looking at one and want to know what that are like,Diesel are more expensive than the V8
and fuel consumption you are getting with the V8, its only for pulling the Van, will not be used for day to day driving
The diesel what is the mileage you would stay stay away from before thy start playing up just to give me a guide line
JayDee said
07:20 AM Oct 16, 2014
My guideline for you is " Don't buy a Rover"
You will have one hell of a issue trying to get someone to look at any problems outside of the major service centres, and even they struggle. eg. dealer at Tamworth, needs to go for a refresher course etc etc.
Buy a "CRUISER". some one some where will have knowledge to help you if in trouble.
Just my twopence worth Jay&Dee
Grams said
07:47 AM Oct 16, 2014
Yep I'd say stick with the. Toyota Landcruiser, it's almost an icon in Australia, there are parts available that are easier to get and cheaper than most other 4WD especially the Land Rover. The fuel economy of the Cruiser is fantastic. We have had a Cruiser Petrol and now a. Prado Diesel. I'd go diesel over petrol any day for towing. Petrol is expensive to run a 4 WD, we have had use and friends regret getting a petrol one. But we love the Prado we can drive nearly 400km on a 1/4 of a tank, but ours has two fuel tanks, great on long trips.
Woody n Sue said
08:17 AM Oct 16, 2014
I agree with these posts however I am a patrol man myself have had a fantastic run with my old one it will be 22 years old at Xmas half a mil km and still going great would not have spent $1000 on out side normal maintenance in that time .
I have just bought an 05 one of the last of the 4.2 diesels like the Toyota's very reliable and if something did go haywire almost anyone can fix it and parts are available everywhere I have a 24ft 5th wheeler and get 18 L /100 km at 100 kmh but I will improve on that when I fit a HHO gas kit to it should bring it back to about 14 or less.
Just my 2 bobs worth
Woody
dING said
08:43 AM Oct 16, 2014
Being a dyed in the wool Land Rover Addict
I cannot see why anyone would buy any other
Clunker cause Land Rovers offer the best go anywhere
4 WDs and far better fuel economy than any of the Jap
Crap also they last nearly forever as there is very little to rust
And something like 86% of all Landys ever made
Are still being driven around not rusting quietly
Away in a paddock or shed somewhere
Have a 3500lb tow rating but I will admit they aint quick
But that is just my unbiased opinion
My personal vehicle is a 86 county 110 with a 3.8 litre
Isuzu motor that is gunna see me out comfortably
-- Edited by dING on Thursday 16th of October 2014 10:13:33 AM
rockylizard said
09:25 AM Oct 16, 2014
Gday...
Oh well cowboy, as you can see there very few who can see beyond a Toyota LC/Prado or Patrol.
I can fully understand why they have these opinions as I have owned 60, 80 and 100 series Cruisers over the past 30-odd years - both petrol and diesel.
They were very serviceable and mostly reliable vehicles and did their job. Then again the 100 series I had did have some persistent problems that neither dealers or 'other' mechanics were ever able to eradicate.
I concede that there is a much wider "dealer network" for Toyota and Patrol and that can certainly be a consideration. However, it is a furphy these days that "every bush mechanic can fix a Toyota" - that lost its relevance with the complex models produced in recent years.
You have not stated which LR Discovery you are considering. If it is a Discovery 1 or 2 then perhaps it could be a problem given their history - albeit one could assume that any of their 'inherent' problems should have been 'serviced out' by now.
I have a 2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Auto SE. I bought it in 2010 with 70,000km on it and it now has 170,000km showing. I travel full-time towing a 23ft 2,600Kg van.
Reliability - I have not a problem that has stopped me on the road. I have replaced an alternator, an air compressor for the air suspension, brake pads front and rear and brake rotors on the rear. I change engine oil and engine oil filter every 6,000km (LR stipulate 12,000km) and changed the transmission oil and filter at 80,000km and again at 130,000km. LR state it is not due until 240,000km but I prefer the 'insurance' of fresh oil. I have met at least 30 other Discovery 3 (and 4) owners in my travels and not one of them has had anything but praise for the vehicle and have not been stuck from a breakdown.
