problems with anderson plug on fridge blowing fuses.
carry1 said
05:33 AM Feb 2, 2013
Hi guys,we have a new caravan with an anderson plug for the fridge . We have had new wiring and a new anderson plug connected to the toyota land cruiser 100 series 2006, and it keeps blowing the fuses to the speedo in the cruiser. It has blown them a few times, cruiser has been checked out by the installers of the plug and Motor Co RV also recon it is not the caravan. They recon that land cruises suffer these problems, has anyone also had a problem. Any advice to overcome this problem.
Cheers Michael
oldtrack123 said
06:45 AM Feb 2, 2013
Hi
If the Andersen plug etc has been correctly wired it should have no effect on the fuse for the speedo
But ANY electrician should be able to determine for a certain that it is wired correctly.
What size fuse is being blown ??
When does it actualy blow?
Peter
carry1 said
06:57 AM Feb 2, 2013
Hi Peter, it blows the fuse when we disconnect the plug from the car. It blows 2x 10a fuse.
Michael
oldtrack123 said
07:59 AM Feb 2, 2013
Hi Micheal
Blowing a 10A fuse indicates a serious problem
Blowing it when unplugging is very strange
Does it blow IF the anderson is left unplugged?
I seriously doubt it is Toyota wiring at fault !!
More likely a stuff up by the bloke who wired the Andersen plugs
That 10A fuse would not just be for the Speedo but other circuits as well
Did you have a VSR[isolating relay ]fitted as well?
Are the van brakes, tail .side lights fed by the Andersen as well?
I suggest, if this started after the Anderson job was done, you take it back to the bloke who did it to fix ,AT HIS EXPENSE
It should not take long to determine the problem IF HE KNOWS HOW TO TEST!!
Peter
carry1 said
11:11 PM Feb 2, 2013
Hi Peter, Thanks for your reply. The fuse blows AFTER we unplug the anderson plug. If we park the van, unhitch everything than say go for a ride in the cruiser the speedo does not work anymore everything else on the front dash still works.The fridge is the only thing we have working on the 12 vlt when travelling, all other lights etc are on the normal trailor connection. We have had the trailor connection checked and thats ok.We do have a VSR fitted. I know we are not able to understand it ourselves. Yes we are going to go back to the crowd who installed the anderson plug in the cruiser and not leave till they sort it out. In the mean time we travel without it pluged it in. Ha! nothing like being on the open road without a speedo, thank goodness for a rev counter to go by. Thanks again for your help. Michael
oldtrack123 said
11:26 PM Feb 2, 2013
Hi Micheal
Did they fit the van section of the Anderson plug?
It may be best if you take the van as well
Peter
jimricho said
12:37 AM Feb 3, 2013
oldtrack123 wrote:
Hi Micheal
Blowing a 10A fuse indicates a serious problem
Blowing it when unplugging is very strange
Does it blow IF the anderson is left unplugged?
I seriously doubt it is Toyota wiring at fault !!
More likely a stuff up by the bloke who wired the Andersen plugs
That 10A fuse would not just be for the Speedo but other circuits as well
Did you have a VSR[isolating relay ]fitted as well?
Are the van brakes, tail .side lights fed by the Andersen as well?
I suggest, if this started after the Anderson job was done, you take it back to the bloke who did it to fix ,AT HIS EXPENSE
It should not take long to determine the problem IF HE KNOWS HOW TO TEST!!
Peter
Hi Peter,
If it's determined that the isolating relay is correctly wired in the vehicle do think that the remedy may be to install a reverse biased diode across the relay coil. The practice is very common in electronic circuits that use relays and is done to quench any (negative) voltage spikes coming from the coil when the coil circuit is opened.
Jim
oldtrack123 said
01:35 AM Feb 3, 2013
jimricho wrote:
oldtrack123 wrote:
Hi Micheal
Blowing a 10A fuse indicates a serious problem
Blowing it when unplugging is very strange
Does it blow IF the anderson is left unplugged?
I seriously doubt it is Toyota wiring at fault !!
More likely a stuff up by the bloke who wired the Andersen plugs
That 10A fuse would not just be for the Speedo but other circuits as well
Did you have a VSR[isolating relay ]fitted as well?
Are the van brakes, tail .side lights fed by the Andersen as well?
I suggest, if this started after the Anderson job was done, you take it back to the bloke who did it to fix ,AT HIS EXPENSE
It should not take long to determine the problem IF HE KNOWS HOW TO TEST!!
Peter
Hi Peter,
If it's determined that the isolating relay is correctly wired in the vehicle do think that the remedy may be to install a reverse biased diode across the relay coil. The practice is very common in electronic circuits that use relays and is done to quench any (negative) voltage spikes coming from the coil when the coil circuit is opened.
Jim
Hi Jim
I am a great believer in a diode [reverse comneected] across any DC inductive load, to aborb the back voltage spike
But the current is low & should not blow a 10A fuse
that ndicates a seriousproblem butit is hard to say just what is going on
I suspectit is something to do with how the VSR has been connected
But it could be as simple as some short occuring within the Andersen plug,whenit is being unplugged
It willbe interesting to know just what it turns out to be
A check to see what else is on that fuse could help![there is more than just the Speedo ,I am sure!!]
