Hi All, we are still on the search for our van for retirement. There are lots of vans with solar panels, larger batteries or dual batteries etc. Some people buy generators. But in reality how long does a normal battery last? How long does a heavy duty battery last? Obviously I know the more the battery is used the quicker it will go flat, but if you pulled in and free camped a night or two and were careful with use, would there still be lights available. I am sure an experienced nomad will know the answer! Still learning......cheers Steve
Bevandy2 said
10:47 PM Sep 22, 2014
Hi Steve, as the saying goes, batteries aint batteries.
I used to fit the van with a car battery to suit our Fairlane, but soon found that didn't last, the plan being to have a spare car battery available. Bad move. I soon realised that if I felt the need to carry a spare car battery it was best to get one and carry it in the boot.
Eventually an electrician advised me, and this has worked perfectly, in 2009 we had fitted to the van a "smart charger" CTek and on his advice bought an AGM 100 amp hour deep cycle battery, which is still going good after over 5 years. (bought from Battery World)
The smart charger, though expensive, is a clever little thing that rejuvenates the battery as it charges. (It is built into the van)
Deep cycle batteries are designed to tolerate flattening and recharging, which car batteries don't like.
For the van if you don't already have them, change all the light globes over to LED, they are costly initially, but use very little power, and you can safely run them off the battery without fear of flattening the battery, also they give you a nice bright light, not that lousy yellow we get from other globes. And they run cool.
Since fitting them we no longer have to worry about supplementary lighting, they are great.
Hopefully that will get you started, others will help.
Bevan
Dougwe said
08:10 AM Sep 23, 2014
Quickly and simply.....NOT VERY LONG WITHOUT THE RIGHT GEAR.
I agree with Bevan and more than likely other's that will pop up with great comments as well.
I have just ordered a new van and getting 300w of solar on roof and plenty of battery power to see me through the night, probably quite a few nights really. More than enough for my needs, at this stage anyway and time will tell.
The most important thing to do IMO is make sure you have enough Solar Panels and Batteries BUT most importantly is make sure you have good size cable from the panels and to the Charger for the batteries. Also and as well even, make sure the charger is as close to the battery as possible NOT down the other end of the van. The closer the better.
I use 6B&S cable where possible and have been told it is over kill. I disagree and reckon there is no such thing as over kill when it comes to 12v and Solar Power.
There are a few very knowledgeable people on this great forum and I took notice and learnt from them and now enjoying trouble free playing in the playground.
-- Edited by Dougwe on Tuesday 23rd of September 2014 08:14:59 AM
magraret said
08:30 AM Sep 23, 2014
have sent you a message
Big Gorilla said
08:44 AM Sep 23, 2014
Dougwe wrote:
Quickly and simply.....NOT VERY LONG WITHOUT THE RIGHT GEAR.
I agree with Bevan and more than likely other's that will pop up with great comments as well.
I have just ordered a new van and getting 300w of solar on roof and plenty of battery power to see me through the night, probably quite a few nights really. More than enough for my needs, at this stage anyway and time will tell.
The most important thing to do IMO is make sure you have enough Solar Panels and Batteries BUT most importantly is make sure you have good size cable from the panels and to the Charger for the batteries. Also and as well even, make sure the charger is as close to the battery as possible NOT down the other end of the van. The closer the better.
I use 6B&S cable where possible and have been told it is over kill. I disagree and reckon there is no such thing as over kill when it comes to 12v and Solar Power.
There are a few very knowledgeable people on this great forum and I took notice and learnt from them and now enjoying trouble free playing in the playground.
-- Edited by Dougwe on Tuesday 23rd of September 2014 08:14:59 AM
Doug is right. By comparison I have 235 watts Solar and 2 Century Deep Cycle batteries. These are 6 volt batteries connected in series to give 12 volt. Each battery is 235 amp/hours. Large cable size is very important to avoid voltage drop. Don't be concerned about overkill. My batteries are 4 years old and going strong. I put this down to maintenance. Check the water level every week and top up when necessary with distilled water, not tap water. You can buy 4 or 5 liters distilled water at any auto store. Apart from normal appliances, TV, water pump etc.,I run the refrig. 24/7 on 12 volt.
