'But for future generations, the outlook in terms of grey nomadism being a viable retirement lifestyle is not especially bright'
Lily2018 said
07:06 PM Dec 10, 2018
Just a first thought on this article: how many grey nomads spend $770 a week? Sure, RV drivers as a whole might spend that but I highly doubt that the average grey nomad does.
I'll get back to reading the whole paper when I have time.
rockylizard said
07:35 PM Dec 10, 2018
Lily2018 wrote:
Just a first thought on this article: how many grey nomads spend $770 a week? Sure, RV drivers as a whole might spend that but I highly doubt that the average grey nomad does.
I'll get back to reading the whole paper when I have time.
Gday...
In the article in the link you will see that $770 is the figure bandied about by the CMCA when they are engaging councils and business groups in towns when they are canvassing for the community to provide a rest spot for fully-self-contained travellers.
They maintain that the figure is arrived at by 'surveys' of travellers and the actual receipts their members have spent and are handed in at various CMCA rallies. As a result many councils refer to GNs as 'travelling wallets'.
Interestingly, CMCA (I am fairly confident) don't do that canvassing of communities or towns etc as much (or at all) these days as they are fully engaged in buying or leasing plots of ground within communities, and obtain all the necessary planning and development permissions, so that they then provide the spots to their members to camp in - for a fee of about $10/night.
$770 per week represents $40,000 per annum ... I travel full time and I can very much assure you I don't spend $770 a week and I definitely do not have a disposable annual income that goes anywhere near $40,000.
Cheers - stay well, be frugal and enjoy the journey - John
PS - and this news article has also been posted in I Digress by Tony & Bev.
montie said
07:42 PM Dec 10, 2018
I think a lot of councils are now waking up to this.
The amount of money spent by grey nomads is grossly overstated and has been for a long time. You can only hoodwink local councils for so long!
Desert Dweller said
07:49 PM Dec 10, 2018
rockylizard wrote:
Lily2018 wrote:
Just a first thought on this article: how many grey nomads spend $770 a week? Sure, RV drivers as a whole might spend that but I highly doubt that the average grey nomad does.
I'll get back to reading the whole paper when I have time.
Gday...
In the article in the link you will see that $770 is the figure bandied about by the CMCA when they are engaging councils and business groups in towns when they are canvassing for the community to provide a rest spot for fully-self-contained travellers.
They maintain that the figure is arrived at by 'surveys' of travellers and the actual receipts their members have spent and are handed in at various CMCA rallies. As a result many councils refer to GNs as 'travelling wallets'.
Interestingly, CMCA (I am fairly confident) don't do that canvassing of communities or towns etc as much (or at all) these days as they are fully engaged in buying or leasing plots of ground within communities, and obtain all the necessary planning and development permissions, so that they then provide the spots to their members to camp in - for a fee of about $10/night.
$770 per week represents $40,000 per annum ... I travel full time and I can very much assure you I don't spend $770 a week and I definitely do not have a disposable annual income that goes anywhere near $40,000.
Cheers - stay well, be frugal and enjoy the journey - John
PS - and this news article has also been posted in I Digress by Tony & Bev.
Totally agree Rocky. We've been retired for 8 years & have never spent anywhere near $40,000 per annum. 6 months at home & a total of 6 months away.
Predominantly caravaning with a bit of tenting when using our boat that we've owned for 20 years.
Our one & only luxury each year is a 3 week fly/hire car trip to a place that we can't be bothered driving to. Funded by the interest on our modest investment.
PeterX said
07:55 PM Dec 10, 2018
RE "...how many grey nomads spend $770 a week..." Even spending a lot less, it is still attractive to country areas, who need every dollar they can get , spent in local community.
rockylizard said
08:04 PM Dec 10, 2018
PeterX wrote:
RE "...how many grey nomads spend $770 a week..." Even spending a lot less, it is still attractive to country areas, who need every dollar they can get , spent in local community.
Gday...
Ya dead right PeterX ... the $$$ spent by travellers in towns is very often critical to the ongoing viability of some small towns - they are glad to get any 'GN income'.
However, the larger towns, particularly the east coast cities, become a little disappointed when very few of the 'travelling wallets' actually spend those $770 bundles.
Most just buy some tucker, a bitta fuel, and praps a bit at the pub or tourist attraction.
The lower $$$ spent in towns is still valuable, but ultimately the larger sum bandied about has worked against the ongoing support from communities and councils for the provision, and continuance, of free 'camps' for travellers - all and sundry - the good and the bad.
OH, and we have drifted off topic - how naughty of me. I sort of agree that the 'younger generation/s' may not have the wherewithal to follow in our footsteps - tyre tracks.
