yes that's right it happened on Friday the staff didn't know thought they were going to do a stock take for a sale on Monday but.....pitcher partners moved in on Friday ( there a pack of ...un printables ) so even if you have payed for something and we're going to pick it up later ....kiss your money good by these legal theifs are on $500 per hour, scaled down to the new employe that answers the phone and makes the coffee is on $200 per hour and that was there rates two years ago. Yes Iv had dealings with them they are in control of another company that owed me $35,000 for grain I can not speak lowly enough of them grrrrrrrrrr
there is an article in the Sunraysia daily I'll try to get a link up ( if I can )
-- Edited by Woody n Sue on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 06:38:32 PM
Bruce and Bev said
08:41 PM Apr 5, 2016
feel sorry for those who have paid for goods which have not yet been supplied as they will probably be un-secured creditors (after the Bank and the ATO) and also for the staff.
They will probably not be paid their wages, holiday pay and super. The Feds cover the wages and holiday pay, but they will not get any long service leave or Super.
Companies and Banks should not be able to get away with what they do. Too many companies go into voluntary liquidation and then open gain the next day with no debt payable (if theyre clever). Administrators are usually employed by Banks and they are only interested in recovering what they are owed (too often due to lax lending) and to hell with customers and staff
moamajohn said
09:09 PM Apr 5, 2016
Gday,5 years ago when I was still trading as a company In the building caper and on union sites well fair dinkum if I was more than 7 days paying my staffs super I would get a real dirty letter from C-Bus !! Trouble with these buggers they just dont care about staff. I don,t understand why it is not a law that staff is not paid out as secured creditors first up,just like when you fall off the perch your kids can pay the undertaker from your dough ! not the same I know however you get my drift !
Woody n Sue said
09:12 PM Apr 5, 2016
So true Bruce they are only interested in the bank recovering there money then they bleed the rest dry until they can say there is no money for unsecured customers they are the lowest form of life on the planet as far as I am concerned .
goldfinger said
10:11 PM Apr 5, 2016
Banks get paid out first as a condition of lending they generally have 1st or 2nd Mortgage over land Security..or at least Guarantees by Directors supported by Registered Mortgage..they also cover their backsides by generally taking a Mortgage Debenture over the whole of the assets and undertakings of the Company....you can't beat Banks..they are in the business of not losing money....they are in the business of making money for their Shareholders.. you really think they give a tinkers cuss about the Staff of these Company's losing entitlements....not likely.....
Same when their will no doubt be forced house sales in this inevitable coming Australian housing value meltdown...all it will take is one or two interest rate rises. Australia now has the highest NO1..level of domestic debt in the developed world...something not to be proud of!...foreign borrowers have been underpinning the Australian market creating false higher values with incomes/money from outside the Australian economy.....Banks lend 85 to 90% or more against First Mortgage and also take Mortgage Insurance paid for by the Mortgagor ...when the crunch comes e.g. the outstanding total loans on the house exceeds the new lower valuations...the Banks give the borrowers the choice of increasing repayments..which is invariably impossible in this coming economic climate..or they change the locks and force sales in droves....then they sell to the waiting sharks at forced sale prices......the Banks are paid out their full debt by the in cahoots Mortgage Insurance Company's ...AND here is the sting..the Mortgage Insurer then goes the borrower for any shortfall they have had to pay the POOR Bank...and threatens bankruptcy unless they find the funds....always in the know that many parents will take out loans to pay the """debt"" as they don't want to see their kids starting out life with bankruptcy ramifications...
I have now seen this cycle played out at least 5 times in my last 40 + years in business....I believe we are now heading down the well trodden path once again...all carefully contrived by the system..the Banks don't lose...the Insurer doesn't lose....the sharks who follow the forced sale blood certainly don't lose...they offload property's at the next upturn for large profits..the losers are like the workers in the Company's...the decent family workers trying their hardest to eke out an existence in this climate..of increasing Council Rates,Utilities, etc etc...and generally reducing take home pays/incomes........
The Banks have fallen over themselves to hand out money, encouraging borrowers to borrow even more... against the new/higher/perceived equity values in their homes...buy cars, boats, overseas holidays, luxury useless stuff..worth nothing in any downturn....and as soon as homes values start to trend to decrease they go for borrowers jugglers immediately.... The Real Estate Agents are happy and complicit in this downturn cycle....they still get commission by selling a home in a downturn..do you think they care about the homeowners circumstances?....about the same as the Banks....IMO.....as a Bank Manager for some 21 years and Real Estate Agent for over 20 years...a two time loser in my past life......I have seen it come to pass too many times...Governments don't care....buying useless stuff against home equity is considered stimulus......economic growth....yeh.. by Harvey Norman and Co maybe....Hoo Roo
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:13:00 PM
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:15:52 PM
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:17:40 PM
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:18:41 PM
Desert Dweller said
06:28 AM Apr 6, 2016
A real pity, they made a quality AUSTRALIAN PRODUCT! Lots of cheap overseas made tent top camper trailers on the market with inferior canvas.