Brenda and Alan said
08:50 AM Sep 23, 2014
Chargers that have a desulphation (rejuvenation )cycle built in to the programing are detrimental to AGM type batteries and are not recommended by battery manufacturers for this type of battery. If the programing can be altered it is highly recommended to delete this stage to avoid damage.
Alan
Brenda and Alan said
08:59 AM Sep 23, 2014
Battery life depends on so many factors the it is nigh on impossible to predict. Without intimate knowledge of how the battery is charged/discharged and stored among other things makes for this difficulty. There is so much misinformation on forums that only by seeking facts from manufacturers not marketers that correct info can be obtained on how to treat your batteries.
Alan
Reed said
09:29 AM Sep 23, 2014
They last until you really, really need them! OK, we have been full-timing for seven years and our original AGMs and current LFPs have never given us any problems. However, I am OCD and monitor the charge several times a day and adjust usage accordingly. If we are camped in full shade for a week, the inverter is turned off unless in use etc. If full sun and things are well charged, then run fridge and hot water during day and fridge at night (24 hours).
Read all the posts on thread and there are just a bunch of good ideas.
Reed and Elaine
banjo said
12:51 PM Sep 23, 2014
So many factors involved, how you treat your batteries is the main killer.
Some so called smart chargers are battery killers, especially if you have loads running from batteries whilst connected to said chargers. One of my previous vans had two 120 A/H new batteries that died in about 18 months ! due to the stupid charger going into boost charge every time the compressor fridge came on.
It could not "sense" the battery was fully charged but only under slight load, and continued to boil away the batteries till eventually they gave up.
I replaced the charger with a top quality Ctek 25 A and no more problems, as the Ctek could sense that even though the batteries were supplying a small load they were ok and fine on float.
Another thing with some of these cheap so called smart chargers is they have an AC voltage ripple on the DC output side (not enough smoothing circuits in the design) another battery killer.
My current van has no connection to the vehicle at all, runs a Ctek 25A for shore charge/power and has a quality Morningstar 45A solar controller fed from 560W solar, I run 2 fridges, Waeco rpd 175 2 door, and an Engel 40ltr, both compressor types.
My two 120A AGM's are over 2 1/2 years old full time use, and are still as good as new ! never ran short of power when off road camping and hardly ever comes off float charge when in parks.
Plendo said
01:26 PM Sep 23, 2014
As has been stated by many above, the greatest factor in how well your battery will survive is how you treat it, and there is no doubt that good equipment matched to your battery type is the best way to achieve a good treatment regime for a battery, or set of batteries.
Another consideration is the battery type, and to some extent battery quality. The life of a battery is quoted by the manufacturer as a number of cycles, and currently this ranges from the old flooded lead acid at 300 to 500 cycles, all the way through to the newer LifePo4 (Lithium) batteries with some quoting up to 7,000 cycles.
As someone said earlier all batteries are not the same.
SnowT said
01:42 PM Sep 23, 2014
Plendo has hit the nail..
One Factor..
which A lot of people don't understand.. You need enough Solar or other charging ability to recharge the Batteries..
- Best thing if you are going for Solar charging is to have Plenty of solar when compared Battery..
For OLD school batteries.. LA's AGM's Calcium or Gel Batteries
My rule of thumb is to go at minimum 200w per 100Ah of Battery.. for a Light Load..
For a Medium or Heavier Load I would double up on the Solar..
The Thing that Kills the Batteries is NOT recharging them ASAP..
With regard to Battery Life that is dependent on how they are used.. The heavier the use[up to 50% of charge the Shorter the Life of the batteries..]
