But when I dug a little deeper things just didn't add up.
So I personally bought an old cruiser and yes they cost a fortune and there is a reason for that, they just keep going and going.
Even my local mechanic has a jeep and offered to buy my one. Why I asked.
What he told me was he was sick of fixing his jeep all the time..
Each to their own.
Now that the Australian car manufacturers are finished it will be Japanese for me.
Don't get me started on Euro cars. Hehehehe..
Anyway, that's my 2 bob's worth, I'm sure many of you have good stories about your cars and not every maker out there makes lemons or treats customers like turds.
Mixo
p.s there is a lot out there, just go to youtube and type in jeep and lemon and see what comes up. There is even a song about the jeep!
Kebbin said
08:21 AM Dec 10, 2018
Santa posted about a miserable one star Safety rating on the Wrangler Gladiator BB, the rest is simply your paranoia over your choice of vehicle.
I don't mind the look of the Cherokee but the rest are bad reminders of the '80s and you must admit that their parts/customer service is atrocious.
Santa said
08:31 AM Dec 10, 2018
The Belmont Bear wrote:
Interesting that the Op who started this topic hasn't bothered to contribute anything more to the discussion - that meet the definition of a Troll or not ? .
BB
Why would I? I posted a link to a news item of interest to Grey Nomads, have never owned a Jeep, nor know anyone that does, so have nothing more to contribute.
Troll? suit yourself, I really don't care, regardless, the thread has certainly created some interest, most of it very civil.
The Belmont Bear said
08:33 AM Dec 10, 2018
mixo wrote:
I love the looks of the jeep. I know first hand of owners of jeeps that love them.
Would I buy one? NO WAY.
Way too many stories of dud cars and dealers and FCA doing sweet FA about fixing them.
Even the story comments above people not happy about dealers fixing stuff.
Why would you even think about it.
Even The American won't touch them. Listen to scottys channel on you tube of people writing to him about Chrysler/jeep cars..
Would you want to break down in the bush in a Landcruiser or a jeep?
each to their own, it's your money..
Mixo
The statements made in the above post are a classic example of "I heard somewhere" - this sort of constant criticism on public forums no doubt has a damaging influence on people's perception of a brand. The only factual part it contains is that when I bought a Jeep it was my choice (and my money) so if in the long term If I find that I made a mistake then that will be my problem.
Total Jeep Grand Cherokee sales in the US for 2017 - 240,696 units
(Total Land Cruiser sales in the US 2017 - 3,100 units)
Grand Cherokee sales in the US May 2018 - 21,500 units for the month an increase of 3.8 % on last years and approaching sales record figures.
BB
Santa said
08:37 AM Dec 10, 2018
Kebbin wrote:
Santa posted about a miserable one star Safety rating on the Wrangler Gladiator BB, the rest is simply your paranoia over your choice of vehicle.
I don't mind the look of the Cherokee but the rest are bad reminders of the '80s and you must admit that their parts/customer service is atrocious.
Ah yes, guess I'm qualified to comment on looks, the styling of most Jeep models has always appealed to me.
Whenarewethere said
08:42 AM Dec 10, 2018
Names like gladiator or grand cherokee for example give it an image. Similar to naming one's chihuahua Brutus! Sounds brilliant but that's about where it stops. May as well name my Smart Car Fortwo, Brutus!
Santa said
08:46 AM Dec 10, 2018
The Belmont Bear wrote:
Grand Cherokee sales in the US May 2018 - 21,500 units for the month an increase of 3.8 % on last years and approaching sales record figures.
BB
Unsure exactly what relevance this has to sales in Australia.
rockylizard said
08:53 AM Dec 10, 2018
Santa wrote:
The Belmont Bear wrote:
Grand Cherokee sales in the US May 2018 - 21,500 units for the month an increase of 3.8 % on last years and approaching sales record figures.
BB
Unsure exactly what relevance this has to sales in Australia.
Gday...
One needs to read each responding post on a thread to maintain awareness of the reason for responses and the 'direction' some responses head.
BB was responding to mixo's comment that "even Americans won't touch 'them'" hence relevance.
PS - and don't worry Santa. I also put up links for "information" and it attracts comments pro and con ... and ultimately the responses turn to questioning my ulterior motive for the post ... when it was only for interest to members and I failed to see, when posting the link, there was a need for any further comment from me ... or for that matter, anyone else. My neck gets quite sore because of the constant head shaking I end up doing.
