Hi people my names Ben and I'm about to head off around Australia with my family. I recently purchased off a friend the basics of a solar set up which included a set of 240w folding solar panels with mppt charger, a 12v 200ah AGM deep cycle battery, a noco G7200 smart charger and a 300w pure sine wave inverter and some cabling and merit sockets I have a few questions which I hope you can help me with. Can I mount the battery and other electrical gear in my trailer tool box or will hydrogen gas and heat be a problem, I've read some conflicting information in regards to gas and AGM batteries so I'm a bit confused as where I can actually put the thing, furthermore I don't want to blow up my kids... Plus the battery is pretty massive so I would like it to stay in the one place as much as possible. Any ideas or feedback will be greatly appreciated also do I need anything else?
Thanks,
Ben.
Dougwe said
02:49 PM Nov 27, 2015
Welcome to the gang Ben 10, enjoy here and out in the playground.
Mmmmm, Ben 10 hey, that's a heavy subject for a 10 year old mate.
Speaking of heavy, that 200ah battery will be heavy heavy heavy and I tell you that for free, so me thinks way too heavy for a tool box. Maybe on a solid area would work though. As for gas, well my understanding is the AGM/Deep Cell's don't produce gas like wet cell's. Could be wrong off course and wouldn't be the first time I have been wrong.
Keep Safe on the roads.
Dav4Cris said
05:51 PM Nov 27, 2015
Yes you can mount it in your toolbox but before you do that you will need to reinforce the floor and walls of the tool box. I made up a vented box that fitted into the box on my camper trailer, just to make certain that it was in a vented area. had a vent installed at rear of toolbox to vent any gas.You may need to check the towball weight when you attach to vehicle, if towball weight is high it might give you some grief along the road. Is the MPPT regulator attached to the solar panels. If not try and mount it as close to the battery as you can.
Ben10 said
07:02 PM Nov 27, 2015
Thanks for the advice guys, why mount the mppt controller close to the battery?
Baz421 said
09:32 PM Nov 27, 2015
Batteries need to be secured wherever they are fitted AND if enclosed they need to be vented. The size of the vent is not stated to the best of my knowledge.
The reason AGM's need to be vented is they all have a "blow off vent" integral to the battery, to let any excess pressure escape for inside the battery due to a malfunction within the battery.
My regulator is 5 metres for the batteries and works just fine, others may provide other more definitive advice.
-- Edited by Baz421 on Friday 27th of November 2015 09:32:29 PM
Peter_n_Margaret said
10:07 PM Nov 27, 2015
There will always be some voltage drop in the cables between the solar panels and the batteries (via the regulator).
As the regulator needs to control the charge voltage very accurately and to monitor the battery voltage very accurately to do its job properly, it is best that the regulator is as close as possible to the batteries to minimise the errors that will otherwise occur.
It will do a better job that way.
AGM batteries do not normally vent, but can do if over charged or if something goes wrong, so venting of the compartment is strongly recommended.
For the same reasons, the battery compartment should not contain electrical switches or any other equipment that could ever create a spark.
Cheers,
Peter
Ben10 said
10:37 PM Nov 27, 2015
Thanks for that, can any one recommend anything else I may need for a user friendly solar set up bearing in mind the gear I already have. Thanks for all your help so far.
PeterD said
11:28 AM Nov 28, 2015
Hi Ben, that's a lot of weight to add to the drawbar. You will be adding at least 70 kg of weight. I would suggest you just place the battery in the tool box and weigh the ball weight. That will save unnecessary work if you have to rethink where the battery will finally live.
A little bit of info regarding your question of gassing. Gel and AGM batteries are also known as VRLA batteries (valve regulated lead acid.) They are still lead acid batteries even though the electrolyte is in a different form from flooded lead acid batteries.These batteries act the same as the no maintenance flooded batteries in that they are built to reabsorb any gas that results from heavy charging. They are similar in that if you exceed the conditions where the recombination takes place then gas will escape and needs venting. That's where the regulating valves come into play, they are the little holes where the screw caps are on flooded batteries. The best site for theory on lead acid batteries is http://jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/carfaq.htm - Alternately you can download a .zip filt of the site to use off line at - http://jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/battery.zip
Jaahn said
12:13 PM Nov 28, 2015
Ben10 wrote:
Thanks for that, can any one recommend anything else I may need for a user friendly solar set up bearing in mind the gear I already have. Thanks for all your help so far.