Most Lead acid have a Life @ 50% State of Charge of 400-800 cycles..[ From cheapest to Expensive..[Lifeline]
Juergen
Esperian said
03:13 PM Sep 23, 2014
Steve11 wrote:
Hi All, we are still on the search for our van for retirement. There are lots of vans with solar panels, larger batteries or dual batteries etc. Some people buy generators. But in reality how long does a normal battery last? How long does a heavy duty battery last? Obviously I know the more the battery is used the quicker it will go flat, but if you pulled in and free camped a night or two and were careful with use, would there still be lights available. I am sure an experienced nomad will know the answer! Still learning......cheers Steve
Hi Steeve.
I don't know what you are after exactly, but Here is some of my personal experience:
I bought a 100 Amh (Amper-Hours) deep cycle Flooded Acid type battery at the, Supercheap Cars, for 220 AUD, some 3 years ago. It served me working without any serious problem till about May this year, and after even 48 hour time recharge on smallest amperage, with my battery charger with battery renewal thing inbuilt, she stopped holding a charge for anything more than few minutes, and Inverted screamed like crazy when I tried to use it. And it was only a small 300W inverter and just laptop use. I used that battery very intensively during all that time, though. The warranty on it was only 6 months, so it isn't really something superb, but still she lasted me for some 2.5 years of intensive use, and before that, for some 6 month of occasional use.
What happened is that, in May this year she has gone totally bad. Fellow from NRMA here in Lightning Ridge, checked this battery out, and sadly told me: look mate, your battery is a goner. I can't do nothing. You must buy another one.
I recalled then about the movie I saw on You Tube some time ago, and I went there to check what I can do.
In the result, I abstained from blowing out my money (something between 220 to some 380 or even over 400 AUD) for new battery and bought instead a packet of Epsom Salts. I got an old pot and dissolved Epsom Salts in the distillate water, that I bought long time ago for batteries, preparing a Saturated Solution. This means, you keep steering the mixture, adding the salts slowly to the water till you will see that it doesn't dissolve any more, and some of the Epsom Salt stays on the bottom. Than take a Table Spoon of that mixture (at that stage it out to be about as thick as a syrup) and poor it into each cell of your battery, and recharge it on a slow charge. Nothing else...
It may not catch immediately full power, but after second and third recharge it is already strong as new, and afer a third recharge, with normal high amperage from a car, in my case, it became actually better than it ever was, even when it was new... So I got no more problem, and serious money saved.
I recommend this highly. I tried it I use it and I'm happy with it even more than with two new batteries I bought earlier to my caravan. The repaired battery I talk here about, is of my dual battery system's house battery in my towing vehicle.
Bryan said
03:17 PM Sep 23, 2014
Brenda and Alan wrote:
Chargers that have a desulphation (rejuvenation )cycle built in to the programing are detrimental to AGM type batteries and are not recommended by battery manufacturers for this type of battery. If the programing can be altered it is highly recommended to delete this stage to avoid damage.
Alan
Thanks Alan, I wasn't aware of that, I was wondering why my charger has a different settings for different types of batteries. Now I know.
aussie_paul said
03:19 PM Sep 23, 2014
Hi Steeve.
I don't know what you are after exactly, but Here is some of my personal experience:
I bought a 100 Amh (Amper-Hours) deep cycle Flooded Acid type battery at the, Supercheap Cars, for 220 AUD, some 3 years ago. It served me working without any serious problem till about May this year, and after even 48 hour time recharge on smallest amperage, with my battery charger with battery renewal thing inbuilt, she stopped holding a charge for anything more than few minutes, and Inverted screamed like crazy when I tried to use it. And it was only a small 300W inverter and just laptop use. I used that battery very intensively during all that time, though. The warranty on it was only 6 months, so it isn't really something superb, but still she lasted me for some 2.5 years of intensive use, and before that, for some 6 month of occasional use.
What happened is that, in May this year she has gone totally bad. Fellow from NRMA here in Lightning Ridge, checked this battery out, and sadly told me: look mate, your battery is a goner. I can't do nothing. You must buy another one.
I recalled then about the movie I saw on You Tube some time ago, and I went there to check what I can do.