Cheers - John
SouthernComfort said
08:55 AM Dec 10, 2018
Hmm, at least some of the rhetoric in here provides a good source of fibre, if not amusement. The article 'selected' by the OP was obviously bound to create division. Been done before
If anyone wanted to look around with genuine objectivity (on any topic) there are always other articles and stats which provide balance. Such is the case on this topic - but that wouldn't do would it?
As for buying an old Landcruiser Doubt we'll be visiting Groote Eylandt anytime soon..
The very thought of a Toyota (or other revered rice burner) breaking down is evidently enough to make some grown men cry. Tragically, the bad news is they DO breakdown, otherwise they wouldn't stockpile spares and recruit Toyota mechanics armed and ready in remote areas.
Time to move on?
-- Edited by SouthernComfort on Monday 10th of December 2018 09:00:27 AM
The Belmont Bear said
09:09 AM Dec 10, 2018
Santa wrote:
The Belmont Bear wrote:
Interesting that the Op who started this topic hasn't bothered to contribute anything more to the discussion - that meet the definition of a Troll or not ? .
BB
Why would I? I posted a link to a news item of interest to Grey Nomads, have never owned a Jeep, nor know anyone that does, so have nothing more to contribute.
Troll? suit yourself, I really don't care, regardless, the thread has certainly created some interest, most of it very civil.
If just passing on info was your intention Santa why didn't you put your post it in the I digress section that Cindy set up for vehicle reviews. Whether you care or not about being called out for troll like behaviour really doesn't bother me either . As a long time forum member don't tell me that when you posted this link to an unflattering article about jeeps you didn't know it would get the usual angry response from owners such as myself - read the definition of troll that I posted earlier.
"Very civil" give me a break the responses I see so far are from Jeep owners who once again feel obliged to defend their choice of vehicle, the usual Jeep critics who come out of the woodwork every time the word Jeep is mentioned and even a few condescending posts defending Jeep owners who have obviously made a dumb decision but are too proud to admit it..
BB
aussie_paul said
09:09 AM Dec 10, 2018
rockylizard wrote:
My neck gets quite sore because of the constant head shaking I end up doing.
Cheers - John
Ha ha John. Stick with it Mate.
Aussie Paul.
-- Edited by aussie_paul on Monday 10th of December 2018 09:09:48 AM
2-Smiths said
09:16 AM Dec 10, 2018
Jeepers Creepers wrote:
Hi, We are also very happy jeep owners, We are now on our 5th jeep back to back, never been left stranded anywhere, We have just purchased our new Wrangler JKU, traded our Grand Cherokee overland.. All our jeeps have served us well and still see our older jeeps running around as friends usually purchase them off us privately.
Yes FCA is the issue with the jeep branding.
We have towed 3.5 tonne with the GC without any issues Have just travelled 5000km in the past 2 weeks in the Wrangler.. Don't even look under the bonnet, We have such complete confidence in the vehicles.
Just so you can understand, I have owned Toyotas most models, Nissans(patrols), Landrover disco, Daihatsu, Suzuki, and various other vehicles... I have used these both for business(tour operations) and privately.. ALL have issues but NONE have the history/roots or comradery of the jeep and its community..
The jeep is the father of all these vehicles (LR excepted), Jeep is also the most versatile, hardtop, softop, no top whatever. who else can still offer this, Jeep is legendary and will remain so. Those that put them down have never really experienced the real jeep or jeeping.
BTW, just start a post of broken down vehicles and let everyone post the make when they spot one.... Jeep will be low on the list... Toyota and Nissan will be way up there. and that is realistic.
VERY happy and PROUD to own a JEEP OlllllllO
Simple reason for this...MUCH larger sample size!
Thing is, what would you rather be in IF the worst happened in the middle of nowhere?
A Toyota or Nissan, where you could probably walk to the nearest dealer and grab a part of the shelf? Or something you need to order parts from O/S for?
mixo said
09:18 AM Dec 10, 2018
I'm fine that I didn't buy a jeep.And I am fine people are buying jeeps out there and are happy with them.
I'm not willing to take that risk.Some are.
