Currently we have a Jayco Eagle Outback that has served us very well for nine years & in the future are looking at replacing it with a new or second-hand pop-top. The main reason is that it gets rather chilly going for a walk in the middle of the night in winter! A toilet is essential, not a shower though.
Are pop-tops as strong as a full caravan of the same brand name? Are there issues with water leaks?
I've discovered that caravans come in various widths eg the full off-road vans (eg Trackmaster) are approx. 7'6" wide, the Jayco Starcraft are 8' & one full van that we liked (Regent Weekender) is approx. 8'4" wide & when you add an awning, it makes getting into my carport rather difficult! I'm mainly looking at a single axle van. Any suggestions?
We don't necessarily need a full blown off-road van - just one that won't scrape its underneath on some bad patches of road & doesn't fall to bits when it sees a dirt road! We are bird watchers so we visit quite a few places off dirt roads + having family in Adelaide means that often we travel the Birdsville Road or Strzelecki Road-Track (depending on conditions at the time). I've seen both roads so smooth you could use it for the V8 races but others, well ..... !
Warren
Explorer said
08:48 AM Jul 7, 2016
Hi, Widths & layouts are going to vary greatly as You already know so, that is a matter of looking at all of the options. As to strength compared to a full height van, generally just as strong & in some cases stronger. Most manufacturers use a solid "collar" that the walls of the van is built up to & the collar (for the want of a better description) ties the structure together. The lowered roof adds further stability. As for water leaks? I guess that again depends on the manufacturer & the day it was built.
A big consideration is the roof, some are very flat in construction & more prone to leaking that those with more of a bevel.
Mike.
Desert Dweller said
09:51 AM Jul 7, 2016
Our fibreglass sandwich panel constructed pop-top has a roof that is one complete sheet of fibreglass with NO JOINTS to leek. Personally pop-top or full height van is just your choice, we have no preference for either. ''Tin & sticks'' vans tend to leak & rot out more than sandwich panel vans. We've had no leaks with ours in 5 years from new.
Umpie1 said
10:14 AM Jul 7, 2016
I have a 1993 17'6" Viscount Vogue with a poptop. We bought it secondhand and have found in the 2-3 years we have it that it doesn't leak. This was borne out when we were at Genoa [Vic] and there was 110mm of rain overnight in the camp area. So I would say go with a poptop as you have a lower wind resistance when towing.
macka17 said
10:55 AM Jul 7, 2016
Coupla quick ones.
Strength. a Well made pop top from same Mfg with 'normally" be stronger in framework than a full height van.
Windage. there's very little wingage difference t'wen a pop top and a streamlined (read modern) full van Streamlining negates the extra height. Cost pretty much the same. towing. the same.
These are all considering a reputable mfg.
I've had Mainly Roadstar and one "semi offroad" Pop Top Compass. the bosses favourite of all the vans over 50 odd yrs.
Now. a Coromal 18ft full height. semi off roader.
The MAIN thing/reason. I've only ever had one pop top is the bloody door.
fed up banging head on way out. grrrr.
Coromal get a lot of detractors. ME included over the yrs. But after owning one. Yes. lighweight (read "light on") Ally frame. chassis. But they keep on rolling on. I'm happy with this one. and I'm a Heavyweight off road affectionado. which I now don't do.
LEAKING.
The BIG one.
even the fibreglass ones can leak round window.door frames. and panel joins.
ALL others, are segmented, Normally aluminium sheeting, interlocking into each other and joins butted up with angle strips. IE. Lotsa bits.
No matter who makes one. If it not sealed properly. AND MAINTAINED as such.
they'll ALL leak.
Personally. these days. I go round, scrape all corner seals and window frames every 3 yrs. clean out with dissolving spray for silicon. acetone. then reseal all seals. Primarily. Roof.vertical Corner joins front and side Check the windows and door frame.
I lived in caravans on building. Pipelines and motorway constructions in early '60's to early '70's. The vans got a pounding in farmers fields and easements on the lines and M.Ways.
I NEVER once had a leak. resealed van and painted it every yr.
22ft single axle.towed with a series 1 1500cc side valve Land rover. then modernised to a ser 2 shortie 2 ltr diesel.
35mph was around the fastest I ever went, and that was downhill (dead man) and often went uphill in Wales at around 8 to 10mph. Same as everybody else towing.
Speed wasn't a criteria in those days. Just getting there. Pity it's still not the same nowadays hey.
Just look at some old forums. there are plenty of well made models out there. even good Phoenix if you look, at a decent price.
-- Edited by macka17 on Thursday 7th of July 2016 10:59:53 AM
sandgrooper1 said
12:58 PM Jul 7, 2016
Hi Warren,
We went from a 1998 19ft Windsor Dynasty pop top after 10 years ownership to a 2008 21ft Windsor Genesis full van about a year ago. The main differences re towing is that I am aware the bigger van is slightly heavier aside from that they tow as well as each other behind the same tow vehicle.