In the result, I abstained from blowing out my money (something between 220 to some 380 or even over 400 AUD) for new battery and bought instead a packet of Epsom Salts. I got an old pot and dissolved Epsom Salts in the distillate water, that I bought long time ago for batteries, preparing a Saturated Solution. This means, you keep steering the mixture, adding the salts slowly to the water till you will see that it doesn't dissolve any more, and some of the Epsom Salt stays on the bottom. Than take a Table Spoon of that mixture (at that stage it out to be about as thick as a syrup) and poor it into each cell of your battery, and recharge it on a slow charge. Nothing else...
It may not catch immediately full power, but after second and third recharge it is already strong as new, and afer a third recharge, with normal high amperage from a car, in my case, it became actually better than it ever was, even when it was new... So I got no more problem, and serious money saved.
I recommend this highly. I tried it I use it and I'm happy with it even more than with two new batteries I bought earlier to my caravan. The repaired battery I talk here about, is of my dual battery system's house battery in my towing vehicle.
I just love successful stories like that. I don't have too many of my own, but some...
Aussie Paul.
Baz421 said
10:34 PM Sep 23, 2014
We have 4 100 ah wet cell AGM's. Replaced one after 3 years (a dud) the other 3 are 8 years old and still going. Don't take em below 50%.
Pedro_The_Swift said
06:53 AM Sep 24, 2014
I cant see for the life of me why you'd buy any battery not totally sealed.
The 2-1 ratio is a good starting point, and beyond 200 amps you can throw the charger away.
I count my amps like I count my beers and the newer Morningstar controllers tell you pretty much all you need in that regard.
Batteries are like everything else these days,, you can do all the research you need to do--
and still buy a lemon ;)
Hi All, we are still on the search for our van for retirement. There are lots of vans with solar panels, larger batteries or dual batteries etc. Some people buy generators. But in reality how long does a normal battery last? How long does a heavy duty battery last? Obviously I know the more the battery is used the quicker it will go flat, but if you pulled in and free camped a night or two and were careful with use, would there still be lights available. I am sure an experienced nomad will know the answer! Still learning......cheers Steve
I used to fit the van with a car battery to suit our Fairlane, but soon found that didn't last, the plan being to have a spare car battery available. Bad move. I soon realised that if I felt the need to carry a spare car battery it was best to get one and carry it in the boot.
Eventually an electrician advised me, and this has worked perfectly, in 2009 we had fitted to the van a "smart charger" CTek and on his advice bought an AGM 100 amp hour deep cycle battery, which is still going good after over 5 years. (bought from Battery World)
The smart charger, though expensive, is a clever little thing that rejuvenates the battery as it charges. (It is built into the van)
Deep cycle batteries are designed to tolerate flattening and recharging, which car batteries don't like.
For the van if you don't already have them, change all the light globes over to LED, they are costly initially, but use very little power, and you can safely run them off the battery without fear of flattening the battery, also they give you a nice bright light, not that lousy yellow we get from other globes. And they run cool.
Since fitting them we no longer have to worry about supplementary lighting, they are great.
Hopefully that will get you started, others will help.
Bevan
Quickly and simply.....NOT VERY LONG WITHOUT THE RIGHT GEAR.
I agree with Bevan and more than likely other's that will pop up with great comments as well.
I have just ordered a new van and getting 300w of solar on roof and plenty of battery power to see me through the night, probably quite a few nights really. More than enough for my needs, at this stage anyway and time will tell.
The most important thing to do IMO is make sure you have enough Solar Panels and Batteries BUT most importantly is make sure you have good size cable from the panels and to the Charger for the batteries. Also and as well even, make sure the charger is as close to the battery as possible NOT down the other end of the van. The closer the better.
I use 6B&S cable where possible and have been told it is over kill. I disagree and reckon there is no such thing as over kill when it comes to 12v and Solar Power.
There are a few very knowledgeable people on this great forum and I took notice and learnt from them and now enjoying trouble free playing in the playground.
