:20 AM Mar 29, 2019
How pure do you want it? I have cleaned up water from the Cooper Creek for us to use for washing and showering and dish washing. I do more purifying if I intend to drink it.
Iza
Peter_n_Margaret said
09:34 AM Mar 29, 2019
We regularly pump water from creeks and the like. We don't filter it on the way into our tanks, but that could be done with a 10" 5um sediment filter. We chlorinate all water we put into the tanks with sodium hypochlorite. That is important. That kills most biological contaminates and is what is done to all town water. Then after the pump and immediately before the taps the water goes through a twin 10" filter. The first element is a 5um sediment filter and the second is a 0.5um or 1 um active carbon/silver element. The active carbon will remove any remaining biological contaminants and many chemical contaminants including any remaining chlorine. This process produces water that is totally safe for drinking, but it is important to keep the chlorine levels maintained as it naturally breaks down quite quickly.
The twin 10" filter housings are available for about $60, the replacement sediment filters are about $10 and the replacement carbon/silver filters are about $35 and both are widely available. They are much cheaper than the BEST brand and style and have greater filtering capacity.
If possible, avoid cloudy water. The filters above will make it clear and safe for drinking, but the sediment removed will use up the capacity of the filter elements much more quickly.
If you can not avoid it, it is possible to settle out the cloudy material by adding a tiny amount of alum to a bucket full and letting it stand for a while. We carry a small amount of alum for this purpose. Cheers, Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Friday 29th of March 2019 09:36:04 AM
Yuglamron said
10:25 AM Mar 29, 2019
I concur with all you say about filters etc but I'm not sure about the adding of the deflocculent Alum to clear cloudy water.
It has been linked to Alzheimers and the jury is still out on that one.
Izabarack said
10:29 AM Mar 29, 2019
I know of one outback situation that pumps raw river water through a reasonably course screen into one of two 150,000 litre tanks supplying a pub/fuel station/general store complex. The newly filled tank is treated with Alum and left sit for a couple of days. The Alum treated tank contents are then pumped from a suspended pick up into the other tank and treated with a measured amount of Sodium Hypochlorite. The water from the supply tank is then used in the same manner as town water would be used.
Complex owner is often amused by travellers sneaking water containers into the showers to get a bit of free water for their RV tanks.
The settling tank is siphoned out maybe once a month. Operator drops an electric outboard into the tank to create a vortex then puts the siphon pick up into the centre of the tank and on the bottom of the tank. Method seems to work very well and the settled contents end up as new top soil in the local vegie garden.
Iza
Izabarack said
10:36 AM Mar 29, 2019
Yuglamron wrote:
It has been linked to Alzheimers and the jury is still out on that one.
Same jury looking at the Anti-vaxer's claims?
Alum is used in lots of water treatment plants supplying town water to major cities across the country. I was told about using Alum as a settling treatment for suspended clay by the manager of a town water treatment plant.
Iza
jrg said
10:57 AM Mar 29, 2019
Few year back saw an older couple living the dream in a very old van with a portable solar desal setup .Going to be hard to explain but he could do about 30 ltrs per day was bout the size of a solar panel worked I guess on a similar theory dirty water in the top which ran down the solar heated panel which caused condensation on to the thick plastic top and then collected the remaining dirty water and residue was returned to the source, He claimed he could turn salt into fresh water and had got it from a mob in Adelaide
Peter_n_Margaret said
11:19 AM Mar 29, 2019
jrg wrote:
Few year back saw an older couple living the dream in a very old van with a portable solar desal setup .Going to be hard to explain but he could do about 30 ltrs per day was bout the size of a solar panel worked I guess on a similar theory dirty water in the top which ran down the solar heated panel which caused condensation on to the thick plastic top and then collected the remaining dirty water and residue was returned to the source, He claimed he could turn salt into fresh water and had got it from a mob in Adelaide
Yes, they were developed and promoted in Adelaide 2 or 3 decades ago and they do work, but they are relatively large and heavy and not something that we would carry "just in case".