I'm bored already....
mixo
Santa said
09:20 AM Dec 10, 2018
rockylizard wrote:
Unsure exactly what relevance this has to sales in Australia.
Gday...
One needs to read each responding post on a thread to maintain awareness of the reason for responses and the 'direction' some responses head.
BB was responding to mixo's comment that "even Americans won't touch 'them'" hence relevance.
PS - and don't worry Santa. I also put up links for "information" and it attracts comments pro and con ... and ultimately the responses turn to questioning my ulterior motive for the post ... when it was only for interest to members and I failed to see, when posting the link, there was a need for any further comment from me ... or for that matter, anyone else. My neck gets quite sore because of the constant head shaking I end up doing.
Cheers - John
Morning John,
Fair enough re relevance.
Not in the least worried about BB's remarks, he does seem to have a cross to bear, no pun intended.
The Belmont Bear said
09:30 AM Dec 10, 2018
Santa wrote:
rockylizard wrote:
Unsure exactly what relevance this has to sales in Australia.
Gday...
One needs to read each responding post on a thread to maintain awareness of the reason for responses and the 'direction' some responses head.
BB was responding to mixo's comment that "even Americans won't touch 'them'" hence relevance.
PS - and don't worry Santa. I also put up links for "information" and it attracts comments pro and con ... and ultimately the responses turn to questioning my ulterior motive for the post ... when it was only for interest to members and I failed to see, when posting the link, there was a need for any further comment from me ... or for that matter, anyone else. My neck gets quite sore because of the constant head shaking I end up doing.
Cheers - John
Morning John,
Fair enough re relevance.
Not in the least worried about BB's remarks, he does seem to have a cross to bear, no pun intended.
Very good Santa I like that one - I don't really have a cross to bear it's just that the constant ill informed rubbish that these posts generate about Jeeps wears thin after awhile.. enough said the topic for me has been done to death..
BB
Santa said
09:36 AM Dec 10, 2018
The Belmont Bear wrote:
Santa wrote:
rockylizard wrote:
Unsure exactly what relevance this has to sales in Australia.
Gday...
One needs to read each responding post on a thread to maintain awareness of the reason for responses and the 'direction' some responses head.
BB was responding to mixo's comment that "even Americans won't touch 'them'" hence relevance.
PS - and don't worry Santa. I also put up links for "information" and it attracts comments pro and con ... and ultimately the responses turn to questioning my ulterior motive for the post ... when it was only for interest to members and I failed to see, when posting the link, there was a need for any further comment from me ... or for that matter, anyone else. My neck gets quite sore because of the constant head shaking I end up doing.
Cheers - John
Morning John,
Fair enough re relevance.
Not in the least worried about BB's remarks, he does seem to have a cross to bear, no pun intended.
Very good Santa I like that one - I don't really have a cross to bear it's just that the constant ill informed rubbish that these posts generate about Jeeps wears thin after awhile.. enough said the topic for me has been done to death..
BB
All good BB.
Cheers, and Merry Christmas from Santa.
HandyWalter said
01:03 PM Dec 10, 2018
2-Smiths wrote:
Simple reason for this...MUCH larger sample size!
Thing is, what would you rather be in IF the worst happened in the middle of nowhere?
A Toyota or Nissan, where you could probably walk to the nearest dealer and grab a part of the shelf? Or something you need to order parts from O/S for?
Gee I didn't know that just a part of a shelf would fix a Toyota. I have just refurbed my Kitchen and I have a few shelfs around. Any Toyota owners want to buy some spares?????
boab said
01:37 PM Dec 10, 2018
the only people that bag jeeps seem to come from those that have never owned one for me any one who buys a 200 series to use as a tow vehicle must have rocks in there head with a pay load of 700 kgs
Dickodownunder said
03:10 PM Dec 10, 2018
For those unfortunate consumers that find that they have a Lemon here is some advice that might help when negotiating the minefield of having it fixed.
The helpful advice is more in the second half of the vid but there is some interesting comments based on facts collected regarding the types of vehicles that appear Lemons due to statistics.
-- Edited by Dickodownunder on Monday 10th of December 2018 03:11:49 PM
Izabarack said
03:22 PM Dec 10, 2018
boab wrote:
the only people that bag jeeps seem to come from those that have never owned one
because they have been smart enough to do the research and read articles like the one linked in the OP?