Economy - I keep a spread sheet with actual litres used and Km travelled. Overall, since I purchased the vehicle it has averaged 14.01ltr/100km. Towing: best 12.3ltr/100km Canberra to Sydney - worst 16.9ltr/100km Normanton to Mount Surprise (strong head wind). I travel at 85-90kph usually in Drive but use the 'manual' feature of the auto when going down hills. I sat on 100kph in 2012 travelling from Kalgoorlie to Sale in Gippsland in four days and returned between 14.5 and 15.8ltr/100 for the 3,000km. There was a medical emergency at home. When not towing the Discovery returns between 8.5-9.5ltrs/100kph sitting on 110kph.
Towing - the Discovery is without doubt the best tow vehicle I have owned. It pulls the 2,600Kg effortlessly. It has excellent stability and comfort. LR do not recommend the use of a WDH (which bothered me when I first bought the vehicle as I had ALWAYS used a WDH towing) but the ride, braking and steering are excellent.
As I stated I travel full-time and have spent the majority of my travels in outback QLD, NSW, SA and the WA Goldfields. I have never had any difficulty finding either a dealer or 'independent' service provider. If unable to find someone with "LR experience" I simply go to an Audi/VW/BMW/Mercedes dealer who are always familiar with 'modern electronic' vehicles. Interestingly, despite what Toyota aficionados will say, the 200 series LC is as electronically complex as the Discovery and equally difficult to find even a dealer with 'expert/current' experience with 'unusual problems'. Given the only things I have needed on the Discovery have been regular services it is not difficult to find someone, in my case, every 6,000km (six months).
I also have Land Rover Aussie Assist - which is a comprehensive roadside assistance product for $140/year. They will attend my vehicle as long as they can do so with a two-wheel drive vehicle or provide advice via the telephone to any mechanic to assist in diagnosing/fixing any fault/problem. I also have RACV Total Care - which is almost a duplication of the LR one - but I would use it if an affiliated service agent was nearby should I need it - with the LR Aussie Assist as telephonic backup. I have not had a need to call either organisation in the past five years.
I began my ownership of my Discovery 3 with some trepidation initially (regarding the 'reputation' of reliability and service agents) but none of those fears have come to fruition. I am totally happy with the vehicle and I often think about what I would upgrade to, should I decide to do so. I have test driven Toyota, Nissan, Mazda, Ford, Holden and Izusu 4X4s and despite my vehicle being an "old 2006 model" I have yet to find one I would rather own than the my Discovery.
An excellent site to visit and read for advice is http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/ There is much knowledge on that forum - from LR Service Managers/mechanics/technicians/owners.
In conclusion (at last I hear you say), every modern vehicle on the market has its strengths and weaknesses; every modern vehicle has more electronic wizardry than 10 years ago; NO dealer has readily available spare parts for their vehicles - they only carry 'fast-moving' 'normal' service items - anything outside 'normal' service will require a wait for parts from 24 hours to two weeks; the final decision to purchase a vehicle is always VERY individual (often emotional ) and that is what you should do - do your research, drive various examples, and make your OWN decision - there is NO perfect vehicle.
I apologise for the long-winded response - but I hope I have at least provided some variation to the usual advice that comes from asking "which tug should I buy".
Cheers - John
Plendo said
01:56 PM Oct 16, 2014
Cowboy7307, I also tow with a discovery, in my case a Discovery4 SE, and where John has given you his experience with his relatively long term towing experience, I am a recent Landrover purchaser.
We have owned our vehicle for about 18 months, during that time we have had one service at 13,000km (half the recommended 26,000km service gap), and have experienced zero problems with the vehicle. In normal running, mainly in Melbourne it is rare to see the fuel consumption climb above 10l/100k.
We tow a 23ft van that weighs in at above 3,300kg loaded, it sits high on independent suspension, and as such it generates a lot of drag. The high level of drag explains the difference in consumption we experience as our towing speed changes. When towing with the cruise set on 90kph, we return 13.6l/100k. When we increase the speed and set the cruise control at 100kph we return 14.6l/100k.