The newer van has the nicer bits such as separate ensuite, airconditioning, hot water and battery all things the previous van lacked. In this day and age my advice is to get a van with the bathroom even if it is just for resale alone, harder to sell vans without the bathroom.
We also like the much better insulation quality of the full van from both a tempreture and noise aspect.....the pop top was more like a tent in both those ways to us. The pop top was fine if there was a breeze as with all zipper vents it was quite airy.
With the pop top the size of ours the roof was quite heavy to put up n down, a chore we don't miss. The pop top never leaked in the time we had it.
One more thing with the rollout awning to us you feel the wind gusts far more via the awning on occasion flapping than in the full van, I guess because the pop top doesn't have the rigid roof and walls to anchor, and yes I always tied down the awning.
Good luck with your choice.
Cheers AL
Bryan said
02:02 PM Jul 7, 2016
Warren, I have a pop top, well built and have endured some heavy storms this winter with no leaks. In fact the only problem I've had in two years is a leaking tap which was fixed yesterday. Touch wood.
At the time I chose the pop top because I felt the lower the roof line, the more obscure off road places I could get to (its an off road van). Plus in order to be self sufficient in the bush, I have solar panels mounted on the roof etc. The end result is that its heavy and a pain to lift, despite having upgraded the hydraulic helpers. I'm afraid it's not woking for me but that's not to say it won't suit you.
I'm seriously considering a full height van from the same company.
Peter_n_Margaret said
03:57 PM Jul 7, 2016
We have a pop top over the bed in the OKA, but given the choice, I would never have a pop top.
They flap in strong winds and have virtually zero insulation against the cold.
Zips are a failure risk and eventually the fabric will wear out and need replacing.
Cheers,
Peter
Treecrest14 said
05:16 PM Jul 7, 2016
Well we had a 15' Jayco Expanda and was extremly happy with it. It had the shower Toilet combo - which would suit you if you are not going to use the shower often. No leaks even with the canvas bed ends as we had storm covers which kept the rain off the canvas!
The van also had a roof top air con and two solar panels on the roof, but then I got a dickie shoulder and it was too hard to put up by myself.
Now have a Coromal Element which is a full height van.
Glen
Warren-Pat_01 said
02:42 PM Jul 14, 2016
Thanks everyone for your inputs - I will go through them in more detail when the time comes.
Macka, I too have "head troubles" in most vans I walk out of as I'm 6'6" tall! Generally the Eagle is pretty good as I can generally get out of it without trying to cut off the top of my head! I guess when I upgrade, I'll have to get some black & yellow warning tape!
One of the gripes I have with the Eagle & I assume this happens with an Expander is that when the fly-screens tear after a lot of use, one has to replace the whole soft area (or do as we have done - some visible patches). Does this occur with a pop-top?
Living in the tropics (Pat would like cooler weather but today she has a jumper on as it's only going to be 22 degrees), means ventilation is very important, so the pop-top is good there - as is our Eagle.
Are those "Erectus" air operated assisters any use in lifting a top?
Currently we have a Jayco Eagle Outback that has served us very well for nine years & in the future are looking at replacing it with a new or second-hand pop-top. The main reason is that it gets rather chilly going for a walk in the middle of the night in winter! A toilet is essential, not a shower though.
Are pop-tops as strong as a full caravan of the same brand name? Are there issues with water leaks?
I've discovered that caravans come in various widths eg the full off-road vans (eg Trackmaster) are approx. 7'6" wide, the Jayco Starcraft are 8' & one full van that we liked (Regent Weekender) is approx. 8'4" wide & when you add an awning, it makes getting into my carport rather difficult! I'm mainly looking at a single axle van. Any suggestions?
We don't necessarily need a full blown off-road van - just one that won't scrape its underneath on some bad patches of road & doesn't fall to bits when it sees a dirt road! We are bird watchers so we visit quite a few places off dirt roads + having family in Adelaide means that often we travel the Birdsville Road or Strzelecki Road-Track (depending on conditions at the time). I've seen both roads so smooth you could use it for the V8 races but others, well ..... !
Warren
Hi, Widths & layouts are going to vary greatly as You already know so, that is a matter of looking at all of the options. As to strength compared to a full height van, generally just as strong & in some cases stronger. Most manufacturers use a solid "collar" that the walls of the van is built up to & the collar (for the want of a better description) ties the structure together. The lowered roof adds further stability. As for water leaks? I guess that again depends on the manufacturer & the day it was built.
A big consideration is the roof, some are very flat in construction & more prone to leaking that those with more of a bevel.
Mike.
Our fibreglass sandwich panel constructed pop-top has a roof that is one complete sheet of fibreglass with NO JOINTS to leek.
Personally pop-top or full height van is just your choice, we have no preference for either. ''Tin & sticks'' vans tend to leak & rot out more than sandwich panel vans. We've had no leaks with ours in 5 years from new.
