As new retirees, we are considering upgrading from 16ft Millard Horizon pop-top single axle without shower/toilet, to a 17.5 Jayco Journey double axle pop-top with shower & toilet for more extended touring. Any helpful comments, suggestions or opinions on this? Thanks heaps. Can't wait to set off!
Dougwe said
02:33 PM Jun 3, 2015
Welcome to the gang DJ, enjoy here and out in the playground.
Have you given any thought to a full size CV, maybe slip into a 18' with ensuite.
Eager grey nomads said
02:39 PM Jun 3, 2015
Thanks. Yes, we're also considering a full van but reckon a pop-up will be lighter and easier to pull.
Bruce and Bev said
04:24 PM Jun 3, 2015
Hey DJ - also welcome to the forum - a great place and we hope you will put up heaps of posts to keep it alive and kicking )
If your tow vehicle is powerful enough, then I agree with Dougee - we have a van similar to his - 19'6" inside, not a pop top, has washing machine, toilet, shower, gas stove, grille, large oven, microwave, TV (I couldn't get the Dealer to throw in the young blonde office girl as an extra though).
Go talk to a few 'van Dealers about the maximum your vehicle will pull (get a few opinions - remember some are ex-used car sales staff lol) and also find out from a Dealer who sells your type and model of tow vehicle about it (but you will need to get some weights from a caravan dealer first) to get good advice from the car dealer - talk to their service manager. You can even go on-line and email the vehicles maker or importer here in Aust and they will help you with things like maximum towing weight, tow ball weight etc
Spydermann said
05:42 PM Jun 3, 2015
Eager grey nomads wrote:
Thanks. Yes, we're also considering a full van but reckon a pop-up will be lighter and easier to pull.
Pop tops are not noticeably lighter than the equivalent full size. One I looked at recently was as few kgs lighter but heavier on the tow-ball. They may be easier to pull as they don't sit as high being the tow-car. Also have a better chance of fitting under a domestic garage or carport.
graeme c said
05:50 PM Jun 3, 2015
Hi
I retired last year, sold my 16ft road star pop top and upgraded to a full size Avan Frances, which has a separate toilet shower and hand basin. It is 17.5 single axle only problem so far was towing in strong cross winds.
i find the full height much warmer about 5 deg than the old pop top. I left Wollongong start of March and have travelled 10,000 km now at Carnarvon going clockwise
happy with my choice so far but the Avan is flimsy a couple minor issues but what van doesn't
-- Edited by graeme c on Wednesday 3rd of June 2015 05:52:47 PM
Hey Jim said
06:53 PM Jun 3, 2015
Hi DJ,
We signed on the dotted line on the last day of the Sydney super show for the same Jayco Journey Outback 17.55-3. with delivery Dec 2015.
It ticks all the boxes for us. We are moving up also, from our camper as age (Bugger) is catching up. + Now pulling the plug 12 months earlier then we had planned.
Can make sambo's for lunch a have a cupper without the flies. Its not to big and not to small.
We can't wait till our new way of seeing our playground.
Lambie gets her Shower / Loo, and we both can adventure off the bitumen to those spots we have still dreamed of.
Just Do It. Life's to Short.
Hey Jim & Lambie
Hey Jim said
07:01 PM Jun 3, 2015
I hope Bev gives you a bit of biff Bruce, Talking like that about young office girls. At your age................ Discussting behaviour,............... Shame on you.
At lease you could have asked for the senior office manager............LOL
Jim
Desert Dweller said
07:43 PM Jun 3, 2015
If you plan to stay in Caravan Parks most of the time & use the park amenities block like most people with en-suite vans do don't bother with an en-suite van use what you're paying for. LOL.
If you plan to free camp, can you legally tow the amount of water required in your tanks to have a shower with & where is it coming from & going to? LOL.
Treecrest14 said
09:08 PM Jun 3, 2015
2 Matters to consider:
a) Having to push up the poptop. We ended up selling our Jayco Expanda because I started to have trouble with my shoulders. Now have a Coromal Elements.
b) Why do you want a shower/toilet? If for casual/infrequent use, then a combines one is OK, but for frequent use then a separate Shower is the way to go.
You need to check not only if the vehicle can tow the size/weight, but also is the tow bar up to the down weight of the van - you need to check this yourself and don't rely on the sales people advising you.
BTW - If free camping, then you will require solar panels and this adds to the weight on the roof.
Glen
valiant81 said
08:39 AM Jun 4, 2015
Hi All;
We To Have a jayco and the same model as Big Jim's caravan ( 17.55.3 ), The Toilet and shower are handy and great for that early morning trip to the loo if need be. We Did a 6 week trip up to Darwin in 2013 and about this time of year as well ( ah memories ). One thing that i found out with a duel axel van is that when it came time for some of those B tripple's to over take you, our pop top did nor move on the road. don't know if it was how the van was loaded or because it had duel wheels, but the pajero and caravan did not move off line while these truck were passing, This at first was a concern to me, but the further up towards Darwin we traveled we traveled the more relaxed i became.