Cheers,
Peter
Peter_n_Margaret said
11:52 AM Mar 29, 2019
Yuglamron wrote:
I concur with all you say about filters etc but I'm not sure about the adding of the deflocculent Alum to clear cloudy water.
It has been linked to Alzheimers and the jury is still out on that one.
Some or the softest & nicest water I had was in Sydney off the roof straight out of a 10,000 litre rain water tank, with bit of possum & bird poo from the roof. Never got sick.
Peter_n_Margaret said
02:46 PM Mar 29, 2019
Whenarewethere wrote:
Some or the softest & nicest water I had was in Sydney off the roof straight out of a 10,000 litre rain water tank, with bit of possum & bird poo from the roof. Never got sick.
Humans become accustomed to their water supply.
What does not make you sick today can make someone else very ill. People who travel to places like India know this very well, but it also applies particularly to water from untreated sources as we travel within Australia.
The other thing that can catch travellers out even in Australia is filling tanks from treated town water supplies from a tap in a pipe that does not get used regularly. The water that sits in a pipe for a week can grow biological contaminants after the chlorine has broken down which only takes a few days at most.
So, if you are in the habit of not treating your drinking water, fill from a source that is well used.
ps..EDIT.. softness or hardness is no indication of the biological safety or otherwise of water. It is related to the minerals dissolved in it and they are mostly (but not always) harmless.
Cheers,
Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Friday 29th of March 2019 02:48:22 PM
Whenarewethere said
02:59 PM Mar 29, 2019
I worked with someone who's parents lived in India. He stopped going there as he was sick & tired of getting seriously bad tummy issues!
We never drink directly from our water containers to avoid contamination, or cross contamination when filling up from a larger container. Always use a cup which at worst will dry quickly.
People don't seem to be aware that simply putting chlorine in water does not help in the long run. It's gone quickly & you are back at square one!
KFT said
05:57 PM Mar 29, 2019
Whenarewethere wrote:
Some or the softest & nicest water I had was in Sydney off the roof straight out of a 10,000 litre rain water tank, with bit of possum & bird poo from the roof. Never got sick.
We rely on tank water where we live. There is no town water. We always take a 100litre bladder filled with our water for drinking. Rain water is the sweetest most thirst quenching water you can drink. It is natural and contains all the trace elements and nutrients you need and all for free.
If you think about where we drank from before modern civilisation then filtered rainwater is a pretty good compromise I reckon.
Frank
PeterD said
09:09 AM Mar 30, 2019
If you are going to pump the water into your vans tanks then I assume you wish to drink it. The only way you can "purify" the water for drinking quickly is with a reverse osmosis filter. They are not cheap.
Peter_n_Margaret said
09:32 AM Mar 30, 2019
Chlorination and microfiltration only take minutes and that is better treatment than happens with town water.
Reverse osmosis is effective but it is also slow and requires considerable power.
Cheers,
Peter
yobarr said
10:16 AM Mar 30, 2019
Peter_n_Margaret wrote:
Chlorination and microfiltration only take minutes and that is better treatment than happens with town water. Reverse osmosis is effective but it is also slow and requires considerable power. Cheers, Peter
And it removes all the essential minerals from the water,which then have to be replaced using either pills or a remineralising cartidge which replaces the minerals you have just removed.And,as Peter says,it is very slow,needs storage tanks,and takes up heaps of space.Cheers
Aus-Kiwi said
12:23 PM Mar 30, 2019
Ours is filtered and boiled for Atleast 3 minutes. Then stored in fridge after cooling
for drinking .,
.
dieseltojo said
03:07 PM Mar 30, 2019
If you can look up the Bush tracker site they offer a purification plant as an extra.
The owner of Bushtracker almost died years ago drinking from what appeared a nice fresh stream.
This will not happen to any of our members cos that's what some have done all their lives and none have died.....Unbelievable.....
terriwa said
01:09 AM Mar 31, 2019
peter n margaret
any chances of some photos of your set up.
Greg.
Peter_n_Margaret said
10:04 AM Mar 31, 2019
terriwa wrote:
peter n margaret
any chances of some photos of your set up.