Bruce and Bev said
07:40 PM Apr 6, 2016
How right you are goldfinger !
It never ceases to amaze me that many home loan borrowers think that mortgage insurance will pay their debt to the lender in the event they cannot pay their home loan.
Like you, I have been in the housing and real estate industry and either most borrowers are really thick, or people are not being told that mortgage insurance is simply a surcharge by the lender that the borrowers must take if they borrow more than 85% (or often less now) of the loan value.
They find out too late they have shelled out some $1000's for mortgage insurance and if they default they still loose their home. Lenders should be obliged to clearly explain in simple writing (signed by the borrower) what mortgage insurance is - not insurance, that's for sure
blissonwheels said
07:58 PM Apr 6, 2016
Gooday,
Still seems there is some confusion with Members, "Banks" have only existed as always on the side of Rivers & Streams, and still do, the other places once known as 'BANKS' are all' FINANCE COMPANIES', and that is what they should be referred to in pleasant language.
The thing the Community once knew, and trusted, was a bank, but that is about 30 years or more ago.
Cheers,
Bliss on Wheels.
goldfinger said
12:30 PM Apr 7, 2016
G'day Bruce and Bev, the Catch 22 situation for borrowers tossed out of their homes due to a downturn ,is they are competing with many other renters in the same situation at the same time..the stinking sharks who buy the property's often for a song, hand in glove with Real Estate Agents, then rent the very same propertys out at increasing rentals due to the increased rental demand ...waiting until the next inevitable upturn in the 'game' cycle...and then sell them at obscene rising prices, with upbeat smiling Real Estate Agents once againin tow........they are the Real Estate Agents and the Banks greatest asset in ""purchasing"" these propertys and getting them off their lending and sale books....
Apparently there are thousands of vacant homes and apartments in Sydney and Melbourne, owned by Chinese etc that remain UNOCCUPIED..they have near nil water usages and these figures are available to the Governments, State and Federal....homes that could and should, be occupied at the very least by those on the 6 year waiting lists for public housing.....the Governments give rent relief knowing full well their "mates" that put them there are benefiting...and they themselves have their snouts in the very same troughs....
Its obscene at best and corrupt at worst with no collective social conscience......just more 'words'......pox on them all....the system is broken and not working like it did or should for the Average working battler attempting to provide for their AUSTRALIAN family's....
The tremors are starting already with Banks exposure to their Mining mates...who have been ably assisted to the max by Government...with the commodity downturn there are no more levers to 'pull' in their giant Ponzy Scheme..
The Real Estate Agents well rehearsed patter then becomes....Mr seller you are competing with say 76 other homes in your neighbourhood,..if you wish to "get on with your life" and sell in this competitive market you must reduce, reduce, reduce your expectations...they then go to every other seller with the same patter...result prices start to come down...either way the Real Estate leeches get their commissions....and the beat goes on,... ad infinitum...
In the Real Estate and Banking Industry the coming inevitable downturn due to the over-borrowed domestic debt is described amongst themselves as a 'Minsky Moment' so they only understand the ramifications...Google: Hyman Minsky's Hypothis'....explains what we are now heading for perfectly.... along the lines 'Stability creates Instability'...the longer the period of price stability,..read for the affluent, the more we will believe the pattern has to continue..which causes Investors to take greater borrowing risks....however as soon as the money supply tightens which is about to happen the Bank's wont be throwing it out the door at borrowers as they have been...they will be scrambling for their own reserves...
The upshot for anyone with a little bit of money in a Bank is they will suddenly want to know you again..read get their hands on your deposits and have to compete by paying a reasonable interest rate once again....it would all be tooo funny if it was not so serious for our Australian young family's.....Hoo Roo
Wizardofoz said
04:40 PM Apr 8, 2016
Double post.
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:44:36 PM
Wizardofoz said
04:43 PM Apr 8, 2016
Frankly, I was proud to call myself a Real Estae Agent as I considered that I helped people, not used them for my own personal gain. not everybody in these professions are out there to rip and tear at the throats of people...to be brutally honest, I am offended by your single minded generalisation and denigration.
all I can say is, if you were genuine and honest to yourself, you should have resigned and found a better employer...unless of course, you were the employer!