Our previous pop top and was also a jayco, same size and model (17.55.2 ), but did not have the toilet/ shower fitted and ended up upgrading to the model that did. This was also just as stable as our current van
We would have liked a full size caravan, but are limited by the height of the carport, even so the pop top just makes it with about 4" to spair.
Hylda&Jon said
01:49 PM Jun 4, 2015
Some info I have collected and put together over the years. Might help your decision. SOLID VAN OR POP TOP?
Solid van pro's # Stronger construction # More cupboard space # More secure and safer # There is a growing opinion that modern full size vans were so streamlined that there was negligible. difference in wind resistance compared to a poptop. # Many say they have a better sense of security as it is a solid shell # Easy to duck in at any time to do something on the road. i.e.: make a sandwich or use the toilet if it has one. # Less conspicuous when stopped and you are in it. # less to rot or go wrong i.e: the struts # They are easy to set up or to access at a moments notice, especially handy in the rain
Solid van Con's # Maybe more wind resistance over the top of the tow vehicle but with the newer aerodynamically designed caravans on the market today this may not be true anymore # There is more surface area on the side of the caravan for side winds to hit so in high wind areas there may be more buffeting & possible sway. I recommend always use anti-sway devices which are discussed later in the book). # Garaging often is a problem due to the extra height # There is less ventilation in a solid van due to the lack of the upper vents in the vinyl skirts that poptops have. -------------------------------------------- Poptop van pro's # Slightly lower centre of gravity # Most times they will fit under a normal garage roof with the top down (some people say to make the vinyl of the poptop section last better it's best to leave the top up when stored for a long time so with this in mind it may not fit in the garage anyway). #Maybe better wind resistance??? (definitely with the very low ones). #There is often increased ventilation due to the air flow resulting from the windows built into the upper vinyl skirt.
Poptop van con's # Vinyl area accumulates condensation & can get mildew & rot. # More moving parts than fixed caravan structures so vinyl or canvas sections and wind-up mechanisms suffer wear and tear. # A poptop requires more work as it has to be raised & lowered when setting up for camp. (though the roof section on the newer of these types of vans is much easier to lift than the older ones due to the inclusion of spring assisted scissors and gas struts). # If you pull up at roadside to eat it's awkward to do stuff with low ceiling # Quite often there is less upper cupboard space in poptops # Poptops can often feel a bit cramped when cooking etc due to the gap between the upper cupboards(which are lower because of poptop) & the lower benches. # The vinyl skirt is less insulated so the van is harder to keep cool or hot. # If you have stopped for the night where you aren't suppose to or don't want to be too obvious then a raised top is a dead give-away
Cheers
Jon
-- Edited by Hylda&Jon on Thursday 4th of June 2015 01:51:56 PM
Eager grey nomads said
02:54 PM Jun 6, 2015
Thanks Jon for all the details in your reply - extremely well thought out pros & cons.
-- Edited by Eager grey nomads on Saturday 6th of June 2015 02:55:08 PM
As new retirees, we are considering upgrading from 16ft Millard Horizon pop-top single axle without shower/toilet, to a 17.5 Jayco Journey double axle pop-top with shower & toilet for more extended touring. Any helpful comments, suggestions or opinions on this? Thanks heaps. Can't wait to set off!
Have you given any thought to a full size CV, maybe slip into a 18' with ensuite.
Thanks. Yes, we're also considering a full van but reckon a pop-up will be lighter and easier to pull.
If your tow vehicle is powerful enough, then I agree with Dougee - we have a van similar to his - 19'6" inside, not a pop top, has washing machine, toilet, shower, gas stove, grille, large oven, microwave, TV (I couldn't get the Dealer to throw in the young blonde office girl as an extra though).
Go talk to a few 'van Dealers about the maximum your vehicle will pull (get a few opinions - remember some are ex-used car sales staff lol) and also find out from a Dealer who sells your type and model of tow vehicle about it (but you will need to get some weights from a caravan dealer first) to get good advice from the car dealer - talk to their service manager. You can even go on-line and email the vehicles maker or importer here in Aust and they will help you with things like maximum towing weight, tow ball weight etc
Pop tops are not noticeably lighter than the equivalent full size. One I looked at recently was as few kgs lighter but heavier on the tow-ball. They may be easier to pull as they don't sit as high being the tow-car. Also have a better chance of fitting under a domestic garage or carport.
Hi
I retired last year, sold my 16ft road star pop top and upgraded to a full size Avan Frances, which has a separate toilet shower and hand basin. It is 17.5 single axle only problem so far was towing in strong cross winds.
i find the full height much warmer about 5 deg than the old pop top. I left Wollongong start of March and have travelled 10,000 km now at Carnarvon going clockwise
happy with my choice so far but the Avan is flimsy a couple minor issues but what van doesn't
-- Edited by graeme c on Wednesday 3rd of June 2015 05:52:47 PM
Hi DJ,
We signed on the dotted line on the last day of the Sydney super show for the same Jayco Journey Outback 17.55-3. with delivery Dec 2015.