I do wonder why some take a link to information that may be of real and timely interest to someone looking for a tug, as a personal insult. Calling someone a troll does not change the substantive information contained in the OP link.
Iza
SouthernComfort said
06:03 PM Dec 10, 2018
Izabarack wrote:
boab wrote:
the only people that bag jeeps seem to come from those that have never owned one
because they have been smart enough to do the research and read articles like the one linked in the OP?
I do wonder why some take a link to information that may be of real and timely interest to someone looking for a tug, as a personal insult. Calling someone a troll does not change the substantive information contained in the OP link.
Iza
I seriously doubt any Jeep owner is shallow enough to be personally insulted by this exchange of views. Rather a strange thing to suggest. We may defend the honour of our cars based on our real life experience, different thing altogether. Other than objecting to some of the rhetoric in here, we couldn't care less! We're not about to throw ourselves on burning bushes or dump our cars to buy Toyota's - quite the contrary in fact. However there are a number of claims that need to be taken to task to straighten out the record a bit.
You've suggested that this article may be "providing real and timely interest to someone looking for tug" which IS a very long bow to draw. The only "substantive" information in it relates to nothing more than an issue with the new Wrangler. It doesn't provide any information whatsoever on models that would make suitable caravan TUGS in the Jeep range i.e. Cherokee and Grand Cherokee. The Wrangler is not a model of interest to caravan towers. The rest of the article is a cobbled precis of selective stats, views and contradictions. The inflammatory headline is the real giveaway and should be enough to demonstrate the bias that would follow.
If research into which new car to buy is based on weighted and frankly subjective articles by motoring journo's, you'd be hard pressed to buy any car with complete confidence. These guys frequently disagree and contradict each other on their views, therefore which ones the "smart people" choose to ingest as material in their decision making, is their choice, but it's almost impossible to find consensus.
There are holes and question marks all over this particular article:
1. Recalls - Weird how recalls are bagged so much. You couldn't name one brand that hasn't had any. I'd sooner have my car recalled as a proactive measure, rather than the manufacturer hide from potential problems, only then reacting when they do cause inconvenience. Jeep will recall cars often for the most minor issues, requiring only 'inspection at the next service'. The company (FCA U.S.) issues recalls on a global basis. ACCC may get the credit for publishing them in Aus. but in reality they are manufacturer driven. For all the general ineptitude of FCA's Australian division, they are bound to act on recalls and have done so. Many cars taken in for recall work haven't actually experienced a problem, but an ounce of prevention being better than a pound of cure ain't a bad thing.
2. Disaffection? - To quote from the article "So, while Jeep booms in other parts of the world and is the engine room of profit centre for the entire FCA empire, Australians are now staying away in droves". Oh dear - let's look at the logic, or lack of it: FCA is doing very nicely globally and is investing hugely in new infrastructure in the U.S. The Jeeps we get here are built in the same factories (predominantly Detroit) and to the same standards as those for the U.S. and the Euro market (and are built RHD, not converted from LHD). Are we to believe that the disaffection claimed to be happening here is due to poorly built cars made especially for us, while the rest of the world shows entirely the opposite trend? Nope. The only negatives Aussies are subjected to in relation to Jeep are A.) A record of poor customer relations at FCA Aus, and B.) Negatively biased publicity peddled by (at least some) motoring journo's. and of course, those who take that publicity at face value.
3. Reporting - In his article Mr Newton quotes negative comments from 4 individual owners (not 40, or 400, but 4). I wonder how much real consumer research took place to establish how many people are happy with their Jeep, whatever the model? Evidently not much. No, he's got 4 disenchanted owners to quote, which in his book is representative of an entire market that (by his own observation) just happens to be out of kilter with rest-of-world.
-- Edited by SouthernComfort on Monday 10th of December 2018 06:04:45 PM
Dickodownunder said
08:35 PM Dec 10, 2018
Negative comments reported will vary from source to source.
Forums, Facebook groups, etc may not necessarily be accurate as each comment is usually driven by emotion.
We will all go a long way to obtain actual figures but having said that, the manufacturers of the vehicles would not want to discourage sales however most after sales service and attention to faults failure is the dealer responsibility. This is where most of the problems apart from lack of parts actually come from
explains this downfall and he does explain how to deal with these wayward dealers.
