Sad Tragic Crash Between a Caravan and Truck - 2003
Vic41 said
06:05 PM May 25, 2014
This public report of a crash between a caravan and a truck is a very sad and tragic story, it is a shame that the other driver did not survive to give his version of events, not suggesting that the findings would have been different though.
A good reason why we need to be extra careful on the road we share with trucks, see;
Its a little difficult to comment without exposing the site to some sort of penalty from other interested parties. I think it highlights the lack of regulation within the industry as a whole and the disastrous consequences of that on consumers. I can't imagine such a relaxed attitude being taken if the fault had been attributed to the design of the towing vehicle but until there are externally enforceable engineering design standards such as the ADRs and qualifications required to operate a caravan construction business this sort of accident is bound to happen again.
Vic41 said
08:38 PM May 25, 2014
Thanks for your considered reply and restraint D & D, I was reminded of this public report during my recent trip when I nearly ended up another statistic, although a truck was involved, the circumstances were not the same though, but similar in other ways but it could have ended differently.
Although the report is no longer sub judice, out of respect and sympathy for all parties involved and their families comments should be considered before posting like you have done in your reply.
I posted this in good faith as after this and my own recent experience as I think all of us RV users need to be super aware and alert when sharing the road with trucks.
-- Edited by Vic41 on Sunday 25th of May 2014 08:47:31 PM
Cupie said
10:33 PM May 25, 2014
I first came across this very sad matter in 2007 & have a copy on my 'puter that I read from time to time. May even have got it from this forum.
A terrible event & no doubt very perplexing for the Coroner. It is hard to disagree with his findings given the summary of evidence that appears in the document.
When I first got interested in caravanning around 1999, I would eagerly read Tom Oltoff's regular column in the Caravan World magazine. I haven't heard of him for several years, but then I don't buy caravanning mags these days.
It certainly makes me very conscious of the importance of a correctly set up rig & I am almost paranoid about keeping a lookout in my mirrors for overtaking vehicles. I find also that I get a gentle reminder of overtaking trucks by a slight sucking sensation as they get up close. Makes me even more alert.
SnowT said
01:08 PM May 26, 2014
On a side note..
Some things which I have observed while driving..
Due to the fact that when I'm on the road with my Coaster Bus, as I try to keep my speed down due to trying to run more efficient. I have noticed that while I'm driving at 80-85km/h I do have a tendency to slow down the vehicles behind me especially in single lane road ways..
the Western highway being one of them..
I personally do a few thing's..
- if the road is clear in front of me..
>> Pull over to the Left of the Lane and wave the vehicle Past me..
--> Slowing down while they pass me..
That is fine for most truck driver's But I will say this there are some Real Cowboy's out there want to see How Close they can get to you..
- I had One such Truck nearly force me off the road.. That would be the main reason Why I plan to have several different type of recording devices fitted and operational While I'm on the road..
So yes one of my main issue is that you need to be wary while on the road.. it can be very dangerous out there..
Be safe and enjoy the Road.
Juergen
rockylizard said
02:06 PM May 26, 2014
SnowT wrote:
On a side note..
Some things which I have observed while driving..
Due to the fact that when I'm on the road with my Coaster Bus, as I try to keep my speed down due to trying to run more efficient. I have noticed that while I'm driving at 80-85km/h I do have a tendency to slow down the vehicles behind me especially in single lane road ways.. the Western highway being one of them..
I personally do a few thing's.. - if the road is clear in front of me.. >> Pull over to the Left of the Lane and wave the vehicle Past me.. --> Slowing down while they pass me..
That is fine for most truck driver's But I will say this there are some Real Cowboy's out there want to see How Close they can get to you.. - I had One such Truck nearly force me off the road.. That would be the main reason Why I plan to have several different type of recording devices fitted and operational While I'm on the road..
So yes one of my main issue is that you need to be wary while on the road.. it can be very dangerous out there..
Be safe and enjoy the Road.
Juergen
Gday...
