Putting the flash in flash memory Flash memory chips are called flash because in order to write to it, the memory is loaded, and then a signal is sent to the memory circuitry that says remember this kind of like the flash on a camera. (In all honesty, I dont know if modern flash memory uses this exact technique, but it remains a fairly accurate metaphor for the process.) Once the memory has been flashed, power can be completely removed, and the memory will retain whatever was written to it. The problem is that memory can be flashed in this manner only so many times. Im finding numbers between 10,000 and 100,000 times though as with anything, Im sure that is increasing over time as well. Regardless, there is a limit. When that limit is approached, some portion of the memory may not properly remember what was written to it, resulting in corruption. It may only take a single bit of information to be wrong, or to wear out, for the entire contents of a flash memory chip to be lost. Some flash memory chips, perhaps even most, now also include circuitry to avoid bad bits. That means if a portion of the flash memory finally wears out and goes bad, the chip itself can compensate, and it will look to the user like everything is fine. Another approach is called wear leveling. This spreads the use of flash memory across the entire device, even if youre only writing to the same spot in the same file every single time. But these techniques only last so long and only postpone the inevitable. Now, in your case, youre using USB thumbdrive in perhaps the worst possible way for longevity. Database applications in particular are notorious for writing to the disk a lot as tables, fields, indexes and the like are updated. Even if you dont write to your database, the files may be updated with things like last access information and other administrivia. As a result, the USB drive is still being written to. A lot. With all that writing going on, reaching the failure point of some random bit or bits in the flash memory stick doesnt seem that far fetched. Remember, in the unluckiest case, it might only take one worn-out bit of information to render the entire contents unreadable. Using inexpensive flash memory USB Memory Stick USB Memory Stick The best use of USB thumb drives and other flash memory-based devices is simply copy-to and copy-from. By that I mean copy the information to the thumbdrive to store it, copy it from the thumbdrive to a local hard disk to use it, and then copy it back to the thumb drive to store it. Never run disk-intensive applications directly against files stored on the thumb drive. If you copy to and from even ten times daily, youre looking at three years of usage for the low end of the flash memory lifespan. (Yes, I know thats not exact. In fact, its way more complex than that; factoring in things like the type of file system, FAT or NTFS, the efficiency of the device driver, and even the circuitry on the specific flash memory device but its a good order of magnitude.) You may also note that your application speeds up when you copy your database to the hard disk for use. While reading flash memory is typically quite fast, writing is not. And finally, if you really need external storage, a thumbdrive may simply be the wrong solution to your problem. There are plenty of external hard drives that could do the same job without the write limitations. Or perhaps a networked solution is the way to go. Back up Knowing that inexpensive flash memory-based devices will wear out eventually, theres one other thing you need to make sure to do, and thats to back up. If you keep your only copy of important data on a flash drive you are asking for trouble. It will wear out eventually, and your data will become completely unrecoverable. Remember the golden rule of backing up: If theres only one copy, its not backed up.
jules47 said
09:20 AM Jul 1, 2014
Thanks for that info - found it very interesting - I didn't know that flash drives have a life/usage limit.
KeenTravellers said
10:07 AM Jul 1, 2014
Thanks for the info - however you may find this interesting
USB flash drives contains a sturdy circuit board without any movable mechanisms. A silicone chip, attached inside the flash drive is nonvolatile memory. Nonvolatile memory does not require a power source to function and to hold stored data. Thus, a USB flash drive keeps data indefinitely, up to 10 years, without any loss of information. Since a plastic casing surrounds the circuit board, dropping, throwing or washing may damage the USB flash drive.
The write and erase function on a USB flash drive is the main life expectancy source. The speed is handled by the USB rated port - USB-3 being the fastest. Flash drives are capable of handling 10 thousand to 10 million write /erase operations during their lifetime, depending on the quality of the product & the source as well. Cheaper usb's obviously a lot less. Regardless, a flash drive, typically will outlast any standard hard drive. Flash Drives connection should be precise and quick. Many disconnect these slowly as removed shorting its connection. They should be always stopped, then "safe to remove" - removed in one action. The main concerns about the life expectancy of a flash drive are over filling which will cause instant damage or damage from neglect and becoming lost or stolen or dropped.
This is came from one of the disk suppliers site.