Coupla quick ones.
Strength.
a Well made pop top from same Mfg with 'normally" be stronger in framework than a full height van.
Windage.
there's very little wingage difference t'wen a pop top and a streamlined (read modern) full van
Streamlining negates the extra height.
Cost pretty much the same. towing. the same.
These are all considering a reputable mfg.
I've had Mainly Roadstar and one "semi offroad" Pop Top Compass.
the bosses favourite of all the vans over 50 odd yrs.
Now. a Coromal 18ft full height. semi off roader.
The MAIN thing/reason. I've only ever had one pop top is the bloody door.
fed up banging head on way out. grrrr.
Coromal get a lot of detractors. ME included over the yrs.
But after owning one.
Yes. lighweight (read "light on") Ally frame. chassis.
But they keep on rolling on. I'm happy with this one.
and I'm a Heavyweight off road affectionado.
which I now don't do.
LEAKING.
The BIG one.
even the fibreglass ones can leak round window.door frames.
and panel joins.
ALL others, are segmented, Normally aluminium sheeting,
interlocking into each other and joins butted up with angle strips.
IE. Lotsa bits.
No matter who makes one.
If it not sealed properly.
AND MAINTAINED as such.
they'll ALL leak.
Personally. these days. I go round, scrape all corner seals and window frames every 3 yrs. clean out with dissolving spray for silicon.
acetone.
then reseal all seals.
Primarily. Roof.vertical Corner joins front and side
Check the windows and door frame.
I lived in caravans on building. Pipelines and motorway constructions in early '60's to early '70's.
The vans got a pounding in farmers fields and easements on the lines and M.Ways.
I NEVER once had a leak.
resealed van and painted it every yr.
22ft single axle.towed with a series 1 1500cc side valve Land rover.
then modernised to a ser 2 shortie 2 ltr diesel.
35mph was around the fastest I ever went, and that was downhill (dead man)
and often went uphill in Wales at around 8 to 10mph.
Same as everybody else towing.
Speed wasn't a criteria in those days. Just getting there.
Pity it's still not the same nowadays hey.
Just look at some old forums. there are plenty of well made models out there.
even good Phoenix if you look, at a decent price.
-- Edited by macka17 on Thursday 7th of July 2016 10:59:53 AM
Hi Warren,
We went from a 1998 19ft Windsor Dynasty pop top after 10 years ownership to a 2008 21ft Windsor Genesis full van about a year ago. The main differences re towing is that I am aware the bigger van is slightly heavier aside from that they tow as well as each other behind the same tow vehicle.
The newer van has the nicer bits such as separate ensuite, airconditioning, hot water and battery all things the previous van lacked. In this day and age my advice is to get a van with the bathroom even if it is just for resale alone, harder to sell vans without the bathroom.
We also like the much better insulation quality of the full van from both a tempreture and noise aspect.....the pop top was more like a tent in both those ways to us. The pop top was fine if there was a breeze as with all zipper vents it was quite airy.
With the pop top the size of ours the roof was quite heavy to put up n down, a chore we don't miss. The pop top never leaked in the time we had it.
One more thing with the rollout awning to us you feel the wind gusts far more via the awning on occasion flapping than in the full van, I guess because the pop top doesn't have the rigid roof and walls to anchor, and yes I always tied down the awning.
Good luck with your choice.
Cheers AL
Warren, I have a pop top, well built and have endured some heavy storms this winter with no leaks. In fact the only problem I've had in two years is a leaking tap which was fixed yesterday. Touch wood.
At the time I chose the pop top because I felt the lower the roof line, the more obscure off road places I could get to (its an off road van). Plus in order to be self sufficient in the bush, I have solar panels mounted on the roof etc. The end result is that its heavy and a pain to lift, despite having upgraded the hydraulic helpers. I'm afraid it's not woking for me but that's not to say it won't suit you.
I'm seriously considering a full height van from the same company.
They flap in strong winds and have virtually zero insulation against the cold.
Zips are a failure risk and eventually the fabric will wear out and need replacing.
Cheers,
Peter
The van also had a roof top air con and two solar panels on the roof, but then I got a dickie shoulder and it was too hard to put up by myself.
Now have a Coromal Element which is a full height van.
Glen
Macka, I too have "head troubles" in most vans I walk out of as I'm 6'6" tall! Generally the Eagle is pretty good as I can generally get out of it without trying to cut off the top of my head! I guess when I upgrade, I'll have to get some black & yellow warning tape!
One of the gripes I have with the Eagle & I assume this happens with an Expander is that when the fly-screens tear after a lot of use, one has to replace the whole soft area (or do as we have done - some visible patches). Does this occur with a pop-top?
Living in the tropics (Pat would like cooler weather but today she has a jumper on as it's only going to be 22 degrees), means ventilation is very important, so the pop-top is good there - as is our Eagle.
Are those "Erectus" air operated assisters any use in lifting a top?
Warren