The Belmont Bear said
06:57 AM Dec 11, 2018
SouthernComfort wrote:
Izabarack wrote:
boab wrote:
the only people that bag jeeps seem to come from those that have never owned one
because they have been smart enough to do the research and read articles like the one linked in the OP?
I do wonder why some take a link to information that may be of real and timely interest to someone looking for a tug, as a personal insult. Calling someone a troll does not change the substantive information contained in the OP link.
Iza
I seriously doubt any Jeep owner is shallow enough to be personally insulted by this exchange of views. Rather a strange thing to suggest. We may defend the honour of our cars based on our real life experience, different thing altogether. Other than objecting to some of the rhetoric in here, we couldn't care less! We're not about to throw ourselves on burning bushes or dump our cars to buy Toyota's - quite the contrary in fact. However there are a number of claims that need to be taken to task to straighten out the record a bit.
You've suggested that this article may be "providing real and timely interest to someone looking for tug" which IS a very long bow to draw. The only "substantive" information in it relates to nothing more than an issue with the new Wrangler. It doesn't provide any information whatsoever on models that would make suitable caravan TUGS in the Jeep range i.e. Cherokee and Grand Cherokee. The Wrangler is not a model of interest to caravan towers. The rest of the article is a cobbled precis of selective stats, views and contradictions. The inflammatory headline is the real giveaway and should be enough to demonstrate the bias that would follow.
If research into which new car to buy is based on weighted and frankly subjective articles by motoring journo's, you'd be hard pressed to buy any car with complete confidence. These guys frequently disagree and contradict each other on their views, therefore which ones the "smart people" choose to ingest as material in their decision making, is their choice, but it's almost impossible to find consensus.
There are holes and question marks all over this particular article:
1. Recalls - Weird how recalls are bagged so much. You couldn't name one brand that hasn't had any. I'd sooner have my car recalled as a proactive measure, rather than the manufacturer hide from potential problems, only then reacting when they do cause inconvenience. Jeep will recall cars often for the most minor issues, requiring only 'inspection at the next service'. The company (FCA U.S.) issues recalls on a global basis. ACCC may get the credit for publishing them in Aus. but in reality they are manufacturer driven. For all the general ineptitude of FCA's Australian division, they are bound to act on recalls and have done so. Many cars taken in for recall work haven't actually experienced a problem, but an ounce of prevention being better than a pound of cure ain't a bad thing.
2. Disaffection? - To quote from the article "So, while Jeep booms in other parts of the world and is the engine room of profit centre for the entire FCA empire, Australians are now staying away in droves". Oh dear - let's look at the logic, or lack of it: FCA is doing very nicely globally and is investing hugely in new infrastructure in the U.S. The Jeeps we get here are built in the same factories (predominantly Detroit) and to the same standards as those for the U.S. and the Euro market (and are built RHD, not converted from LHD). Are we to believe that the disaffection claimed to be happening here is due to poorly built cars made especially for us, while the rest of the world shows entirely the opposite trend? Nope. The only negatives Aussies are subjected to in relation to Jeep are A.) A record of poor customer relations at FCA Aus, and B.) Negatively biased publicity peddled by (at least some) motoring journo's. and of course, those who take that publicity at face value.
3. Reporting - In his article Mr Newton quotes negative comments from 4 individual owners (not 40, or 400, but 4). I wonder how much real consumer research took place to establish how many people are happy with their Jeep, whatever the model? Evidently not much. No, he's got 4 disenchanted owners to quote, which in his book is representative of an entire market that (by his own observation) just happens to be out of kilter with rest-of-world.
-- Edited by SouthernComfort on Monday 10th of December 2018 06:04:45 PM
A well argued response Tony and your opening comment about Jeep owners is correct I personally didn't feel insulted by the exchange of views in fact I even thought Santa's cartoon was quite clever. I was more annoyed that this particular article was going to provide a platform for the usual anti Jeep tirade while giving nothing useful to anyone trying to make a decision about what tow vehicle to buy. Anyhow my appologies to Santa for suggesting that he was a troll, going by his responses he no doubt posted the article with good intentions.
BB
Santa said
08:37 AM Dec 11, 2018
The Belmont Bear wrote:
Anyhow my appologies to Santa for suggesting that he was a troll, going by his responses he no doubt posted the article with good intentions.