When I was looking at which vehicle to purchase, there were three things steered me towards the Discovery:
1. Technically it is a modern vehicle, it is not an upgrade from a 1970/80 base vehicle. The modern discovery was released in 2006, and was effectively a brand new vehicle designed specifically for towing. It just happens to also be comfortable. As an example the decent suspension design means you do not need to bother with add ons like weight distribution hitches etc. to compensate for inadequate or old designs. It might be cheaper to use a solid axle on leaf springs (hence why it is used on utes), but it is a design that started when they measured fuel consumption in bales per mile.
2. It is a lot easier to build a legal rig based on a discovery than most other vehicles. Why ? Because Landrover define their tare weight including a driver (admittedly a skinny one), and half a tank of fuel, where most others define it with the vehicle empty. Thus it is possible to stay within the payload in your tow vehicle. It is very easy to consume your 700kg payload between driver, passenger, fuel, frdge, bull bar, roof rack, and 300kg of ball weight sitting on the towball (most Landcruisers are exceeding their payload).
3. I drove a Discovery. In my opinion the driving experience is just so far ahead of everything else, and as a bonus it also happens to be cheaper than an equivalent cruiser (the benchmark we were using).
Now I better duck.
Radar said
06:05 PM Oct 16, 2014
Hi All
2 great responses, my Discovery brought 2nd hand at 135000 ks was not all that kind to me with the auto falling prematurely at 155000 ks but the point I am trying to make is it was no dearer to rebuild then any others, a bearing on the pulley at the front of the motor could of been sauced from almost any where and the list goes on
One of the surprising jobs done was the electric window winder cheap as around $45 compared to my other car/Jeep in $300.
We changed cars because we wanted a ute, I recall enjoying the great brakes, also the ride and handling.
Best part was that I was able to buy this car at $15000 cheaper then a Toyota or Nissan and with far better economy.
If the man is looking for a cheap tow vechile hard to go past one. Ralph.
blaze said
08:33 PM Oct 16, 2014
I am also of the landie loving mob, currently don't own one atm but will again
cheers
blaze
Woody n Sue said
10:00 PM Oct 16, 2014
Love this forum no slick salesman crap here just honest owner driver information .
If you have had a good run with any breed of car than you will normally stick with it.
The final decision is yours and yours alone cowboy whichever way you go I hope it works well for you
Cowboy7307 said
02:28 AM Oct 17, 2014
Thank you for all the replies
, we went looking yesterday and tried a Discovery 2.5 diesel ,was a lovely thing to drive but was way to big for SWMBO so will keep the Forester as every day, she feels safe driving it ,
Had a look at a territory was thinking sell one buy one, that was a no go ether, so its going to be an older style tug, the thing is do i buy a petrol or diesel,i know if a diesel stuffs up its big bucks to fix, also thy are twice as expensive to buy,
Any one driving one
looking at one and want to know what that are like,Diesel are more expensive than the V8
and fuel consumption you are getting with the V8, its only for pulling the Van, will not be used for day to day driving
The diesel what is the mileage you would stay stay away from before thy start playing up just to give me a guide line
You will have one hell of a issue trying to get someone to look at any problems outside of the major service centres, and even they struggle. eg. dealer at Tamworth, needs to go for a refresher course etc etc.
Buy a "CRUISER". some one some where will have knowledge to help you if in trouble.
Just my twopence worth Jay&Dee
I have just bought an 05 one of the last of the 4.2 diesels like the Toyota's very reliable and if something did go haywire almost anyone can fix it and parts are available everywhere I have a 24ft 5th wheeler and get 18 L /100 km at 100 kmh but I will improve on that when I fit a HHO gas kit to it should bring it back to about 14 or less.
Just my 2 bobs worth
Woody
Being a dyed in the wool Land Rover Addict
I cannot see why anyone would buy any other
Clunker cause Land Rovers offer the best go anywhere
4 WDs and far better fuel economy than any of the Jap
Crap also they last nearly forever as there is very little to rust
And something like 86% of all Landys ever made
Are still being driven around not rusting quietly
Away in a paddock or shed somewhere
Have a 3500lb tow rating but I will admit they aint quick
But that is just my unbiased opinion
My personal vehicle is a 86 county 110 with a 3.8 litre
Isuzu motor that is gunna see me out comfortably
-- Edited by dING on Thursday 16th of October 2014 10:13:33 AM
Gday...