Cheers KT
-- Edited by KeenTravellers on Tuesday 1st of July 2014 10:10:54 AM
-- Edited by KeenTravellers on Tuesday 1st of July 2014 10:11:25 AM
Santa said
11:03 AM Jul 1, 2014
I know nothing about the technical aspect of flash drives, however before we retired the company we worked for supplied us with a number of flash/USB drives, 8 years on they are still going strong, yes, they have been used regularly.
As a matter of interest dING, thats quite a block of text to digest without a paragraph break, very difficult to read.
dING said
11:12 AM Jul 1, 2014
I agree about the read difficulty
But it was all para-graphed ect
When I plagiarized the article but
This thread decided it did not like
That format and changed it to its
Currant state for some unknown
Reason and I was to lazy to fix it
rockylizard said
12:19 PM Jul 1, 2014
Gday...
Sorry if this is telling anyone how to suck eggs ....... but ALL media used for saving/transferring data has always had a limited life.
I learnt back in the early 1990s that digital media was very much like a light globe - it may fail the first time it is used ... or last for ages.
I recall in one of my other lives purchasing boxes of 5inch floppies - often one of those floppies would not even work the first time - and one would fail after the first use.
I worked in a publishing firm and it was our practice to save EVERY item to THREE floppies each time to ensure we would have it for later use. We used to then delete all data when the publication was "put to bed" and then re-use them.
When we went to a network we used to back the servers up every night to two sources and then keep one of those sources off-site for safety.
I still do similar today - HDD has first copy, back-up each alteration to two USB sticks and then do a major back-up each week to an external HDD. My son is also trying to get me to also back-up to 'the cloud' for further protection - but I am too lazy
Cheers - John
aussie_paul said
12:58 PM Jul 1, 2014
dING wrote:
I agree about the read difficulty
But it was all para-graphed ect
When I plagiarized the article but
This thread decided it did not like
That format and changed it to its
Currant state for some unknown
Reason and I was to lazy to fix it
Sounds like me these days!!!!!
Aussie Paul.
PeterD said
02:20 PM Jul 1, 2014
Santa wrote:As a matter of interest dING, thats quite a block of text to digest without a paragraph break, very difficult to read.
Yes I had to copy it to an OpenOffice page, correct the spelling mistakes and reformat it before I got much out of it. Then I read KT's reply and got more out of it. If you are going to assist others why not go the extra mile and reform it? It does not take all that much extra effort.
It's also bad taste to plagiarise. You should give an attribution to the originator if you copy something you copy. Better still if you find something interesting you would like to share then type a simple paragraph to say why you think it is of interest to yourself and possibly others and then post a link to it.
After that out burst, thanks for raising the subject. It's good to get reminders of the limitations of our equipment.
PeterD said
03:50 PM Jul 1, 2014
rockylizard wrote:I recall in one of my other lives purchasing boxes of 5inch floppies - often one of those floppies would not even work the first time - and one would fail after the first use.
I remember them well. My early days I was just purchasing equipment for others and not operating it (only the engineers did that.)
Later on we used them for radio frequency assigning. Suddenly we were experiencing that the disks could be accessed after downloading some files. We then found that the early DOS variants did not rearrange the file allocation table (FAT) when you erased files. When you saved new files the FAT simply added the new files to the end of the directory. When the FAT filled the disk would lock up and become unusable. We had to do a complete reformat of the disk periodically to stop this happening. Later DOS variants overcame this by removing the deleted directory entries completely where necessary.
We always have had problems with overuse of out file storage systems.
What an interesting thread, thanks for the posts. I got hold of a 64Gig USB3 flash drive from Kogan during one of his specials. Loaded a huge amount of music (MP3) files and plug the drive into the fusion unit in our caravan. I can only say it works a treat, yes the music has the "digital" lack of harmonics but is acceptable to my old ears.
I backup my photos, videos word diary, and other stuff on a western digital 1TB 2.5 inch mini drive (JB hi fi about $100). No dramas at all.
Again thanks for a fascinating thread.
Travel safe
Murraman said
07:53 PM Jul 4, 2014
After losing all data in a HD crash early 90's I always maintain 3 backups of important stuff. I setup a computer for a lady after she lost all data for hubby's business. I installed 2 physical drives into the computer. Wrote a batch file that all she had to do was click on and it would backup for her.