-- Edited by Dougwe on Tuesday 23rd of September 2014 08:14:59 AM
have sent you a message
Doug is right. By comparison I have 235 watts Solar and 2 Century Deep Cycle batteries. These are 6 volt batteries connected in series to give 12 volt. Each battery is 235 amp/hours. Large cable size is very important to avoid voltage drop. Don't be concerned about overkill. My batteries are 4 years old and going strong. I put this down to maintenance. Check the water level every week and top up when necessary with distilled water, not tap water. You can buy 4 or 5 liters distilled water at any auto store. Apart from normal appliances, TV, water pump etc.,I run the refrig. 24/7 on 12 volt.
Chargers that have a desulphation (rejuvenation )cycle built in to the programing are detrimental to AGM type batteries and are not recommended by battery manufacturers for this type of battery. If the programing can be altered it is highly recommended to delete this stage to avoid damage.
Alan
Battery life depends on so many factors the it is nigh on impossible to predict. Without intimate knowledge of how the battery is charged/discharged and stored among other things makes for this difficulty. There is so much misinformation on forums that only by seeking facts from manufacturers not marketers that correct info can be obtained on how to treat your batteries.
Alan
Read all the posts on thread and there are just a bunch of good ideas.
Reed and Elaine
Some so called smart chargers are battery killers, especially if you have loads running from batteries whilst connected to said chargers. One of my previous vans had two 120 A/H new batteries that died in about 18 months ! due to the stupid charger going into boost charge every time the compressor fridge came on.
It could not "sense" the battery was fully charged but only under slight load, and continued to boil away the batteries till eventually they gave up.
I replaced the charger with a top quality Ctek 25 A and no more problems, as the Ctek could sense that even though the batteries were supplying a small load they were ok and fine on float.
Another thing with some of these cheap so called smart chargers is they have an AC voltage ripple on the DC output side (not enough smoothing circuits in the design) another battery killer.
My current van has no connection to the vehicle at all, runs a Ctek 25A for shore charge/power and has a quality Morningstar 45A solar controller fed from 560W solar, I run 2 fridges, Waeco rpd 175 2 door, and an Engel 40ltr, both compressor types.
My two 120A AGM's are over 2 1/2 years old full time use, and are still as good as new ! never ran short of power when off road camping and hardly ever comes off float charge when in parks.
As has been stated by many above, the greatest factor in how well your battery will survive is how you treat it, and there is no doubt that good equipment matched to your battery type is the best way to achieve a good treatment regime for a battery, or set of batteries.
Another consideration is the battery type, and to some extent battery quality. The life of a battery is quoted by the manufacturer as a number of cycles, and currently this ranges from the old flooded lead acid at 300 to 500 cycles, all the way through to the newer LifePo4 (Lithium) batteries with some quoting up to 7,000 cycles.
As someone said earlier all batteries are not the same.
One Factor..
which A lot of people don't understand.. You need enough Solar or other charging ability to recharge the Batteries..
- Best thing if you are going for Solar charging is to have Plenty of solar when compared Battery..
For OLD school batteries.. LA's AGM's Calcium or Gel Batteries
My rule of thumb is to go at minimum 200w per 100Ah of Battery.. for a Light Load..
For a Medium or Heavier Load I would double up on the Solar..
The Thing that Kills the Batteries is NOT recharging them ASAP..
With regard to Battery Life that is dependent on how they are used.. The heavier the use[up to 50% of charge the Shorter the Life of the batteries..]
Most Lead acid have a Life @ 50% State of Charge of 400-800 cycles..[ From cheapest to Expensive..[Lifeline]
Juergen
Hi Steeve.
I don't know what you are after exactly, but Here is some of my personal experience:
I bought a 100 Amh (Amper-Hours) deep cycle Flooded Acid type battery at the, Supercheap Cars, for 220 AUD, some 3 years ago. It served me working without any serious problem till about May this year, and after even 48 hour time recharge on smallest amperage, with my battery charger with battery renewal thing inbuilt, she stopped holding a charge for anything more than few minutes, and Inverted screamed like crazy when I tried to use it. And it was only a small 300W inverter and just laptop use. I used that battery very intensively during all that time, though. The warranty on it was only 6 months, so it isn't really something superb, but still she lasted me for some 2.5 years of intensive use, and before that, for some 6 month of occasional use.