Oh well cowboy, as you can see there very few who can see beyond a Toyota LC/Prado or Patrol.
I can fully understand why they have these opinions as I have owned 60, 80 and 100 series Cruisers over the past 30-odd years - both petrol and diesel.
They were very serviceable and mostly reliable vehicles and did their job. Then again the 100 series I had did have some persistent problems that neither dealers or 'other' mechanics were ever able to eradicate.
I concede that there is a much wider "dealer network" for Toyota and Patrol and that can certainly be a consideration. However, it is a furphy these days that "every bush mechanic can fix a Toyota" - that lost its relevance with the complex models produced in recent years.
You have not stated which LR Discovery you are considering. If it is a Discovery 1 or 2 then perhaps it could be a problem given their history - albeit one could assume that any of their 'inherent' problems should have been 'serviced out' by now.
I have a 2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Auto SE. I bought it in 2010 with 70,000km on it and it now has 170,000km showing. I travel full-time towing a 23ft 2,600Kg van.
Reliability - I have not a problem that has stopped me on the road. I have replaced an alternator, an air compressor for the air suspension, brake pads front and rear and brake rotors on the rear. I change engine oil and engine oil filter every 6,000km (LR stipulate 12,000km) and changed the transmission oil and filter at 80,000km and again at 130,000km. LR state it is not due until 240,000km but I prefer the 'insurance' of fresh oil. I have met at least 30 other Discovery 3 (and 4) owners in my travels and not one of them has had anything but praise for the vehicle and have not been stuck from a breakdown.
Economy - I keep a spread sheet with actual litres used and Km travelled. Overall, since I purchased the vehicle it has averaged 14.01ltr/100km. Towing: best 12.3ltr/100km Canberra to Sydney - worst 16.9ltr/100km Normanton to Mount Surprise (strong head wind). I travel at 85-90kph usually in Drive but use the 'manual' feature of the auto when going down hills. I sat on 100kph in 2012 travelling from Kalgoorlie to Sale in Gippsland in four days and returned between 14.5 and 15.8ltr/100 for the 3,000km. There was a medical emergency at home. When not towing the Discovery returns between 8.5-9.5ltrs/100kph sitting on 110kph.
Towing - the Discovery is without doubt the best tow vehicle I have owned. It pulls the 2,600Kg effortlessly. It has excellent stability and comfort. LR do not recommend the use of a WDH (which bothered me when I first bought the vehicle as I had ALWAYS used a WDH towing) but the ride, braking and steering are excellent.
As I stated I travel full-time and have spent the majority of my travels in outback QLD, NSW, SA and the WA Goldfields. I have never had any difficulty finding either a dealer or 'independent' service provider. If unable to find someone with "LR experience" I simply go to an Audi/VW/BMW/Mercedes dealer who are always familiar with 'modern electronic' vehicles. Interestingly, despite what Toyota aficionados will say, the 200 series LC is as electronically complex as the Discovery and equally difficult to find even a dealer with 'expert/current' experience with 'unusual problems'. Given the only things I have needed on the Discovery have been regular services it is not difficult to find someone, in my case, every 6,000km (six months).
I also have Land Rover Aussie Assist - which is a comprehensive roadside assistance product for $140/year. They will attend my vehicle as long as they can do so with a two-wheel drive vehicle or provide advice via the telephone to any mechanic to assist in diagnosing/fixing any fault/problem. I also have RACV Total Care - which is almost a duplication of the LR one - but I would use it if an affiliated service agent was nearby should I need it - with the LR Aussie Assist as telephonic backup. I have not had a need to call either organisation in the past five years.