Well 6 months later back she comes and tells me computer doesn't work, First question I ask is when was the last time you backed it up, Answer when it left you six months ago. Some people never learn as the main HD had failed again, and yes she lost the lot again.
One thing to remember with a laptop or desktop for that matter may appear to have two hard drives say c drive and e drive, but in reality it only has one physical drive split into sections. So a failure on the drive will render loss of data on the c and e partition.
Putting the flash in flash memory Flash memory chips are called flash because in order to write to it, the memory is loaded, and then a signal is sent to the memory circuitry that says remember this kind of like the flash on a camera. (In all honesty, I dont know if modern flash memory uses this exact technique, but it remains a fairly accurate metaphor for the process.) Once the memory has been flashed, power can be completely removed, and the memory will retain whatever was written to it. The problem is that memory can be flashed in this manner only so many times. Im finding numbers between 10,000 and 100,000 times though as with anything, Im sure that is increasing over time as well. Regardless, there is a limit. When that limit is approached, some portion of the memory may not properly remember what was written to it, resulting in corruption. It may only take a single bit of information to be wrong, or to wear out, for the entire contents of a flash memory chip to be lost. Some flash memory chips, perhaps even most, now also include circuitry to avoid bad bits. That means if a portion of the flash memory finally wears out and goes bad, the chip itself can compensate, and it will look to the user like everything is fine. Another approach is called wear leveling. This spreads the use of flash memory across the entire device, even if youre only writing to the same spot in the same file every single time. But these techniques only last so long and only postpone the inevitable. Now, in your case, youre using USB thumbdrive in perhaps the worst possible way for longevity. Database applications in particular are notorious for writing to the disk a lot as tables, fields, indexes and the like are updated. Even if you dont write to your database, the files may be updated with things like last access information and other administrivia. As a result, the USB drive is still being written to. A lot. With all that writing going on, reaching the failure point of some random bit or bits in the flash memory stick doesnt seem that far fetched. Remember, in the unluckiest case, it might only take one worn-out bit of information to render the entire contents unreadable. Using inexpensive flash memory USB Memory Stick USB Memory Stick The best use of USB thumb drives and other flash memory-based devices is simply copy-to and copy-from. By that I mean copy the information to the thumbdrive to store it, copy it from the thumbdrive to a local hard disk to use it, and then copy it back to the thumb drive to store it. Never run disk-intensive applications directly against files stored on the thumb drive. If you copy to and from even ten times daily, youre looking at three years of usage for the low end of the flash memory lifespan. (Yes, I know thats not exact. In fact, its way more complex than that; factoring in things like the type of file system, FAT or NTFS, the efficiency of the device driver, and even the circuitry on the specific flash memory device but its a good order of magnitude.) You may also note that your application speeds up when you copy your database to the hard disk for use. While reading flash memory is typically quite fast, writing is not. And finally, if you really need external storage, a thumbdrive may simply be the wrong solution to your problem. There are plenty of external hard drives that could do the same job without the write limitations. Or perhaps a networked solution is the way to go. Back up Knowing that inexpensive flash memory-based devices will wear out eventually, theres one other thing you need to make sure to do, and thats to back up. If you keep your only copy of important data on a flash drive you are asking for trouble. It will wear out eventually, and your data will become completely unrecoverable. Remember the golden rule of backing up: If theres only one copy, its not backed up.
Thanks for the info - however you may find this interesting
USB flash drives contains a sturdy circuit board without any movable mechanisms. A silicone chip, attached inside the flash drive is nonvolatile memory. Nonvolatile memory does not require a power source to function and to hold stored data. Thus, a USB flash drive keeps data indefinitely, up to 10 years, without any loss of information. Since a plastic casing surrounds the circuit board, dropping, throwing or washing may damage the USB flash drive.
The write and erase function on a USB flash drive is the main life expectancy source. The speed is handled by the USB rated port - USB-3 being the fastest. Flash drives are capable of handling 10 thousand to 10 million write /erase operations during their lifetime, depending on the quality of the product & the source as well. Cheaper usb's obviously a lot less. Regardless, a flash drive, typically will outlast any
standard hard drive. Flash Drives connection should be precise and quick. Many disconnect these slowly as removed shorting its connection. They should be always stopped, then "safe to remove" - removed in one action. The main concerns about the life expectancy of a flash drive are over filling which will cause instant damage or damage from neglect and becoming lost or stolen or dropped.