A good point there SnowT - being aware of other road users (whoever they may be) and being prepared to share the road with other road users (whoever they may be).
But, rather than put an ambulance at the bottom of the cliff to catch people after they have fallen, it is always wiser to take action to ensure no-one falls off the cliff.
For that reason, I do believe this is much more proactive and safer for all road-users -
as soon as you see a truck in ya mirrors, get on the UHF then, before he rubs the paint off ya bumper, let him know you have seen him and that you will either slow at a safe place to let him pass, or you will pull over at a safe place when one presents itself. A two-way conversation with the driver usually provides a mutually agreeable and safe solution.
I think that rather than "different types of recording devices" to record the incident that caused the crash, taking proactive action to alleviate/reduce/remove the potential danger is a much better course of action.
Cheers - John
Vic41 said
02:23 PM May 26, 2014
rockylizard wrote:
Gday...
A good point there SnowT - being aware of other road users (whoever they may be) and being prepared to share the road with other road users (whoever they may be).
But, rather than put an ambulance at the bottom of the cliff to catch people after they have fallen, it is always wiser to take action to ensure no-one falls off the cliff.
For that reason, I do believe this is much more proactive and safer for all road-users -
as soon as you see a truck in ya mirrors, get on the UHF then, before he rubs the paint off ya bumper, let him know you have seen him and that you will either slow at a safe place to let him pass, or you will pull over at a safe place when one presents itself. A two-way conversation with the driver usually provides a mutually agreeable and safe solution.
I think that rather than "different types of recording devices" to record the incident that caused the crash, taking proactive action to alleviate/reduce/remove the potential danger is a much better course of action.
Cheers - John
Good point John, but with some of these Cowboys it wouldn't make much difference. In my recent encounter with a truck I saw him some distance back, but as I was doing the same speed as his legal limit (100kms) did not think he would close the gap, so I was surprised when I looked in the rear view mirror and found him right behind me, that close that I could not see part of the front of his vehicle, I can only surmise he was speeding and was trying bullying tactics to make me go faster.
At that stage it was too dangerous to take my hands off the steering wheel to use my two way, I chose the option of maintaining my speed, indicating with my left blinker that I was pulling over and looking for a suitable spot. There was no traffic coming from the opposite direction. Their was nowhere to go except get onto the gravel verge as far as I could without hitting the guide posts and wait for him to overtake then slow down to let him pass once he was level with me. How he missed the back of my vehicle I don't know, I was too busy keep my vehicle under control bearing in mind I was half on a gravel verge.
Snow T's camera would have been hand in that case to get this clowns registration number, I was too busy taking evasive action to and pulling safely back onto the road to get it when he had passed. By that time he was long gone.
rockylizard said
02:58 PM May 26, 2014
Gday...
I apologise if this sounds 'holier than thou'
However, I talk to EVERY truck as soon as they are within 500-600metres of my rig. I let them know I have them "in my mirrors" and that I will let them know if it looks "clear ahead". I always tell them to "come around when ya ready". Should there be two trucks travelling close together, I always say "I can see ya mate behind ya as well".
There are times when I can see the road ahead is clear and safe for some time and will even tell the truckie to "keep it wound up and come around when ya ready".
If the road is very narrow, I also talk to oncoming truckies so they know I am aware and alert to them and to let them know of my actions before they get near me.
I have not had a single truckie in five consecutive years of towing full-time who has not responded and been glad I have given them a "heads up".
Again, almost EVERY truckie has been glad to have a two-way conversation coming upto and beyond my van. It is quite common for truckies to say "wish every van was as thoughtful".
I again apologise for sounding 'holier than thou' and 'full of meself' ... it is just that apart from truckies being "at work" ... I really do value my life, my rig and my peace of mind.
Cheers - John
Vic41 said
03:41 PM May 26, 2014
No need to apologise John, and glad it works for you.