What happened is that, in May this year she has gone totally bad. Fellow from NRMA here in Lightning Ridge, checked this battery out, and sadly told me: look mate, your battery is a goner. I can't do nothing. You must buy another one.
I recalled then about the movie I saw on You Tube some time ago, and I went there to check what I can do.
In the result, I abstained from blowing out my money (something between 220 to some 380 or even over 400 AUD) for new battery and bought instead a packet of Epsom Salts. I got an old pot and dissolved Epsom Salts in the distillate water, that I bought long time ago for batteries, preparing a Saturated Solution. This means, you keep steering the mixture, adding the salts slowly to the water till you will see that it doesn't dissolve any more, and some of the Epsom Salt stays on the bottom. Than take a Table Spoon of that mixture (at that stage it out to be about as thick as a syrup) and poor it into each cell of your battery, and recharge it on a slow charge. Nothing else...
It may not catch immediately full power, but after second and third recharge it is already strong as new, and afer a third recharge, with normal high amperage from a car, in my case, it became actually better than it ever was, even when it was new... So I got no more problem, and serious money saved.
I recommend this highly. I tried it I use it and I'm happy with it even more than with two new batteries I bought earlier to my caravan. The repaired battery I talk here about, is of my dual battery system's house battery in my towing vehicle.
Thanks Alan, I wasn't aware of that, I was wondering why my charger has a different settings for different types of batteries. Now I know.
Hi Steeve.
I don't know what you are after exactly, but Here is some of my personal experience:
I bought a 100 Amh (Amper-Hours) deep cycle Flooded Acid type battery at the, Supercheap Cars, for 220 AUD, some 3 years ago. It served me working without any serious problem till about May this year, and after even 48 hour time recharge on smallest amperage, with my battery charger with battery renewal thing inbuilt, she stopped holding a charge for anything more than few minutes, and Inverted screamed like crazy when I tried to use it. And it was only a small 300W inverter and just laptop use. I used that battery very intensively during all that time, though. The warranty on it was only 6 months, so it isn't really something superb, but still she lasted me for some 2.5 years of intensive use, and before that, for some 6 month of occasional use.
What happened is that, in May this year she has gone totally bad. Fellow from NRMA here in Lightning Ridge, checked this battery out, and sadly told me: look mate, your battery is a goner. I can't do nothing. You must buy another one.
I recalled then about the movie I saw on You Tube some time ago, and I went there to check what I can do.
In the result, I abstained from blowing out my money (something between 220 to some 380 or even over 400 AUD) for new battery and bought instead a packet of Epsom Salts. I got an old pot and dissolved Epsom Salts in the distillate water, that I bought long time ago for batteries, preparing a Saturated Solution. This means, you keep steering the mixture, adding the salts slowly to the water till you will see that it doesn't dissolve any more, and some of the Epsom Salt stays on the bottom. Than take a Table Spoon of that mixture (at that stage it out to be about as thick as a syrup) and poor it into each cell of your battery, and recharge it on a slow charge. Nothing else...
It may not catch immediately full power, but after second and third recharge it is already strong as new, and afer a third recharge, with normal high amperage from a car, in my case, it became actually better than it ever was, even when it was new... So I got no more problem, and serious money saved.
I recommend this highly. I tried it I use it and I'm happy with it even more than with two new batteries I bought earlier to my caravan. The repaired battery I talk here about, is of my dual battery system's house battery in my towing vehicle.
I just love successful stories like that. I don't have too many of my own, but some...
Aussie Paul.
We have 4 100 ah wet cell AGM's. Replaced one after 3 years (a dud) the other 3 are 8 years old and still going. Don't take em below 50%.
The 2-1 ratio is a good starting point, and beyond 200 amps you can throw the charger away.
I count my amps like I count my beers and the newer Morningstar controllers tell you pretty much all you need in that regard.
Batteries are like everything else these days,, you can do all the research you need to do--
and still buy a lemon ;)