If I were to connect a 12V DC to 240V AC inverter to the van battery and plug the outgoing 240V ac into the vans AC input plug so that I could use the van's GPO's to run low wattage appliances such as phone and laptop chargers, am I creating a safety hazard. I realise the total wattage that can be used is subject to the output of the inverter. My question basically is if the built-in safety systems such as RCD's will still operate. I understand that the rated AC circuit breakers will not trip. Techies, am I on death row if I contemplate this?
Regards Robert
oldtrack123 said
09:59 PM Feb 18, 2014
Hi
The quick simple answer is NO, the van RCD is not functional
You will have more than ONE Class1 Device connected
The SAFETY RECOMMENDATION with such Inverters & generators is to only have ONE Class1[have 3pin plug] device connected at any time
The van itself, when you plug it into the inverter is THAT ONE class1 device!!!then you will with out doubt have other class 1 device connected such as fridge, charger, ---------
You can run more than one Class2 [2pin plugs] with a high level of safety
If you only want to run small class 2, best to run them straight from the inverter
That maintains the safety level
PeterQ
You may never have an accident but the potential for faults to develop exists & shocks could occur with the right [or should it be wrong]FAULTS
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Tuesday 18th of February 2014 10:07:01 PM
thomas01 said
10:36 PM Feb 18, 2014
Peter Q, I understand what you are saying and I guess everything we do in life has some risk.
What I was envisaging was running low wattage, mainly plastic encased plug-ins such as battery chargers and power supplies. How much of a risk do you believe I would be taking doing this?
If I am putting you on the spot I understand if you don't answer.
Regards Robert
oldtrack123 said
11:13 PM Feb 18, 2014
thomas01 wrote:
Peter Q, I understand what you are saying and I guess everything we do in life has some risk.
What I was envisaging was running low wattage, mainly plastic encased plug-ins such as battery chargers and power supplies. How much of a risk do you believe I would be taking doing this?
If I am putting you on the spot I understand if you don't answer.
Regards Robert
HI Robert
Those usually only have a 2pin plug
That means they are fully insulated Class2
But it is not them that can give problems, if an inverter or generator is plugged into the van inlet socket, the problem can come with the other 3pin devices that are plugged in
It would be safer if you just plugged those devices with 2pin plugs direct into the inverter
Safer to even use a multi outlet power board for THAT purpose
So A direct Answer is
If they have 2pin plugs, plug then into the inverter, use power board if you want more outlets
That will be quite safe from shocks to earth , even though there will no RCD in the circuit
Avoid plugging the inverter into the van power inlet socket if you possibly can
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 19th of February 2014 12:53:22 AM
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 19th of February 2014 12:55:07 AM
Aus-Kiwi said
11:15 PM Feb 18, 2014
The issue is running it into hard wired GPO's in van.. It will be ok on its own..
plugged directly into inverter..
-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Tuesday 18th of February 2014 11:16:22 PM
freehazzas said
10:56 AM Feb 19, 2014
We use an inverter in our rig and have a power board pluged into that. Then we plug what ever into the power board. My hubby is ex electrition and says its very safe.
We do have the inverter in a place where it can get air so does not heat up and we also dont leave it on at night.
Delta18 said
11:16 AM Feb 19, 2014
Slightly OT, what is the current draw of an inverter?
Assuming example a 600w inverter.
Is it a. the draw of an appliance plugged into it, eg a 100w appliance the draw would be 100w (plus inverter fan etc)
Is it b. 600w regardless what is plugged in?
Is it c. somewhere mid range?
intouch said
11:56 AM Feb 19, 2014
We have had a 1500 w inverter installed in our motor home, we have two 100ah battaries and as yet have not used the inverter.
We leave Thursday for a quick two week trip out through the old gold fields near Bathurst. Will use the inverter only for what is meant for,
that does not include the air conditioner. We carry a Honda 20i for that purpose, although I hate air conditioners, the other half loves it.
oldtrack123 said
10:49 PM Feb 19, 2014
freehazzas wrote:
We use an inverter in our rig and have a power board pluged into that. Then we plug what ever into the power board. My hubby is ex electrition and says its very safe. We do have the inverter in a place where it can get air so does not heat up and we also dont leave it on at night.
Hi Perhaps hubby has not considered the situation if a fault develops ANYWHERE IN the WHOLE system, from any ONE of the lines to the "EARTHING "system ,
It THEN is no longer an isolated inverter
But an inverter with an Active ,Neutral ,&Earth
BUT any RCD fitted will not be operational
NO protection against shocks to the earthing system
PeterQ
Aus-Kiwi said
02:18 AM Feb 21, 2014
The earth is also to fault making fuse or breaker operate..
If there's out of balance between N & A the RCD should trip..
Tuff luck if your between N & A !!
BTA how did we survive 20 or so years ago ??
oldtrack123 said
12:29 PM Feb 28, 2014
freehazzas wrote:
We use an inverter in our rig and have a power board pluged into that. Then we plug what ever into the power board. My hubby is ex electrition and says its very safe. We do have the inverter in a place where it can get air so does not heat up and we also dont leave it on at night.