This is came from one of the disk suppliers site.
Cheers
KT
-- Edited by KeenTravellers on Tuesday 1st of July 2014 10:10:54 AM
-- Edited by KeenTravellers on Tuesday 1st of July 2014 10:11:25 AM
I know nothing about the technical aspect of flash drives, however before we retired the company we worked for supplied us with a number of flash/USB drives, 8 years on they are still going strong, yes, they have been used regularly.
As a matter of interest dING, thats quite a block of text to digest without a paragraph break, very difficult to read.
I agree about the read difficulty
But it was all para-graphed ect
When I plagiarized the article but
This thread decided it did not like
That format and changed it to its
Currant state for some unknown
Reason and I was to lazy to fix it
Gday...
Sorry if this is telling anyone how to suck eggs ....... but ALL media used for saving/transferring data has always had a limited life.
I learnt back in the early 1990s that digital media was very much like a light globe - it may fail the first time it is used ... or last for ages.
I recall in one of my other lives purchasing boxes of 5inch floppies - often one of those floppies would not even work the first time - and one would fail after the first use.
I worked in a publishing firm and it was our practice to save EVERY item to THREE floppies each time to ensure we would have it for later use. We used to then delete all data when the publication was "put to bed" and then re-use them.
When we went to a network we used to back the servers up every night to two sources and then keep one of those sources off-site for safety.
I still do similar today - HDD has first copy, back-up each alteration to two USB sticks and then do a major back-up each week to an external HDD. My son is also trying to get me to also back-up to 'the cloud' for further protection - but I am too lazy
Cheers - John
Sounds like me these days!!!!!
Aussie Paul.
Yes I had to copy it to an OpenOffice page, correct the spelling mistakes and reformat it before I got much out of it. Then I read KT's reply and got more out of it. If you are going to assist others why not go the extra mile and reform it? It does not take all that much extra effort.
It's also bad taste to plagiarise. You should give an attribution to the originator if you copy something you copy. Better still if you find something interesting you would like to share then type a simple paragraph to say why you think it is of interest to yourself and possibly others and then post a link to it.
Is this where you got it from - http://askleo.com/can_a_usb_thumbdrive_wear_out/
After that out burst, thanks for raising the subject. It's good to get reminders of the limitations of our equipment.
I remember them well. My early days I was just purchasing equipment for others and not operating it (only the engineers did that.)
Later on we used them for radio frequency assigning. Suddenly we were experiencing that the disks could be accessed after downloading some files. We then found that the early DOS variants did not rearrange the file allocation table (FAT) when you erased files. When you saved new files the FAT simply added the new files to the end of the directory. When the FAT filled the disk would lock up and become unusable. We had to do a complete reformat of the disk periodically to stop this happening. Later DOS variants overcame this by removing the deleted directory entries completely where necessary.
We always have had problems with overuse of out file storage systems.
For those wishing to read the history of the early disk storage systems or reminisce, see this page - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_floppy_disk
-- Edited by PeterD on Wednesday 2nd of July 2014 08:35:39 AM
Made click-able for PeterD.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_floppy_disk
Cheers,
Sheba.
What an interesting thread, thanks for the posts. I got hold of a 64Gig USB3 flash drive from Kogan during one of his specials. Loaded a huge amount of music (MP3) files and plug the drive into the fusion unit in our caravan. I can only say it works a treat, yes the music has the "digital" lack of harmonics but is acceptable to my old ears.
I backup my photos, videos word diary, and other stuff on a western digital 1TB 2.5 inch mini drive (JB hi fi about $100). No dramas at all.
Again thanks for a fascinating thread.
Travel safe
Well 6 months later back she comes and tells me computer doesn't work, First question I ask is when was the last time you backed it up, Answer when it left you six months ago. Some people never learn as the main HD had failed again, and yes she lost the lot again.
One thing to remember with a laptop or desktop for that matter may appear to have two hard drives say c drive and e drive, but in reality it only has one physical drive split into sections. So a failure on the drive will render loss of data on the c and e partition.
This is why you need two physical drives.