But none of us can actually see the future - diesel is being killed off, electric vehicles taking over, what of caravans - so who knows what myriad of circumstances will influence the choices of following generations.
cheers - John
-- Edited by rockylizard on Monday 10th of December 2018 08:10:32 PM
Dickodownunder said
08:06 PM Dec 10, 2018
Yes, we are as we are the only generation that has saved dilligently for our retirement. For goodness sake can you imagine anyone from the new age actually wanting to live on only $770.00 per week.
Now before I get beaten over the head with a wet lettuce I need to say that this is Tongue In Cheek. and is only meant as a light hearted joke.
Please note that very little punctuation was able to be entered in this post.
Whenarewethere said
08:42 PM Dec 10, 2018
We got our first mortgage at 17% & paid vast amounts of interest over the years, anyway!
Over 3 months & 17715 km we spent $650 pw of that $250 was petrol 1857 litres, 3 nights in Perth, a boat trip in Katherine Gorge, about 10 caravan park camping fees. NP camping fees.
But mostly food, water, a replacement tyre. A few meals out. Did another 9500 km 2 month holiday over summer.
We will have to cut back while at home as we are running ahead of our long term living costs. If we have to spend more on holidays we will cut back as number one priority is keeping the roof over our heads.
Mike Harding said
09:50 PM Dec 10, 2018
Probably.
Tony Bev said
09:54 PM Dec 10, 2018
I certainly do not spend anywhere near $770 a week, when travelling
Perhaps the CMCA or whoever is giving these figures out, should be a bit more realistic
On the other hand, how do we know, were the CMCA got their numbers from
If I had to stay in caravan parks each and every night, then it would not be too far beyond a possibility, that with my (usually) long distance, and the wife puffing her ciggys, to spend that amount
Whenarewethere said
10:26 PM Dec 10, 2018
Over summer 2 month holiday we spent about $800 on cappuccinos! Last holiday went back to grinding our own & saved a bucket load. Still bought a modest number of cups!
Over summer 2 month holiday we spent about $800 on cappuccinos! Last holiday went back to grinding our own & saved a bucket load. Still bought a modest number of cups!
I suppose that you now smash your own avocados too. LOL
Farmhat said
01:52 AM Dec 11, 2018
Are we the last generation of grey nomads? Great question.
Perhaps so - in it's current form. It will be very interesting to see what it looks like in 20 or 30 years.
I am sure though that people will always travel, in one form or other.
Joe
Desert Dweller said
05:05 AM Dec 11, 2018
What about bald nomads, where do they stand?
Lily2018 said
05:35 AM Dec 11, 2018
From the article: "Grey nomad is a term used to describe Australians over 55 years old who travel for an extended time from weeks to months and cover more than 300 kilometres in a day across semi-arid and coastal Australia."
I didn't know this was the definition of a grey nomad.
How many grey nomads travel every day, never mind 300 kls? Surely like many here, people tend to pull up in the one spot for days/weeks/months. Interesting reading when going through all the links.
And as so many have said, figuring out how much it will cost to be a grey nomad (or bald or those of us who might use some assistance with our hair colour!) is like asking how long a piece of string is.
Whenarewethere said
06:40 AM Dec 11, 2018
Last 3 holidays averaged about 170 km per day. We don't stay put long, but we really would not want to be driving any more than we are. It is too tiring & simply not safe to do more week after week. When we feel that is enough we stop for the day, apart from regular stops to stretch.
The longest single drive was well over 2 hours just getting out of Sydney (& return), then we had our first break on the outskirts!
The last holiday we spent 2.6 hours a day on average driving & our cruising speed is typically 93 kph for fuel efficiency, 73 kph average for the trip, that was enough driving for us. Cars these days give you all the basic data so why not make the best use of it.
We put all our trip data on a spreadsheet. So we are well short of the 300 km definition!
Greystone said
12:00 PM Dec 11, 2018
Some of the younger generation are already adopting a sort of nomadic lifestyle. The "Van life" and to a lesser extent the "Tiny house" movements are expressions of wanting (or only being able to afford) less and enjoying a simpler life.
Dougwe said
06:01 PM Dec 11, 2018
Desert Dweller wrote:
What about bald nomads, where do they stand?
In the shade.
Nah! They stay out in the sun to keep charged because the bald head is a solar panel for a sex machine.
Whenarewethere said
06:07 PM Dec 11, 2018
& no vitamin D supplements required!
JayDee said
08:10 AM Dec 12, 2018
We could/would never spend anything like $770 a week when on the road.