HI IF you do want a unit that does give protection from shocks to earth [IF an insulation failure occurs ANYWHERE in the system]
talk to these people' about their universal RVD range including the NEW plug in power boards THAT DO WORK WITH ISOLATED SUPPLIES:
I don't know why you would recommend SafeLec..
There are other item's out there that do the exact same thing and are Cheaper....
The Device that is needed for a Mobile system is a Combo safety device.. -- it does both the roll of RCD and RVD work.. They are interconnected..
Juergen
- Look at PowerSafe ..... Not PowerStream
J
oldtrack123 said
08:48 PM Mar 2, 2014
HI Snow
NO way will I recommend the Powersafe product
It is a direct copy of the old Protecelec RVD combo.[NOTE IT WAS A COMBO unit just the same as the copy cat/ but you could buy the RVD unit seperately.AND still can for low current applications.]
AND there is a story how THAT came about!!!
They were not Power stream
THE new range of Safetechnolgy products are far superior to the copy cats, IMHO.
If I were to connect a 12V DC to 240V AC inverter to the van battery and plug the outgoing 240V ac into the vans AC input plug so that I could use the van's GPO's to run low wattage appliances such as phone and laptop chargers, am I creating a safety hazard. I realise the total wattage that can be used is subject to the output of the inverter. My question basically is if the built-in safety systems such as RCD's will still operate. I understand that the rated AC circuit breakers will not trip. Techies, am I on death row if I contemplate this?
Regards Robert
Hi
The quick simple answer is NO, the van RCD is not functional
You will have more than ONE Class1 Device connected
The SAFETY RECOMMENDATION with such Inverters & generators is to only have ONE Class1[have 3pin plug] device connected at any time
The van itself, when you plug it into the inverter is THAT ONE class1 device!!!then you will with out doubt have other class 1 device connected such as fridge, charger, ---------
You can run more than one Class2 [2pin plugs] with a high level of safety
If you only want to run small class 2, best to run them straight from the inverter
That maintains the safety level
PeterQ
You may never have an accident but the potential for faults to develop exists & shocks could occur with the right [or should it be wrong]FAULTS
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Tuesday 18th of February 2014 10:07:01 PM
What I was envisaging was running low wattage, mainly plastic encased plug-ins such as battery chargers and power supplies. How much of a risk do you believe I would be taking doing this?
If I am putting you on the spot I understand if you don't answer.
Regards Robert
HI Robert
Those usually only have a 2pin plug
That means they are fully insulated Class2
But it is not them that can give problems, if an inverter or generator is plugged into the van inlet socket, the problem can come with the other 3pin devices that are plugged in
It would be safer if you just plugged those devices with 2pin plugs direct into the inverter
Safer to even use a multi outlet power board for THAT purpose
So A direct Answer is
If they have 2pin plugs, plug then into the inverter, use power board if you want more outlets
That will be quite safe from shocks to earth , even though there will no RCD in the circuit
Avoid plugging the inverter into the van power inlet socket if you possibly can
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 19th of February 2014 12:53:22 AM
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 19th of February 2014 12:55:07 AM
The issue is running it into hard wired GPO's in van.. It will be ok on its own..
plugged directly into inverter..
-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Tuesday 18th of February 2014 11:16:22 PM
We do have the inverter in a place where it can get air so does not heat up and we also dont leave it on at night.
Slightly OT, what is the current draw of an inverter?
Assuming example a 600w inverter.
Is it a. the draw of an appliance plugged into it, eg a 100w appliance the draw would be 100w (plus inverter fan etc)
Is it b. 600w regardless what is plugged in?
Is it c. somewhere mid range?
We leave Thursday for a quick two week trip out through the old gold fields near Bathurst. Will use the inverter only for what is meant for,
that does not include the air conditioner. We carry a Honda 20i for that purpose, although I hate air conditioners, the other half loves it.
Hi
Perhaps hubby has not considered the situation if a fault develops ANYWHERE IN the WHOLE system, from any ONE of the lines to the "EARTHING "system
It THEN is no longer an isolated inverter
But an inverter with an Active ,Neutral ,&Earth
BUT any RCD fitted will not be operational
NO protection against shocks to the earthing system
PeterQ
If there's out of balance between N & A the RCD should trip..
Tuff luck if your between N & A !!
BTA how did we survive 20 or so years ago ??
HI
IF you do want a unit that does give protection from shocks to earth [IF an insulation failure occurs ANYWHERE in the system]
talk to these people' about their universal RVD range including the NEW plug in power boards THAT DO WORK WITH ISOLATED SUPPLIES:
www.safelec.com.au/home.html,
PeterQ
I don't know why you would recommend SafeLec..
There are other item's out there that do the exact same thing and are Cheaper....
The Device that is needed for a Mobile system is a Combo safety device.. -- it does both the roll of RCD and RVD work.. They are interconnected..
Juergen
- Look at PowerSafe ..... Not PowerStream
J
HI Snow
NO way will I recommend the Powersafe product
It is a direct copy of the old Protecelec RVD combo.[NOTE IT WAS A COMBO unit just the same as the copy cat/ but you could buy the RVD unit seperately.AND still can for low current applications.]
AND there is a story how THAT came about!!!
They were not Power stream
THE new range of Safetechnolgy products are far superior to the copy cats, IMHO.
PeterQ