In 30 years of towing (some before that too) I have never had an incident either. I do usually contact the truck by two way (hand held) if I see them in time and so something similar, but bear in mind some people do not have two ways. If a person is travelling legally on the highway then while it may be a good idea to contact the following vehicle, it is the following vehicles responsibility to overtake them whether they have been contacted by two way or not. I agree it is nice to help them know when you can help them do so though.
I saw this bloke some ways back and if he had been doing the speed limit there is no way he would have caught up to me, and his bullying tactics in trying to get me to speed up over his legal speed limit when he did shows what a clown he was.
You are lucky you have had such cooperative truck drivers, I have had some who do not bother responding at all (on Channel 40).
I just hope you don't have an experience with a driver like the one I had.
Edit update: Although I didn't get the number of the vehicle, I did manage to get the name of a company on the side vinyl of the truck and reported it to them today and they are looking into it and gave their apologies and assured me they do not condone that type of driving and will speak to the driver (a young bloke apparently) about it. They were most concerned.
-- Edited by Vic41 on Monday 26th of May 2014 07:42:34 PM
Jayco Gypsy said
10:37 PM May 27, 2014
Glad to hear you made it though your encounter Vic. Hopefully this company will do something about the driver with regards to an attitude adjustment on how to share the road.
Vic41 said
10:30 AM May 28, 2014
Thanks Cathy, I hope the do to, at least it will let him know his type of driving is unacceptable.
This public report of a crash between a caravan and a truck is a very sad and tragic story, it is a shame that the other driver did not survive to give his version of events, not suggesting that the findings would have been different though.
A good reason why we need to be extra careful on the road we share with trucks, see;
http://www.courts.sa.gov.au/CoronersFindings/Lists/Coroners%20Findings/Attachments/330/JONG%20Petrus%20and%20JONG%20Helena%20and%20JONG%20Miranda.pdf
Thanks for your considered reply and restraint D & D, I was reminded of this public report during my recent trip when I nearly ended up another statistic, although a truck was involved, the circumstances were not the same though, but similar in other ways but it could have ended differently.
Although the report is no longer sub judice, out of respect and sympathy for all parties involved and their families comments should be considered before posting like you have done in your reply.
I posted this in good faith as after this and my own recent experience as I think all of us RV users need to be super aware and alert when sharing the road with trucks.
-- Edited by Vic41 on Sunday 25th of May 2014 08:47:31 PM
I first came across this very sad matter in 2007 & have a copy on my 'puter that I read from time to time. May even have got it from this forum.
A terrible event & no doubt very perplexing for the Coroner. It is hard to disagree with his findings given the summary of evidence that appears in the document.
When I first got interested in caravanning around 1999, I would eagerly read Tom Oltoff's regular column in the Caravan World magazine. I haven't heard of him for several years, but then I don't buy caravanning mags these days.
It certainly makes me very conscious of the importance of a correctly set up rig & I am almost paranoid about keeping a lookout in my mirrors for overtaking vehicles. I find also that I get a gentle reminder of overtaking trucks by a slight sucking sensation as they get up close. Makes me even more alert.
Some things which I have observed while driving..
Due to the fact that when I'm on the road with my Coaster Bus, as I try to keep my speed down due to trying to run more efficient. I have noticed that while I'm driving at 80-85km/h I do have a tendency to slow down the vehicles behind me especially in single lane road ways..
the Western highway being one of them..
I personally do a few thing's..
- if the road is clear in front of me..
>> Pull over to the Left of the Lane and wave the vehicle Past me..
--> Slowing down while they pass me..
That is fine for most truck driver's But I will say this there are some Real Cowboy's out there want to see How Close they can get to you..
- I had One such Truck nearly force me off the road.. That would be the main reason Why I plan to have several different type of recording devices fitted and operational While I'm on the road..
So yes one of my main issue is that you need to be wary while on the road.. it can be very dangerous out there..
Be safe and enjoy the Road.
Juergen
Gday...
A good point there SnowT - being aware of other road users (whoever they may be) and being prepared to share the road with other road users (whoever they may be).