BB
Thanks BB, though apologies not necessary, no offense taken.
2-Smiths said
12:07 PM Dec 11, 2018
HandyWalter wrote:
2-Smiths wrote:
Simple reason for this...MUCH larger sample size!
Thing is, what would you rather be in IF the worst happened in the middle of nowhere?
A Toyota or Nissan, where you could probably walk to the nearest dealer and grab a part of the shelf? Or something you need to order parts from O/S for?
Gee I didn't know that just a part of a shelf would fix a Toyota. I have just refurbed my Kitchen and I have a few shelfs around. Any Toyota owners want to buy some spares?????
Thanks for that.
So I missed an "f" in "off".
Typically, I now cannot edit the post, so its stuck there.
For your edification, though, it should have read "off the shelf", rather than "of the shelf".
Aus-Kiwi said
01:04 PM Dec 11, 2018
As long as your NOT over the shelf !!
Bryan said
02:37 PM Dec 11, 2018
2-Smiths wrote:
HandyWalter wrote:
2-Smiths wrote:
Simple reason for this...MUCH larger sample size!
Thing is, what would you rather be in IF the worst happened in the middle of nowhere?
A Toyota or Nissan, where you could probably walk to the nearest dealer and grab a part of the shelf? Or something you need to order parts from O/S for?
Gee I didn't know that just a part of a shelf would fix a Toyota. I have just refurbed my Kitchen and I have a few shelfs around. Any Toyota owners want to buy some spares?????
Thanks for that.
So I missed an "f" in "off".
Typically, I now cannot edit the post, so its stuck there.
For your edification, though, it should have read "off the shelf", rather than "of the shelf".
I think we all know its a typo and we all make them from time to time but Handy Walter's response was gold. Great humour to be enjoyed for what it is.
2-Smiths said
03:15 PM Dec 11, 2018
Aus-Kiwi wrote:
As long as your NOT over the shelf !!
Given that we're all into spelling etc. it is "you're" rather than "your" in this instance...
The Belmont Bear said
05:31 PM Dec 11, 2018
Now if you really want to get picky maybe it shoild have read shelves not shelfs...
SouthernComfort said
07:45 AM Dec 12, 2018
'She sold sea shelves by the sea shore, all by her shelf'
Or maybe it was shells she sold by the sea shore all by her shelf, I mean self? Oh bugga, think I'll shelve that one
I wanted a jeep I think they look awesome.
But when I dug a little deeper things just didn't add up.
So I personally bought an old cruiser and yes they cost a fortune and there is a reason for that, they just keep going and going.
Even my local mechanic has a jeep and offered to buy my one. Why I asked.
What he told me was he was sick of fixing his jeep all the time..
Each to their own.
Now that the Australian car manufacturers are finished it will be Japanese for me.
Don't get me started on Euro cars. Hehehehe..
Anyway, that's my 2 bob's worth, I'm sure many of you have good stories about your cars and not every maker out there makes lemons or treats customers like turds.
Mixo
p.s there is a lot out there, just go to youtube and type in jeep and lemon and see what comes up. There is even a song about the jeep!
I don't mind the look of the Cherokee but the rest are bad reminders of the '80s and you must admit that their parts/customer service is atrocious.
Why would I? I posted a link to a news item of interest to Grey Nomads, have never owned a Jeep, nor know anyone that does, so have nothing more to contribute.
Troll? suit yourself, I really don't care, regardless, the thread has certainly created some interest, most of it very civil.
The statements made in the above post are a classic example of "I heard somewhere" - this sort of constant criticism on public forums no doubt has a damaging influence on people's perception of a brand. The only factual part it contains is that when I bought a Jeep it was my choice (and my money) so if in the long term If I find that I made a mistake then that will be my problem.
Total Jeep Grand Cherokee sales in the US for 2017 - 240,696 units
(Total Land Cruiser sales in the US 2017 - 3,100 units)
Grand Cherokee sales in the US May 2018 - 21,500 units for the month an increase of 3.8 % on last years and approaching sales record figures.
BB
Ah yes, guess I'm qualified to comment on looks, the styling of most Jeep models has always appealed to me.
Names like gladiator or grand cherokee for example give it an image. Similar to naming one's chihuahua Brutus! Sounds brilliant but that's about where it stops. May as well name my Smart Car Fortwo, Brutus!