Peter
jimricho said
02:30 AM Feb 3, 2013
Gotta agree with you Peter but it's thought worth "throwing into the mix"
Is the relay actually a VSR (Voltage Sensitive Relay) or is is it just a "common or garden variety" relay/solonoid, the more usual choice for isolating the fridge circuit. If a genuine VSR is fitted there is no need to pick up the vehicle's wiring to energise the VSR unlike a normal relay. The VSR will do it's own smarts to work out when to close and open. The VSR is my preferred option for this purpose and I have one installed in my own tug. (a Redarc "Smart Start")
Not sure of your background Carry1 so please excuse me if you're already au fait with this, but a VSR (Voltage Sensitive Relay) is the type of device that's used in dual battery systems to isolate the second battery from the first until the first one is near fully charged. While this application is a bit different here it is quite appropriate to use one to isolate the Anderson plug circuit.
It is unlikely that an auto sparky would install a VSR unless specifically requested to do so. (They cost more)
Jim
carry1 said
06:30 AM Feb 3, 2013
Hi Jim, I thought it might have been a surge back in power from the caravan plug into the power supply to the cruiser which is causing the fuse to blow on the cruiser. You could be right they may have installed a common run of the mill regulator and not the "smart start" type you are talking about which could possibly cure this problem. Just checked the cruiser and it seems you are correct it is just the garden variety. Will now go and see the installers about your suggestion and have the regulator changed. Thanks Peter and Jim, you have put more light on this matter now as it has been a bit of a mystery to us. Will let you know how we get on once fixed.
Michael
PeterD said
07:38 AM Feb 3, 2013
Michael, this one intrigues me. Is the fuses that blow ones that and been added for the caravan? If they are ones supplied with the new vehicle, which ones are they.
carry1 said
07:10 PM Feb 3, 2013
Hi Peter. the caravan is all good it has been checked by Motor Co RV the van sellers when we had it serviced last week and it did not blow fuses with their connections (fridge was 1st on the list to be checked) . The problem is with the car set up, it never had a anderson plug when we baught it.We will take it back next week to the installers and talk to them about the smart start VSR Jim was talking about. Let you know how we go on.
Michael
jimricho said
01:48 AM Feb 4, 2013
Hi Michael,
VSRs go under a variety of names such as dual battery control relay and dual battery isolator amongst others. There are numerous manufacturers of these but I use am happy to recommend the "Smart Start" by Redarc. click on http://www.redarc.com.au/products/product/smart-start-sbi_12v_100a/ for more info. This is the one I have in my rig doing just this job.
Your sparky may wonder why you want to do this. Suggest you explain that in view of the problems you don't want any interconnect with the vehicles electrical system,other than of course the battery terminals. The only connection is the two main terminals on the unit, one from the battery +ve and one to the Anderson Plug +ve. There is an extra wire which is earthed and another one for a bypass switch which you don't use. The relay itself will decide when to connect and disconnect the Anderson plug circuit.
The Redarc is an electro-mechanical unit (as distinct from solid state) and you'll hear it "click in" several seconds possibly up to a minute, after the engine has started. It may stay connected for a short time (or even longer) after the engine has stopped especially when nothing is connected to the plug. This is quite normal.
Another suggestion is to go over all the connections on the -ve or earth side of the circuit. Faulty or dodgy earthing, especially where bonded to the vehicle chassis, is a common cause of problems, some of which can manifest themselves in quite strange and seemingly illogical ways.
Jim
carry1 said
05:10 AM Feb 4, 2013
Thanks Jim, you have been a BIG help. Being in the plumbing business all this auto electrical mystery was doing my head in. I do understand what you are talking about though,and have printed out your problem solving advice and will refer to it when talking to auto electrician incase he does not have your wealth of knowledge.
Michael
patrolst said
05:31 PM Feb 4, 2013
Make sure you have the earth lead return from the Anderson plug all the way back to the battery and not only but as well as the chassis return.
Doing this will give you a stronger circuit.
Most Auto Electricians will only return via the chassis.
Gary Byrne said
09:44 PM Feb 7, 2013
Hi Michael, exactly where is the Anderson plug supplied from & what size fuse is protecting it (not the fuse you are blowing) have you plugged something else into the plug to see if it blows, what current rating is the fridge & is it wired negative to earth ??????
cheers Gary 0244545021 if you want to chat about it
Hi guys,we have a new caravan with an anderson plug for the fridge . We have had new wiring and a new anderson plug connected to the toyota land cruiser 100 series 2006, and it keeps blowing the fuses to the speedo in the cruiser. It has blown them a few times, cruiser has been checked out by the installers of the plug and Motor Co RV also recon it is not the caravan. They recon that land cruises suffer these problems, has anyone also had a problem. Any advice to overcome this problem.
Cheers Michael
Hi
If the Andersen plug etc has been correctly wired it should have no effect on the fuse for the speedo
But ANY electrician should be able to determine for a certain that it is wired correctly.