Greg.
It is all under the floor so that is difficult and won't show you anything, but it is nothing special except that I have 2 separate systems for drinking and washing water and I pressure fill to the bottom of the tanks. Standard RV pump and standard twin 10" filter housing. Happy to answer specific questions.
Cheers,
Peter
dieseltojo said
12:07 PM Apr 1, 2019
It a great idea Peter and you have control so thar river water for a shower won't mix i with the drinking supply.
I have similar with a charcoal filter under the sink to a drinking tap that can get a kettle under. It is a bit slow as it is a fine filter but works well. These days twin filters can be purchased cheaper than what I installed.
-- Edited by dieseltojo on Monday 1st of April 2019 12:08:14 PM
Dougwe said
12:33 PM Apr 1, 2019
KFT wrote:
Whenarewethere wrote:
Some or the softest & nicest water I had was in Sydney off the roof straight out of a 10,000 litre rain water tank, with bit of possum & bird poo from the roof. Never got sick.
We rely on tank water where we live. There is no town water. We always take a 100litre bladder filled with our water for drinking. Rain water is the sweetest most thirst quenching water you can drink. It is natural and contains all the trace elements and nutrients you need and all for free.
If you think about where we drank from before modern civilisation then filtered rainwater is a pretty good compromise I reckon.
Frank
You only like it cos of the additives KFC. Things like, bird doo doo, possum pee and that dead rat floating around in the tank
I have take a note of the water you use in case you ever offer me a cuppa, mate
Peter_n_Margaret said
02:39 PM Apr 1, 2019
dieseltojo wrote:
It a great idea Peter and you have control so thar river water for a shower won't mix i with the drinking supply.
We still chlorinate ALL water, because there is still a risk of legionella from showers.
Hi crew
I am seeking to see if anyone out there, has come up with a good idea to purify water from the likes of Dams, Creeks, Rivers etc.. I can pump into the tanks using a 12V pump, but wanting to see if there is a good system to use to purify the water before it heads into the tanks.. Something that's works well and is cheap.
Branchie
At home our 4 stage under bench filter is not cheap. But probably worth taking into consideration is the life of a filter.
Our filter says to replace the filter after 2000 litres of water from a clean supply. ie good town water. If the water is of poorer quality replace it more often.
$140 each time!
Also it takes 3 minutes to fill a 5 litre container! I fill quite a few of these when we head off to the bush.
Iza
We regularly pump water from creeks and the like.
We don't filter it on the way into our tanks, but that could be done with a 10" 5um sediment filter.
We chlorinate all water we put into the tanks with sodium hypochlorite. That is important. That kills most biological contaminates and is what is done to all town water.
Then after the pump and immediately before the taps the water goes through a twin 10" filter. The first element is a 5um sediment filter and the second is a 0.5um or 1 um active carbon/silver element. The active carbon will remove any remaining biological contaminants and many chemical contaminants including any remaining chlorine.
This process produces water that is totally safe for drinking, but it is important to keep the chlorine levels maintained as it naturally breaks down quite quickly.
The twin 10" filter housings are available for about $60, the replacement sediment filters are about $10 and the replacement carbon/silver filters are about $35 and both are widely available. They are much cheaper than the BEST brand and style and have greater filtering capacity.
If possible, avoid cloudy water. The filters above will make it clear and safe for drinking, but the sediment removed will use up the capacity of the filter elements much more quickly.
If you can not avoid it, it is possible to settle out the cloudy material by adding a tiny amount of alum to a bucket full and letting it stand for a while. We carry a small amount of alum for this purpose.
Cheers,
Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Friday 29th of March 2019 09:36:04 AM
I concur with all you say about filters etc but I'm not sure about the adding of the deflocculent Alum to clear cloudy water.
It has been linked to Alzheimers and the jury is still out on that one.
Complex owner is often amused by travellers sneaking water containers into the showers to get a bit of free water for their RV tanks.
The settling tank is siphoned out maybe once a month. Operator drops an electric outboard into the tank to create a vortex then puts the siphon pick up into the centre of the tank and on the bottom of the tank. Method seems to work very well and the settled contents end up as new top soil in the local vegie garden.