Hi Ben
Good suggestions so far take note of them. I would just add to them a bit.
It is considered best practice to have the regulator close to the battery, least good to be away at the panels or somewhere else. Why would you do it any other way
A lead acid battery of any type needs to be vented 'in case of a problem'. Some people have made incorrect statements about this but as said on here it is necessary.
My other suggestions would be to check the size of your wiring because it is often too small. It is vital for effective use of that hardware for the wires to be big enough to reduce the losses. Also keep the cable runs as short as you can to reduce the losses too. Read some of the other posts on Techies' Corner and also The Solar Power section at the top of it. More good stuff there too. Wire sizing has been covered a lot.
Good luck jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Saturday 28th of November 2015 12:16:27 PM
aussie_paul said
01:11 PM Nov 28, 2015
I guess working fine is ok. BUT, working more efficiently would be better. Sometimes though, the gain is not worth the pain if it is difficult to achieve the more efficient result.
Mmmmm, Ben 10 hey, that's a heavy subject for a 10 year old mate.
Speaking of heavy, that 200ah battery will be heavy heavy heavy and I tell you that for free, so me thinks way too heavy for a tool box. Maybe on a solid area would work though. As for gas, well my understanding is the AGM/Deep Cell's don't produce gas like wet cell's. Could be wrong off course and wouldn't be the first time I have been wrong.
Keep Safe on the roads.
Batteries need to be secured wherever they are fitted AND if enclosed they need to be vented. The size of the vent is not stated to the best of my knowledge.
The reason AGM's need to be vented is they all have a "blow off vent" integral to the battery, to let any excess pressure escape for inside the battery due to a malfunction within the battery.
My regulator is 5 metres for the batteries and works just fine, others may provide other more definitive advice.
-- Edited by Baz421 on Friday 27th of November 2015 09:32:29 PM
As the regulator needs to control the charge voltage very accurately and to monitor the battery voltage very accurately to do its job properly, it is best that the regulator is as close as possible to the batteries to minimise the errors that will otherwise occur.
It will do a better job that way.
AGM batteries do not normally vent, but can do if over charged or if something goes wrong, so venting of the compartment is strongly recommended.
For the same reasons, the battery compartment should not contain electrical switches or any other equipment that could ever create a spark.
Cheers,
Peter
Hi Ben, that's a lot of weight to add to the drawbar. You will be adding at least 70 kg of weight. I would suggest you just place the battery in the tool box and weigh the ball weight. That will save unnecessary work if you have to rethink where the battery will finally live.
A little bit of info regarding your question of gassing. Gel and AGM batteries are also known as VRLA batteries (valve regulated lead acid.) They are still lead acid batteries even though the electrolyte is in a different form from flooded lead acid batteries.These batteries act the same as the no maintenance flooded batteries in that they are built to reabsorb any gas that results from heavy charging. They are similar in that if you exceed the conditions where the recombination takes place then gas will escape and needs venting. That's where the regulating valves come into play, they are the little holes where the screw caps are on flooded batteries. The best site for theory on lead acid batteries is http://jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/carfaq.htm - Alternately you can download a .zip filt of the site to use off line at - http://jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/battery.zip
Hi Ben
Good suggestions so far take note of them. I would just add to them a bit.
It is considered best practice to have the regulator close to the battery, least good to be away at the panels or somewhere else. Why would you do it any other way
A lead acid battery of any type needs to be vented 'in case of a problem'. Some people have made incorrect statements about this but as said on here it is necessary.
My other suggestions would be to check the size of your wiring because it is often too small. It is vital for effective use of that hardware for the wires to be big enough to reduce the losses. Also keep the cable runs as short as you can to reduce the losses too. Read some of the other posts on Techies' Corner and also The Solar Power section at the top of it. More good stuff there too. Wire sizing has been covered a lot.
Good luck jaahn
-- Edited by Jaahn on Saturday 28th of November 2015 12:16:27 PM
I guess working fine is ok. BUT, working more efficiently would be better. Sometimes though, the gain is not worth the pain if it is difficult to achieve the more efficient result.
Aussie Paul.