Unsure exactly what relevance this has to sales in Australia.
Gday...
One needs to read each responding post on a thread to maintain awareness of the reason for responses and the 'direction' some responses head.
BB was responding to mixo's comment that "even Americans won't touch 'them'" hence relevance.
PS - and don't worry Santa. I also put up links for "information" and it attracts comments pro and con ... and ultimately the responses turn to questioning my ulterior motive for the post ... when it was only for interest to members and I failed to see, when posting the link, there was a need for any further comment from me ... or for that matter, anyone else. My neck gets quite sore because of the constant head shaking I end up doing.
Cheers - John
Hmm, at least some of the rhetoric in here provides a good source of fibre, if not amusement. The article 'selected' by the OP was obviously bound to create division. Been done before
If anyone wanted to look around with genuine objectivity (on any topic) there are always other articles and stats which provide balance. Such is the case on this topic - but that wouldn't do would it?
As for buying an old Landcruiser
Doubt we'll be visiting Groote Eylandt anytime soon..
The very thought of a Toyota (or other revered rice burner) breaking down is evidently enough to make some grown men cry. Tragically, the bad news is they DO breakdown, otherwise they wouldn't stockpile spares and recruit Toyota mechanics armed and ready in remote areas.
Time to move on?
-- Edited by SouthernComfort on Monday 10th of December 2018 09:00:27 AM
If just passing on info was your intention Santa why didn't you put your post it in the I digress section that Cindy set up for vehicle reviews. Whether you care or not about being called out for troll like behaviour really doesn't bother me either
. As a long time forum member don't tell me that when you posted this link to an unflattering article about jeeps you didn't know it would get the usual angry response from owners such as myself - read the definition of troll that I posted earlier.
"Very civil" give me a break the responses I see so far are from Jeep owners who once again feel obliged to defend their choice of vehicle, the usual Jeep critics who come out of the woodwork every time the word Jeep is mentioned and even a few condescending posts defending Jeep owners who have obviously made a dumb decision but are too proud to admit it..
BB
Ha ha John.
Stick with it Mate. 
Aussie Paul.
-- Edited by aussie_paul on Monday 10th of December 2018 09:09:48 AM
Simple reason for this...MUCH larger sample size!
Thing is, what would you rather be in IF the worst happened in the middle of nowhere?
A Toyota or Nissan, where you could probably walk to the nearest dealer and grab a part of the shelf? Or something you need to order parts from O/S for?
I'm not willing to take that risk.Some are.
I'm bored already....
mixo
Morning John,
Fair enough re relevance.
Not in the least worried about BB's remarks, he does seem to have a cross to bear, no pun intended.
Very good Santa I like that one
- I don't really have a cross to bear it's just that the constant ill informed rubbish that these posts generate about Jeeps wears thin after awhile.. enough said the topic for me has been done to death..
BB
All good BB.
Cheers, and Merry Christmas from Santa.
Gee I didn't know that just a part of a shelf would fix a Toyota. I have just refurbed my Kitchen and I have a few shelfs around. Any Toyota owners want to buy some spares?????
For those unfortunate consumers that find that they have a Lemon here is some advice that might help when negotiating the minefield of having it fixed.
The helpful advice is more in the second half of the vid but there is some interesting comments based on facts collected regarding the types of vehicles that appear Lemons due to statistics.
Anyway have a look....
youtu.be/eGYgIKg27cs
-- Edited by Dickodownunder on Monday 10th of December 2018 03:11:49 PM
because they have been smart enough to do the research and read articles like the one linked in the OP?
I do wonder why some take a link to information that may be of real and timely interest to someone looking for a tug, as a personal insult. Calling someone a troll does not change the substantive information contained in the OP link.
Iza
I seriously doubt any Jeep owner is shallow enough to be personally insulted by this exchange of views. Rather a strange thing to suggest. We may defend the honour of our cars based on our real life experience, different thing altogether. Other than objecting to some of the rhetoric in here, we couldn't care less! We're not about to throw ourselves on burning bushes or dump our cars to buy Toyota's - quite the contrary in fact. However there are a number of claims that need to be taken to task to straighten out the record a bit.