Of course if one wants to take into account the normal running expenses of our household / lifestyle budget then ours exceed the nominated figure.
Our recurring debts on things like rates - insurances -rego for 3 vehicles - etc etc blows the $770 out of the budget park.
Jesus, our private health is a whooping $100 a week. But...... it has been a blessing for us.
Anyway one can not take it with us.
Jay&Dee
Lily2018 said
10:53 AM Dec 12, 2018
rockylizard wrote:
Lily2018 wrote:
Just a first thought on this article: how many grey nomads spend $770 a week? Sure, RV drivers as a whole might spend that but I highly doubt that the average grey nomad does.
I'll get back to reading the whole paper when I have time.
Gday...
In the article in the link you will see that $770 is the figure bandied about by the CMCA when they are engaging councils and business groups in towns when they are canvassing for the community to provide a rest spot for fully-self-contained travellers.
They maintain that the figure is arrived at by 'surveys' of travellers and the actual receipts their members have spent and are handed in at various CMCA rallies. As a result many councils refer to GNs as 'travelling wallets'.
Interestingly, CMCA (I am fairly confident) don't do that canvassing of communities or towns etc as much (or at all) these days as they are fully engaged in buying or leasing plots of ground within communities, and obtain all the necessary planning and development permissions, so that they then provide the spots to their members to camp in - for a fee of about $10/night.
$770 per week represents $40,000 per annum ... I travel full time and I can very much assure you I don't spend $770 a week and I definitely do not have a disposable annual income that goes anywhere near $40,000.
Cheers - stay well, be frugal and enjoy the journey - John
PS - and this news article has also been posted in I Digress by Tony & Bev.
Couldn't agree more Rocky. I'm a member of the CMCA and am tempted to ask where they get this figure from but should probably keep my nose out of it just in case I cause a fuss.
I'm looking at buying and living full time in a motorhome next year and there is no way I would expect to spend $770 a week. I don't do takeaways, coffee, etc now so don't expect to in the future and while I might do a 'touristy' thing every now and then, it certainly wouldn't be the usual. I would expect to pull up in the one place, if I liked it, for some weeks so it would be mainly the usual food, internet access, etc I use now so can't see that coming to $770 pw.
Just depends on what you want and can afford.
Lily2018 said
11:03 AM Dec 12, 2018
JayDee wrote:
We could/would never spend anything like $770 a week when on the road.
Of course if one wants to take into account the normal running expenses of our household / lifestyle budget then ours exceed the nominated figure.
Our recurring debts on things like rates - insurances -rego for 3 vehicles - etc etc blows the $770 out of the budget park.
Jesus, our private health is a whooping $100 a week. But...... it has been a blessing for us.
Anyway one can not take it with us.
Jay&Dee
Hi JayDee
Your post only goes to show how different each of our situations are. i.e. how many vehicles we own, whether we still own a home so have rates etc.
Cupie said
12:55 PM Dec 12, 2018
Lily2018 wrote:
JayDee wrote:
We could/would never spend anything like $770 a week when on the road.
Of course if one wants to take into account the normal running expenses of our household / lifestyle budget then ours exceed the nominated figure.
Our recurring debts on things like rates - insurances -rego for 3 vehicles - etc etc blows the $770 out of the budget park.
Jesus, our private health is a whooping $100 a week. But...... it has been a blessing for us.
Anyway one can not take it with us.
Jay&Dee
Hi JayDee
Your post only goes to show how different each of our situations are. i.e. how many vehicles we own, whether we still own a home so have rates etc.
I'm with JayDee on this. My 3 vehicles include the caravan & I continually bemoan the cost of Health Insurance but after all these years am not game to let it go especially as I approach my 78th year.
My rather modest but comfortable way of life requires a budget in excess of the CMCA figure, but if we were on the road full time without a house I believe that we could & would live on much less.
We are 'fortunate' in that we have the choice at present.
Whenarewethere said
03:59 PM Dec 12, 2018
I've been living for years on a limited income by choice so am good at not wasting money. Having said that I don't feel I go without by any means.
If one is moving from a full time job I think it will be challenging to budget for the new reality. Maybe the last couple of working years live on a "retirement" income & put the cash away so you are more prepared for the change. You will start to find so many things you really do not need.
Damon said
02:14 PM Dec 14, 2018
I would have thought we would be the last generation of grey nomads simply because of the price and availability of fuel in the future.
I can't see the next generation being able to afford to travel like we have been able to.
Wizardofoz said
09:48 AM Dec 16, 2018
Whether we are the last or not, it certainly will be different for future generations.