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:45:14 PM
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:47:48 PM
goldfinger said
07:38 PM Apr 8, 2016
Post Removed....my wife just asked me why do I bother?......Hoo Roo
-- Edited by goldfinger on Friday 8th of April 2016 09:46:24 PM
Bryan said
08:58 PM Apr 8, 2016
Wizardofoz wrote:
Frankly, I was proud to call myself a Real Estae Agent as I considered that I helped people, not used them for my own personal gain. not everybody in these professions are out there to rip and tear at the throats of people...to be brutally honest, I am offended by your single minded generalisation and denigration.
all I can say is, if you were genuine and honest to yourself, you should have resigned and found a better employer...unless of course, you were the employer!
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:45:14 PM
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:47:48 PM
Quite so.
I agree even though I have nothing to do with real estate. Every industry has its share of black sheep, thankfully they are in the minority.
Wizardofoz said
10:27 AM Apr 10, 2016
goldfinger wrote:
Post Removed....my wife just asked me why do I bother?......Hoo Roo
-- Edited by goldfinger on Friday 8th of April 2016 09:46:24 PM
yes that's right it happened on Friday the staff didn't know thought they were going to do a stock take for a sale on Monday but.....pitcher partners moved in on Friday ( there a pack of ...un printables ) so even if you have payed for something and we're going to pick it up later ....kiss your money good by these legal theifs are on $500 per hour, scaled down to the new employe that answers the phone and makes the coffee is on $200 per hour and that was there rates two years ago. Yes Iv had dealings with them they are in control of another company that owed me $35,000 for grain I can not speak lowly enough of them grrrrrrrrrr
there is an article in the Sunraysia daily I'll try to get a link up ( if I can )
woody
http://www.sunraysiadaily.com.au/story/3830108/camping-shop-closes-staff-given-one-days-notice-of-axings-as-administrator-appointed/?cs=4167
Hope this works
-- Edited by Woody n Sue on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 06:38:32 PM
They will probably not be paid their wages, holiday pay and super. The Feds cover the wages and holiday pay, but they will not get any long service leave or Super.
Companies and Banks should not be able to get away with what they do. Too many companies go into voluntary liquidation and then open gain the next day with no debt payable (if theyre clever). Administrators are usually employed by Banks and they are only interested in recovering what they are owed (too often due to lax lending) and to hell with customers and staff
Banks get paid out first as a condition of lending they generally have 1st or 2nd Mortgage over land Security..or at least Guarantees by Directors supported by Registered Mortgage..they also cover their backsides by generally taking a Mortgage Debenture over the whole of the assets and undertakings of the Company....you can't beat Banks..they are in the business of not losing money....they are in the business of making money for their Shareholders.. you really think they give a tinkers cuss about the Staff of these Company's losing entitlements....not likely.....
Same when their will no doubt be forced house sales in this inevitable coming Australian housing value meltdown...all it will take is one or two interest rate rises. Australia now has the highest NO1..level of domestic debt in the developed world...something not to be proud of!...foreign borrowers have been underpinning the Australian market creating false higher values with incomes/money from outside the Australian economy.....Banks lend 85 to 90% or more against First Mortgage and also take Mortgage Insurance paid for by the Mortgagor ...when the crunch comes e.g. the outstanding total loans on the house exceeds the new lower valuations...the Banks give the borrowers the choice of increasing repayments..which is invariably impossible in this coming economic climate..or they change the locks and force sales in droves....then they sell to the waiting sharks at forced sale prices......the Banks are paid out their full debt by the in cahoots Mortgage Insurance Company's ...AND here is the sting..the Mortgage Insurer then goes the borrower for any shortfall they have had to pay the POOR Bank...and threatens bankruptcy unless they find the funds....always in the know that many parents will take out loans to pay the """debt"" as they don't want to see their kids starting out life with bankruptcy ramifications...
I have now seen this cycle played out at least 5 times in my last 40 + years in business....I believe we are now heading down the well trodden path once again...all carefully contrived by the system..the Banks don't lose...the Insurer doesn't lose....the sharks who follow the forced sale blood certainly don't lose...they offload property's at the next upturn for large profits..the losers are like the workers in the Company's...the decent family workers trying their hardest to eke out an existence in this climate..of increasing Council Rates,Utilities, etc etc...and generally reducing take home pays/incomes........