It ticks all the boxes for us. We are moving up also, from our camper as age (Bugger) is catching up. + Now pulling the plug 12 months earlier then we had planned.
Can make sambo's for lunch a have a cupper without the flies. Its not to big and not to small.
We can't wait till our new way of seeing our playground.
Lambie gets her Shower / Loo, and we both can adventure off the bitumen to those spots we have still dreamed of.
Just Do It. Life's to Short.
Hey Jim & Lambie
I hope Bev gives you a bit of biff Bruce, Talking like that about young office girls. At your age................ Discussting behaviour,............... Shame on you.
At lease you could have asked for the senior office manager............LOL
Jim
If you plan to free camp, can you legally tow the amount of water required in your tanks to have a shower with & where is it coming from & going to? LOL.
a) Having to push up the poptop. We ended up selling our Jayco Expanda because I started to have trouble with my shoulders. Now have a Coromal Elements.
b) Why do you want a shower/toilet? If for casual/infrequent use, then a combines one is OK, but for frequent use then a separate Shower is the way to go.
You need to check not only if the vehicle can tow the size/weight, but also is the tow bar up to the down weight of the van - you need to check this yourself and don't rely on the sales people advising you.
BTW - If free camping, then you will require solar panels and this adds to the weight on the roof.
Glen
Hi All;
We To Have a jayco and the same model as Big Jim's caravan ( 17.55.3 ), The Toilet and shower are handy and great for that early morning trip to the loo if need be. We Did a 6 week trip up to Darwin in 2013 and about this time of year as well ( ah memories ). One thing that i found out with a duel axel van is that when it came time for some of those B tripple's to over take you, our pop top did nor move on the road. don't know if it was how the van was loaded or because it had duel wheels, but the pajero and caravan did not move off line while these truck were passing, This at first was a concern to me, but the further up towards Darwin we traveled we traveled the more relaxed i became.
Our previous pop top and was also a jayco, same size and model (17.55.2 ), but did not have the toilet/ shower fitted and ended up upgrading to the model that did. This was also just as stable as our current van
We would have liked a full size caravan, but are limited by the height of the carport, even so the pop top just makes it with about 4" to spair.
Some info I have collected and put together over the years. Might help your decision.
SOLID VAN OR POP TOP?
Solid van pro's
# Stronger construction
# More cupboard space
# More secure and safer
# There is a growing opinion that modern full size vans were so streamlined that there was negligible. difference in wind resistance compared to a poptop.
# Many say they have a better sense of security as it is a solid shell
# Easy to duck in at any time to do something on the road. i.e.: make a sandwich or use the toilet if it has one.
# Less conspicuous when stopped and you are in it.
# less to rot or go wrong i.e: the struts
# They are easy to set up or to access at a moments notice, especially handy in the rain
Solid van Con's
# Maybe more wind resistance over the top of the tow vehicle but with the newer aerodynamically designed caravans on the market today this may not be true anymore
# There is more surface area on the side of the caravan for side winds to hit so in high wind areas there may be more buffeting & possible sway. I recommend always use anti-sway devices which are discussed later in the book).
# Garaging often is a problem due to the extra height
# There is less ventilation in a solid van due to the lack of the upper vents in the vinyl skirts that poptops have.
--------------------------------------------
Poptop van pro's
# Slightly lower centre of gravity
# Most times they will fit under a normal garage roof with the top down (some people say to make the vinyl of the poptop section last better it's best to leave the top up when stored for a long time so with this in mind it may not fit in the garage anyway).
#Maybe better wind resistance??? (definitely with the very low ones).
#There is often increased ventilation due to the air flow resulting from the windows built into the upper vinyl skirt.
Poptop van con's
# Vinyl area accumulates condensation & can get mildew & rot.
# More moving parts than fixed caravan structures so vinyl or canvas sections and wind-up mechanisms suffer wear and tear.
# A poptop requires more work as it has to be raised & lowered when setting up for camp. (though the roof section on the newer of these types of vans is much easier to lift than the older ones due to the inclusion of spring assisted scissors and gas struts).
# If you pull up at roadside to eat it's awkward to do stuff with low ceiling
# Quite often there is less upper cupboard space in poptops
# Poptops can often feel a bit cramped when cooking etc due to the gap between the upper cupboards(which are lower because of poptop) & the lower benches.
# The vinyl skirt is less insulated so the van is harder to keep cool or hot.
# If you have stopped for the night where you aren't suppose to or don't want to be too obvious then a raised top is a dead give-away
Cheers
Jon
-- Edited by Hylda&Jon on Thursday 4th of June 2015 01:51:56 PM
Thanks Jon for all the details in your reply - extremely well thought out pros & cons.
-- Edited by Eager grey nomads on Saturday 6th of June 2015 02:55:08 PM