On the weekly spend, I would certainly be one of the ones who do spend more than $770pw, because of my wifes health problem, I only use caravan parks and always use ensuite sited when available, in Cairns Last year in peak time the site hire alone was a very high $110 per night ($770) and I stayed for 5 weeks, averaging it out across the board and all parks and costs, I suppose that my total spend would exceed $1000 per week. My wifes condition has deteriorated and so I didnt caravan this year but leased a home instead which wasnt any cheaper...I look at this way, we were pretty frugal all our lives, saved, invested ans lived a rather modest lifestyle, reflecting back now, I ask myself, was it worth it?...probably not! Nevertheless, my intention now is just enjoy whats left our travelling lives and to hell with the cost. The kids will get some investments but buggered if the money is going their way too, if thats selfish, too bad, its now our time and its late twilight...and time is so precious now.
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Sunday 16th of December 2018 09:53:37 AM
ABC opinion: Are we seeing the last generations of grey nomads?
https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-10/how-the-grey-nomad-lifestyle-may-change/10599340
'But for future generations, the outlook in terms of grey nomadism being a viable retirement lifestyle is not especially bright'
I'll get back to reading the whole paper when I have time.
Gday...
In the article in the link you will see that $770 is the figure bandied about by the CMCA when they are engaging councils and business groups in towns when they are canvassing for the community to provide a rest spot for fully-self-contained travellers.
They maintain that the figure is arrived at by 'surveys' of travellers and the actual receipts their members have spent and are handed in at various CMCA rallies. As a result many councils refer to GNs as 'travelling wallets'.
Interestingly, CMCA (I am fairly confident) don't do that canvassing of communities or towns etc as much (or at all) these days as they are fully engaged in buying or leasing plots of ground within communities, and obtain all the necessary planning and development permissions, so that they then provide the spots to their members to camp in - for a fee of about $10/night.
$770 per week represents $40,000 per annum ... I travel full time and I can very much assure you I don't spend $770 a week and I definitely do not have a disposable annual income that goes anywhere near $40,000.
Cheers - stay well, be frugal
and enjoy the journey - John
PS - and this news article has also been posted in I Digress by Tony & Bev.
I think a lot of councils are now waking up to this.
The amount of money spent by grey nomads is grossly overstated and has been for a long time. You can only hoodwink local councils for so long!
Totally agree Rocky. We've been retired for 8 years & have never spent anywhere near $40,000 per annum. 6 months at home & a total of 6 months away.
Predominantly caravaning with a bit of tenting when using our boat that we've owned for 20 years.
Our one & only luxury each year is a 3 week fly/hire car trip to a place that we can't be bothered driving to. Funded by the interest on our modest investment.
Gday...
Ya dead right PeterX ... the $$$ spent by travellers in towns is very often critical to the ongoing viability of some small towns - they are glad to get any 'GN income'.
However, the larger towns, particularly the east coast cities, become a little disappointed when very few of the 'travelling wallets' actually spend those $770 bundles.
Most just buy some tucker, a bitta fuel, and praps a bit at the pub or tourist attraction.
The lower $$$ spent in towns is still valuable, but ultimately the larger sum bandied about has worked against the ongoing support from communities and councils for the provision, and continuance, of free 'camps' for travellers - all and sundry - the good and the bad.
OH, and we have drifted off topic - how naughty of me.
I sort of agree that the 'younger generation/s' may not have the wherewithal to follow in our footsteps - tyre tracks.
But none of us can actually see the future - diesel is being killed off, electric vehicles taking over, what of caravans - so who knows what myriad of circumstances will influence the choices of following generations.
cheers - John
-- Edited by rockylizard on Monday 10th of December 2018 08:10:32 PM
Yes, we are as we are the only generation that has saved dilligently for our retirement.
For goodness sake can you imagine anyone from the new age actually wanting to live on only $770.00 per week.
Now before I get beaten over the head with a wet lettuce I need to say that this is
Tongue In Cheek.
and is only meant as a light hearted joke.
Please note that very little punctuation was able to be entered in this post.
We got our first mortgage at 17% & paid vast amounts of interest over the years, anyway!
Over 3 months & 17715 km we spent $650 pw of that $250 was petrol 1857 litres, 3 nights in Perth, a boat trip in Katherine Gorge, about 10 caravan park camping fees. NP camping fees.
But mostly food, water, a replacement tyre. A few meals out. Did another 9500 km 2 month holiday over summer.
We will have to cut back while at home as we are running ahead of our long term living costs. If we have to spend more on holidays we will cut back as number one priority is keeping the roof over our heads.
Probably.