But, rather than put an ambulance at the bottom of the cliff to catch people after they have fallen, it is always wiser to take action to ensure no-one falls off the cliff.
For that reason, I do believe this is much more proactive and safer for all road-users -
as soon as you see a truck in ya mirrors, get on the UHF then, before he rubs the paint off ya bumper, let him know you have seen him and that you will either slow at a safe place to let him pass, or you will pull over at a safe place when one presents itself. A two-way conversation with the driver usually provides a mutually agreeable and safe solution.
I think that rather than "different types of recording devices" to record the incident that caused the crash, taking proactive action to alleviate/reduce/remove the potential danger is a much better course of action.
Cheers - John
Gday...
Good point John, but with some of these Cowboys it wouldn't make much difference. In my recent encounter with a truck I saw him some distance back, but as I was doing the same speed as his legal limit (100kms) did not think he would close the gap, so I was surprised when I looked in the rear view mirror and found him right behind me, that close that I could not see part of the front of his vehicle, I can only surmise he was speeding and was trying bullying tactics to make me go faster.
At that stage it was too dangerous to take my hands off the steering wheel to use my two way, I chose the option of maintaining my speed, indicating with my left blinker that I was pulling over and looking for a suitable spot. There was no traffic coming from the opposite direction. Their was nowhere to go except get onto the gravel verge as far as I could without hitting the guide posts and wait for him to overtake then slow down to let him pass once he was level with me. How he missed the back of my vehicle I don't know, I was too busy keep my vehicle under control bearing in mind I was half on a gravel verge.
Snow T's camera would have been hand in that case to get this clowns registration number, I was too busy taking evasive action to and pulling safely back onto the road to get it when he had passed. By that time he was long gone.
Gday...
I apologise if this sounds 'holier than thou'
However, I talk to EVERY truck as soon as they are within 500-600metres of my rig. I let them know I have them "in my mirrors" and that I will let them know if it looks "clear ahead". I always tell them to "come around when ya ready". Should there be two trucks travelling close together, I always say "I can see ya mate behind ya as well".
There are times when I can see the road ahead is clear and safe for some time and will even tell the truckie to "keep it wound up and come around when ya ready".
If the road is very narrow, I also talk to oncoming truckies so they know I am aware and alert to them and to let them know of my actions before they get near me.
I have not had a single truckie in five consecutive years of towing full-time who has not responded and been glad I have given them a "heads up".
Again, almost EVERY truckie has been glad to have a two-way conversation coming upto and beyond my van. It is quite common for truckies to say "wish every van was as thoughtful".
I again apologise for sounding 'holier than thou' and 'full of meself' ... it is just that apart from truckies being "at work" ... I really do value my life, my rig and my peace of mind.
Cheers - John
No need to apologise John, and glad it works for you.
In 30 years of towing (some before that too) I have never had an incident either. I do usually contact the truck by two way (hand held) if I see them in time and so something similar, but bear in mind some people do not have two ways. If a person is travelling legally on the highway then while it may be a good idea to contact the following vehicle, it is the following vehicles responsibility to overtake them whether they have been contacted by two way or not. I agree it is nice to help them know when you can help them do so though.
I saw this bloke some ways back and if he had been doing the speed limit there is no way he would have caught up to me, and his bullying tactics in trying to get me to speed up over his legal speed limit when he did shows what a clown he was.
You are lucky you have had such cooperative truck drivers, I have had some who do not bother responding at all (on Channel 40).
I just hope you don't have an experience with a driver like the one I had.
Edit update: Although I didn't get the number of the vehicle, I did manage to get the name of a company on the side vinyl of the truck and reported it to them today and they are looking into it and gave their apologies and assured me they do not condone that type of driving and will speak to the driver (a young bloke apparently) about it. They were most concerned.
-- Edited by Vic41 on Monday 26th of May 2014 07:42:34 PM
Thanks Cathy, I hope the do to, at least it will let him know his type of driving is unacceptable.