Iza
Same jury looking at the Anti-vaxer's claims?
Alum is used in lots of water treatment plants supplying town water to major cities across the country. I was told about using Alum as a settling treatment for suspended clay by the manager of a town water treatment plant.
Iza
Yes, they were developed and promoted in Adelaide 2 or 3 decades ago and they do work, but they are relatively large and heavy and not something that we would carry "just in case".
Cheers,
Peter
https://www.hunterwater.com.au/Resources/Documents/Fact-Sheets/Water-Quality/ALUM-IN-DRINKING-WATER_MAR2011.pdf
Cheers,
Peter
Some or the softest & nicest water I had was in Sydney off the roof straight out of a 10,000 litre rain water tank, with bit of possum & bird poo from the roof. Never got sick.
Humans become accustomed to their water supply.
What does not make you sick today can make someone else very ill. People who travel to places like India know this very well, but it also applies particularly to water from untreated sources as we travel within Australia.
The other thing that can catch travellers out even in Australia is filling tanks from treated town water supplies from a tap in a pipe that does not get used regularly. The water that sits in a pipe for a week can grow biological contaminants after the chlorine has broken down which only takes a few days at most.
So, if you are in the habit of not treating your drinking water, fill from a source that is well used.
ps..EDIT.. softness or hardness is no indication of the biological safety or otherwise of water. It is related to the minerals dissolved in it and they are mostly (but not always) harmless.
Cheers,
Peter
-- Edited by Peter_n_Margaret on Friday 29th of March 2019 02:48:22 PM
I worked with someone who's parents lived in India. He stopped going there as he was sick & tired of getting seriously bad tummy issues!
We never drink directly from our water containers to avoid contamination, or cross contamination when filling up from a larger container. Always use a cup which at worst will dry quickly.
People don't seem to be aware that simply putting chlorine in water does not help in the long run. It's gone quickly & you are back at square one!
We rely on tank water where we live. There is no town water. We always take a 100litre bladder filled with our water for drinking. Rain water is the sweetest most thirst quenching water you can drink. It is natural and contains all the trace elements and nutrients you need and all for free.
If you think about where we drank from before modern civilisation then filtered rainwater is a pretty good compromise I reckon.
Frank
If you are going to pump the water into your vans tanks then I assume you wish to drink it. The only way you can "purify" the water for drinking quickly is with a reverse osmosis filter. They are not cheap.
Reverse osmosis is effective but it is also slow and requires considerable power.
Cheers,
Peter
And it removes all the essential minerals from the water,which then have to be replaced using either pills or a remineralising cartidge which replaces the minerals you have just removed.And,as Peter says,it is very slow,needs storage tanks,and takes up heaps of space.Cheers
for drinking .,
.
If you can look up the Bush tracker site they offer a purification plant as an extra.
The owner of Bushtracker almost died years ago drinking from what appeared a nice fresh stream.
This will not happen to any of our members cos that's what some have done all their lives and none have died.....Unbelievable.....
peter n margaret
any chances of some photos of your set up.
Greg.
It is all under the floor so that is difficult and won't show you anything, but it is nothing special except that I have 2 separate systems for drinking and washing water and I pressure fill to the bottom of the tanks. Standard RV pump and standard twin 10" filter housing. Happy to answer specific questions.
Cheers,
Peter
It a great idea Peter and you have control so thar river water for a shower won't mix i with the drinking supply.
I have similar with a charcoal filter under the sink to a drinking tap that can get a kettle under. It is a bit slow as it is a fine filter but works well. These days twin filters can be purchased cheaper than what I installed.
-- Edited by dieseltojo on Monday 1st of April 2019 12:08:14 PM
You only like it cos of the additives KFC. Things like, bird doo doo, possum pee and that dead rat floating around in the tank
I have take a note of the water you use in case you ever offer me a cuppa, mate
We still chlorinate ALL water, because there is still a risk of legionella from showers.
Cheers,
Peter