Perhaps the CMCA or whoever is giving these figures out, should be a bit more realistic
On the other hand, how do we know, were the CMCA got their numbers from
If I had to stay in caravan parks each and every night, then it would not be too far beyond a possibility, that with my (usually) long distance, and the wife puffing her ciggys, to spend that amount
Over summer 2 month holiday we spent about $800 on cappuccinos! Last holiday went back to grinding our own & saved a bucket load. Still bought a modest number of cups!
I suppose that you now smash your own avocados too. LOL
Are we the last generation of grey nomads? Great question.
Perhaps so - in it's current form. It will be very interesting to see what it looks like in 20 or 30 years.
I am sure though that people will always travel, in one form or other.
Joe
What about bald nomads, where do they stand?
I didn't know this was the definition of a grey nomad.
How many grey nomads travel every day, never mind 300 kls? Surely like many here, people tend to pull up in the one spot for days/weeks/months. Interesting reading when going through all the links.
And as so many have said, figuring out how much it will cost to be a grey nomad (or bald or those of us who might use some assistance with our hair colour!) is like asking how long a piece of string is.
Last 3 holidays averaged about 170 km per day. We don't stay put long, but we really would not want to be driving any more than we are. It is too tiring & simply not safe to do more week after week. When we feel that is enough we stop for the day, apart from regular stops to stretch.
The longest single drive was well over 2 hours just getting out of Sydney (& return), then we had our first break on the outskirts!
The last holiday we spent 2.6 hours a day on average driving & our cruising speed is typically 93 kph for fuel efficiency, 73 kph average for the trip, that was enough driving for us. Cars these days give you all the basic data so why not make the best use of it.
We put all our trip data on a spreadsheet. So we are well short of the 300 km definition!
In the shade.
Nah! They stay out in the sun to keep charged because the bald head is a solar panel for a sex machine.
& no vitamin D supplements required!
We could/would never spend anything like $770 a week when on the road.
Of course if one wants to take into account the normal running expenses of our household / lifestyle budget then ours exceed the nominated figure.
Our recurring debts on things like rates - insurances -rego for 3 vehicles - etc etc blows the $770 out of the budget park.
Jesus, our private health is a whooping $100 a week. But...... it has been a blessing for us.
Anyway one can not take it with us.
Jay&Dee
Couldn't agree more Rocky. I'm a member of the CMCA and am tempted to ask where they get this figure from but should probably keep my nose out of it just in case I cause a fuss.
I'm looking at buying and living full time in a motorhome next year and there is no way I would expect to spend $770 a week. I don't do takeaways, coffee, etc now so don't expect to in the future and while I might do a 'touristy' thing every now and then, it certainly wouldn't be the usual. I would expect to pull up in the one place, if I liked it, for some weeks so it would be mainly the usual food, internet access, etc I use now so can't see that coming to $770 pw.
Just depends on what you want and can afford.
Hi JayDee
Your post only goes to show how different each of our situations are. i.e. how many vehicles we own, whether we still own a home so have rates etc.
I'm with JayDee on this. My 3 vehicles include the caravan & I continually bemoan the cost of Health Insurance but after all these years am not game to let it go especially as I approach my 78th year.
My rather modest but comfortable way of life requires a budget in excess of the CMCA figure, but if we were on the road full time without a house I believe that we could & would live on much less.
We are 'fortunate' in that we have the choice at present.
I've been living for years on a limited income by choice so am good at not wasting money. Having said that I don't feel I go without by any means.
If one is moving from a full time job I think it will be challenging to budget for the new reality. Maybe the last couple of working years live on a "retirement" income & put the cash away so you are more prepared for the change. You will start to find so many things you really do not need.
I can't see the next generation being able to afford to travel like we have been able to.
Whether we are the last or not, it certainly will be different for future generations.
On the weekly spend, I would certainly be one of the ones who do spend more than $770pw, because of my wifes health problem, I only use caravan parks and always use ensuite sited when available, in Cairns Last year in peak time the site hire alone was a very high $110 per night ($770) and I stayed for 5 weeks, averaging it out across the board and all parks and costs, I suppose that my total spend would exceed $1000 per week.
My wifes condition has deteriorated and so I didnt caravan this year but leased a home instead which wasnt any cheaper...I look at this way, we were pretty frugal all our lives, saved, invested ans lived a rather modest lifestyle, reflecting back now, I ask myself, was it worth it?...probably not! Nevertheless, my intention now is just enjoy whats left our travelling lives and to hell with the cost.
The kids will get some investments but buggered if the money is going their way too, if thats selfish, too bad, its now our time and its late twilight...and time is so precious now.
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Sunday 16th of December 2018 09:53:37 AM