You've suggested that this article may be "providing real and timely interest to someone looking for tug" which IS a very long bow to draw. The only "substantive" information in it relates to nothing more than an issue with the new Wrangler. It doesn't provide any information whatsoever on models that would make suitable caravan TUGS in the Jeep range i.e. Cherokee and Grand Cherokee. The Wrangler is not a model of interest to caravan towers. The rest of the article is a cobbled precis of selective stats, views and contradictions. The inflammatory headline is the real giveaway and should be enough to demonstrate the bias that would follow.
If research into which new car to buy is based on weighted and frankly subjective articles by motoring journo's, you'd be hard pressed to buy any car with complete confidence. These guys frequently disagree and contradict each other on their views, therefore which ones the "smart people" choose to ingest as material in their decision making, is their choice, but it's almost impossible to find consensus.
There are holes and question marks all over this particular article:
1. Recalls - Weird how recalls are bagged so much. You couldn't name one brand that hasn't had any. I'd sooner have my car recalled as a proactive measure, rather than the manufacturer hide from potential problems, only then reacting when they do cause inconvenience. Jeep will recall cars often for the most minor issues, requiring only 'inspection at the next service'. The company (FCA U.S.) issues recalls on a global basis. ACCC may get the credit for publishing them in Aus. but in reality they are manufacturer driven. For all the general ineptitude of FCA's Australian division, they are bound to act on recalls and have done so. Many cars taken in for recall work haven't actually experienced a problem, but an ounce of prevention being better than a pound of cure ain't a bad thing.
2. Disaffection? - To quote from the article "So, while Jeep booms in other parts of the world and is the engine room of profit centre for the entire FCA empire, Australians are now staying away in droves". Oh dear - let's look at the logic, or lack of it: FCA is doing very nicely globally and is investing hugely in new infrastructure in the U.S. The Jeeps we get here are built in the same factories (predominantly Detroit) and to the same standards as those for the U.S. and the Euro market (and are built RHD, not converted from LHD). Are we to believe that the disaffection claimed to be happening here is due to poorly built cars made especially for us, while the rest of the world shows entirely the opposite trend? Nope. The only negatives Aussies are subjected to in relation to Jeep are A.) A record of poor customer relations at FCA Aus, and B.) Negatively biased publicity peddled by (at least some) motoring journo's. and of course, those who take that publicity at face value.
3. Reporting - In his article Mr Newton quotes negative comments from 4 individual owners (not 40, or 400, but 4). I wonder how much real consumer research took place to establish how many people are happy with their Jeep, whatever the model? Evidently not much. No, he's got 4 disenchanted owners to quote, which in his book is representative of an entire market that (by his own observation) just happens to be out of kilter with rest-of-world.
-- Edited by SouthernComfort on Monday 10th of December 2018 06:04:45 PM
Forums, Facebook groups, etc may not necessarily be accurate as each comment is usually driven by emotion.
We will all go a long way to obtain actual figures but having said that, the manufacturers of the vehicles would not want to discourage sales however most after sales service and attention to faults failure is the dealer responsibility. This is where most of the problems apart from lack of parts actually come from
The link I provided above youtu.be/eGYgIKg27cs
explains this downfall and he does explain how to deal with these wayward dealers.
A well argued response Tony and your opening comment about Jeep owners is correct I personally didn't feel insulted by the exchange of views in fact I even thought Santa's cartoon was quite clever. I was more annoyed that this particular article was going to provide a platform for the usual anti Jeep tirade while giving nothing useful to anyone trying to make a decision about what tow vehicle to buy. Anyhow my appologies to Santa for suggesting that he was a troll, going by his responses he no doubt posted the article with good intentions.
BB
Thanks BB, though apologies not necessary, no offense taken.
Thanks for that.
So I missed an "f" in "off".
Typically, I now cannot edit the post, so its stuck there.
For your edification, though, it should have read "off the shelf", rather than "of the shelf".
I think we all know its a typo and we all make them from time to time but Handy Walter's response was gold. Great humour to be enjoyed for what it is.
Given that we're all into spelling etc. it is "you're" rather than "your" in this instance...
Now if you really want to get picky maybe it shoild have read shelves not shelfs...
'She sold sea shelves by the sea shore, all by her shelf'
Or maybe it was shells she sold by the sea shore all by her shelf, I mean self? Oh bugga, think I'll shelve that one