What size fuse is being blown ??
When does it actualy blow?
Peter
Michael
Hi Micheal
Blowing a 10A fuse indicates a serious problem
Blowing it when unplugging is very strange
Does it blow IF the anderson is left unplugged?
I seriously doubt it is Toyota wiring at fault !!
More likely a stuff up by the bloke who wired the Andersen plugs
That 10A fuse would not just be for the Speedo but other circuits as well
Did you have a VSR[isolating relay ]fitted as well?
Are the van brakes, tail .side lights fed by the Andersen as well?
I suggest, if this started after the Anderson job was done, you take it back to the bloke who did it to fix ,AT HIS EXPENSE
It should not take long to determine the problem IF HE KNOWS HOW TO TEST!!
Peter
Thanks for your reply. The fuse blows AFTER we unplug the anderson plug. If we park the van, unhitch everything than say go for a ride in the cruiser the speedo does not work anymore everything else on the front dash still works.The fridge is the only thing we have working on the 12 vlt when travelling, all other lights etc are on the normal trailor connection. We have had the trailor connection checked and thats ok.We do have a VSR fitted. I know we are not able to understand it ourselves. Yes we are going to go back to the crowd who installed the anderson plug in the cruiser and not leave till they sort it out. In the mean time we travel without it pluged it in. Ha! nothing like being on the open road without a speedo, thank goodness for a rev counter to go by. Thanks again for your help.
Michael
Hi Micheal
Did they fit the van section of the Anderson plug?
It may be best if you take the van as well
Peter
Hi Peter,
If it's determined that the isolating relay is correctly wired in the vehicle do think that the remedy may be to install a reverse biased diode across the relay coil. The practice is very common in electronic circuits that use relays and is done to quench any (negative) voltage spikes coming from the coil when the coil circuit is opened.
Jim
Hi Jim
I am a great believer in a diode [reverse comneected] across any DC inductive load, to aborb the back voltage spike
But the current is low & should not blow a 10A fuse
that ndicates a seriousproblem butit is hard to say just what is going on
I suspectit is something to do with how the VSR has been connected
But it could be as simple as some short occuring within the Andersen plug,whenit is being unplugged
It willbe interesting to know just what it turns out to be
A check to see what else is on that fuse could help![there is more than just the Speedo ,I am sure!!]
Peter
Is the relay actually a VSR (Voltage Sensitive Relay) or is is it just a "common or garden variety" relay/solonoid, the more usual choice for isolating the fridge circuit. If a genuine VSR is fitted there is no need to pick up the vehicle's wiring to energise the VSR unlike a normal relay. The VSR will do it's own smarts to work out when to close and open. The VSR is my preferred option for this purpose and I have one installed in my own tug. (a Redarc "Smart Start")
Not sure of your background Carry1 so please excuse me if you're already au fait with this, but a VSR (Voltage Sensitive Relay) is the type of device that's used in dual battery systems to isolate the second battery from the first until the first one is near fully charged. While this application is a bit different here it is quite appropriate to use one to isolate the Anderson plug circuit.
It is unlikely that an auto sparky would install a VSR unless specifically requested to do so. (They cost more)
Jim
Thanks Peter and Jim, you have put more light on this matter now as it has been a bit of a mystery to us. Will let you know how we get on once fixed.
Michael
Michael
VSRs go under a variety of names such as dual battery control relay and dual battery isolator amongst others. There are numerous manufacturers of these but I use am happy to recommend the "Smart Start" by Redarc. click on http://www.redarc.com.au/products/product/smart-start-sbi_12v_100a/ for more info. This is the one I have in my rig doing just this job.
Your sparky may wonder why you want to do this. Suggest you explain that in view of the problems you don't want any interconnect with the vehicles electrical system,other than of course the battery terminals. The only connection is the two main terminals on the unit, one from the battery +ve and one to the Anderson Plug +ve. There is an extra wire which is earthed and another one for a bypass switch which you don't use. The relay itself will decide when to connect and disconnect the Anderson plug circuit.
The Redarc is an electro-mechanical unit (as distinct from solid state) and you'll hear it "click in" several seconds possibly up to a minute, after the engine has started. It may stay connected for a short time (or even longer) after the engine has stopped especially when nothing is connected to the plug. This is quite normal.
Another suggestion is to go over all the connections on the -ve or earth side of the circuit. Faulty or dodgy earthing, especially where bonded to the vehicle chassis, is a common cause of problems, some of which can manifest themselves in quite strange and seemingly illogical ways.
Jim
Michael
Make sure you have the earth lead return from the Anderson plug all the way back to the battery and not only but as well as the chassis return.
Doing this will give you a stronger circuit.
Most Auto Electricians will only return via the chassis.
Hi Michael, exactly where is the Anderson plug supplied from & what size fuse is protecting it (not the fuse you are blowing) have you plugged something else into the plug to see if it blows, what current rating is the fridge & is it wired negative to earth ??????
cheers Gary 0244545021 if you want to chat about it