I began my ownership of my Discovery 3 with some trepidation initially (regarding the 'reputation' of reliability and service agents) but none of those fears have come to fruition. I am totally happy with the vehicle and I often think about what I would upgrade to, should I decide to do so. I have test driven Toyota, Nissan, Mazda, Ford, Holden and Izusu 4X4s and despite my vehicle being an "old 2006 model" I have yet to find one I would rather own than the my Discovery.
An excellent site to visit and read for advice is http://www.aulro.com/afvb/d3-d4-rrs/ There is much knowledge on that forum - from LR Service Managers/mechanics/technicians/owners.
In conclusion (at last I hear you say), every modern vehicle on the market has its strengths and weaknesses; every modern vehicle has more electronic wizardry than 10 years ago; NO dealer has readily available spare parts for their vehicles - they only carry 'fast-moving' 'normal' service items - anything outside 'normal' service will require a wait for parts from 24 hours to two weeks; the final decision to purchase a vehicle is always VERY individual (often emotional
) and that is what you should do - do your research, drive various examples, and make your OWN decision - there is NO perfect vehicle.
I apologise for the long-winded response - but I hope I have at least provided some variation to the usual advice that comes from asking "which tug should I buy".
Cheers - John
We have owned our vehicle for about 18 months, during that time we have had one service at 13,000km (half the recommended 26,000km service gap), and have experienced zero problems with the vehicle. In normal running, mainly in Melbourne it is rare to see the fuel consumption climb above 10l/100k.
We tow a 23ft van that weighs in at above 3,300kg loaded, it sits high on independent suspension, and as such it generates a lot of drag. The high level of drag explains the difference in consumption we experience as our towing speed changes. When towing with the cruise set on 90kph, we return 13.6l/100k. When we increase the speed and set the cruise control at 100kph we return 14.6l/100k.
When I was looking at which vehicle to purchase, there were three things steered me towards the Discovery:
1. Technically it is a modern vehicle, it is not an upgrade from a 1970/80 base vehicle. The modern discovery was released in 2006, and was effectively a brand new vehicle designed specifically for towing. It just happens to also be comfortable. As an example the decent suspension design means you do not need to bother with add ons like weight distribution hitches etc. to compensate for inadequate or old designs. It might be cheaper to use a solid axle on leaf springs (hence why it is used on utes), but it is a design that started when they measured fuel consumption in bales per mile.
2. It is a lot easier to build a legal rig based on a discovery than most other vehicles. Why ? Because Landrover define their tare weight including a driver (admittedly a skinny one), and half a tank of fuel, where most others define it with the vehicle empty. Thus it is possible to stay within the payload in your tow vehicle. It is very easy to consume your 700kg payload between driver, passenger, fuel, frdge, bull bar, roof rack, and 300kg of ball weight sitting on the towball (most Landcruisers are exceeding their payload).
3. I drove a Discovery. In my opinion the driving experience is just so far ahead of everything else, and as a bonus it also happens to be cheaper than an equivalent cruiser (the benchmark we were using).
Now I better duck.
Hi All
2 great responses, my Discovery brought 2nd hand at 135000 ks was not all that kind to me with the auto falling prematurely at 155000 ks but the point I am trying to make is it was no dearer to rebuild then any others, a bearing on the pulley at the front of the motor could of been sauced from almost any where and the list goes on
One of the surprising jobs done was the electric window winder cheap as around $45 compared to my other car/Jeep in $300.
We changed cars because we wanted a ute, I recall enjoying the great brakes, also the ride and handling.
Best part was that I was able to buy this car at $15000 cheaper then a Toyota or Nissan and with far better economy.
If the man is looking for a cheap tow vechile hard to go past one. Ralph.
cheers
blaze
If you have had a good run with any breed of car than you will normally stick with it.
The final decision is yours and yours alone cowboy whichever way you go I hope it works well for you
, we went looking yesterday and tried a Discovery 2.5 diesel ,was a lovely thing to drive but was way to big for SWMBO so will keep the Forester as every day, she feels safe driving it ,
Had a look at a territory was thinking sell one buy one, that was a no go ether, so its going to be an older style tug, the thing is do i buy a petrol or diesel,i know if a diesel stuffs up its big bucks to fix, also thy are twice as expensive to buy,