The Banks have fallen over themselves to hand out money, encouraging borrowers to borrow even more... against the new/higher/perceived equity values in their homes...buy cars, boats, overseas holidays, luxury useless stuff..worth nothing in any downturn....and as soon as homes values start to trend to decrease they go for borrowers jugglers immediately....
The Real Estate Agents are happy and complicit in this downturn cycle....they still get commission by selling a home in a downturn..do you think they care about the homeowners circumstances?....about the same as the Banks....IMO.....as a Bank Manager for some 21 years and Real Estate Agent for over 20 years...a two time loser in my past life......I have seen it come to pass too many times...Governments don't care....buying useless stuff against home equity is considered stimulus......economic growth....yeh.. by Harvey Norman and Co maybe....Hoo Roo
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:13:00 PM
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:15:52 PM
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:17:40 PM
-- Edited by goldfinger on Tuesday 5th of April 2016 10:18:41 PM
It never ceases to amaze me that many home loan borrowers think that mortgage insurance will pay their debt to the lender in the event they cannot pay their home loan.
Like you, I have been in the housing and real estate industry and either most borrowers are really thick, or people are not being told that mortgage insurance is simply a surcharge by the lender that the borrowers must take if they borrow more than 85% (or often less now) of the loan value.
They find out too late they have shelled out some $1000's for mortgage insurance and if they default they still loose their home. Lenders should be obliged to clearly explain in simple writing (signed by the borrower) what mortgage insurance is - not insurance, that's for sure
Gooday,
Still seems there is some confusion with Members, "Banks" have only existed as always on the side of Rivers & Streams, and still do, the other places once known as 'BANKS' are all' FINANCE COMPANIES', and that is what they should be referred to in pleasant language.
The thing the Community once knew, and trusted, was a bank, but that is about 30 years or more ago.
Cheers,
Bliss on Wheels.
Apparently there are thousands of vacant homes and apartments in Sydney and Melbourne, owned by Chinese etc that remain UNOCCUPIED..they have near nil water usages and these figures are available to the Governments, State and Federal....homes that could and should, be occupied at the very least by those on the 6 year waiting lists for public housing.....the Governments give rent relief knowing full well their "mates" that put them there are benefiting...and they themselves have their snouts in the very same troughs....
Its obscene at best and corrupt at worst with no collective social conscience......just more 'words'......pox on them all....the system is broken and not working like it did or should for the Average working battler attempting to provide for their AUSTRALIAN family's....
The tremors are starting already with Banks exposure to their Mining mates...who have been ably assisted to the max by Government...with the commodity downturn there are no more levers to 'pull' in their giant Ponzy Scheme..
The Real Estate Agents well rehearsed patter then becomes....Mr seller you are competing with say 76 other homes in your neighbourhood,..if you wish to "get on with your life" and sell in this competitive market you must reduce, reduce, reduce your expectations...they then go to every other seller with the same patter...result prices start to come down...either way the Real Estate leeches get their commissions....and the beat goes on,... ad infinitum...
In the Real Estate and Banking Industry the coming inevitable downturn due to the over-borrowed domestic debt is described amongst themselves as a 'Minsky Moment' so they only understand the ramifications...Google: Hyman Minsky's Hypothis'....explains what we are now heading for perfectly.... along the lines 'Stability creates Instability'...the longer the period of price stability,..read for the affluent, the more we will believe the pattern has to continue..which causes Investors to take greater borrowing risks....however as soon as the money supply tightens which is about to happen the Bank's wont be throwing it out the door at borrowers as they have been...they will be scrambling for their own reserves...
The upshot for anyone with a little bit of money in a Bank is they will suddenly want to know you again..read get their hands on your deposits and have to compete by paying a reasonable interest rate once again....it would all be tooo funny if it was not so serious for our Australian young family's.....Hoo Roo
Double post.
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:44:36 PM
Frankly, I was proud to call myself a Real Estae Agent as I considered that I helped people, not used them for my own personal gain. not everybody in these professions are out there to rip and tear at the throats of people...to be brutally honest, I am offended by your single minded generalisation and denigration.
all I can say is, if you were genuine and honest to yourself, you should have resigned and found a better employer...unless of course, you were the employer!
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:45:14 PM
-- Edited by Wizardofoz on Friday 8th of April 2016 04:47:48 PM
Post Removed....my wife just asked me why do I bother?......Hoo Roo
-- Edited by goldfinger on Friday 8th of April 2016 09:46:24 PM
Quite so.
I agree even though I have nothing to do with real estate. Every industry has its share of black sheep, thankfully they are in the minority.
You have a very sensible wife Goldfinger..