There could easily be relays added to above light circuit? Depends on what you want? If camping for a few days and driving often ? The alternator ( or an extra alternator) can be set up to assist in charging the house batteries..
-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Friday 24th of October 2014 11:25:53 PM
Strange things have happenned. for one: The reg is now only a PWM not a MPPT with up to 30% more output .I wonder how many have been misled. I also noted that a 240V magnetic based led machine light has diappeared, since I asked questions about it compliance to Aus standards
For the electrical minded, IT looked EXACTLY like a light that questions were asked about on another forum THAT used series resistors to reduce the voltage from 240V
Absolutly no isolation between240v & EXTRA low voltage leds
Also only had a SINGLE pole switch
A DEATH TRAP
I'll say it again BEWARE when you buy from ebay, especially with 240v gear
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 25th of October 2014 12:06:31 AM
oldtrack123 said
12:03 AM Oct 25, 2014
Aus-Kiwi wrote:
There could easily be relays added to above light circuit? Depends on what you want? If camping for a few days and driving often ? The alternator ( or an extra alternator) can be set up to assist in charging the house batteries..
-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Friday 24th of October 2014 11:25:53 PM
HI
Yes, there are many options
That again is why there is not one easy answer
Each situation should becarefully considered for possible future expansion.
If you reread my earlier posts I did say there were ways around that but that would be far beyond Mr Average
Yes, there are many ways of adding other charging
That I also mentioned but that adds to the problems of SOC monitoring
But since the inverter does not go through it ,[as depicted]it is useless as a SOC unless it is purely a %SOC calbrated voltmeter
Even then it would be not very accurate & not using Amphrs in against Amphrs out plus not using MR P's formula[more has to go in than was taken out]
PeterQ
SnowT said
02:37 PM Oct 25, 2014
If you are worried about the state of charge of your Batteries..
this is one of many different types of Metering systems..
Juergen
PeterD said
04:47 PM Oct 25, 2014
barbandprairie wrote:
Hi all doing a newsletter for our caravan club in North Queensland. Would like to do a basic article for those (like me) who does not understand solar and caravans. So your input would be greatly appreciated.
Barb, unfortunately it is difficult to write an article that is accurate. If you write something up from something like Blue's site that is full of holes there will be those in your club that will give you the same sort of feedback as Blue is coping. You are better off plagiarising someone elses work and publishing it, but don't forget to acknowledge the author. Authors like Collyn Rivers will allow you to use their work if you reproduce the full script including the bits at the bottom with the links to their web sites. If you take something that is reliable you will not start another lot of crap, corruption and corrections like is going on here.
Another thing about dumbing things down and removing technicalities is you loose accuracy. Try to use technicalities in a simplified way. I would also suggest that if people can not follow the technical jargon then they will not be sufficiently equipped to carry out a successful reliable installation.
Another thing. When Oldtrack, a few others and I come on with our corrections it is not to big note ourselves, it is to assist in preventing others from being led up the garden path.
edit, have a look at your private messages (PM) I have dropped some extra info there.
-- Edited by PeterD on Saturday 25th of October 2014 05:16:03 PM
oldtrack123 said
07:08 PM Oct 25, 2014
SnowT wrote:
If you are worried about the state of charge of your Batteries..
this is one of many different types of Metering systems..
Juergen
HI Snow
Yes, that is one of the upmarket battery MONITORS
But A simple" low voltage Cutout" is something that should be on ALL house batteries, to help get max battery life.
Many options from $40<$100
Low current ones can even be used to actuate a high current load relay.
PeterQ
Gundog said
08:23 AM Oct 26, 2014
I'm confused it appears everyone is debating about this verses that and so on.
I simple speak could you set up say a 1kw standalone system with a bank of batteries invertor and the whole 9 yards of 240v power, if you have sufficient surface area available to mount the panels and available space and weight for extra batteries ?
totally new to solar power consideration
Gundog said
10:58 AM Oct 26, 2014
I suppose my question becomes a little clearer when you consider most novices leaving the bricks and mortar for the life on the road, when we pull up for free camping be it overnight or for a few days, we think of the standard creature comforts like the aircon, TV inc sat receiver etc so how much reserve power would one need when the sun has gone to bed.
Mobile phones, portable internet, tablets and even laptops can be charged easily from 12v so there not an issue.
One of the many things I learnt in the Army is how to quieten a generator, add a threaded connector to the exhaust, add a length of flexible suitable hose connected to a can filled with a filling like course steel wool and bury the secondary muffler. ( word of caution when digging the hole for the secondary muffler ensure there are no tree roots there because you could cause an underground fire) you can fill the hole with water before you back fill it. It works a crewman on as Armoured Command Vehicle, we had a large portable generator and part of its accessories was a secondary muffler system.
-- Edited by Gundog on Sunday 26th of October 2014 11:00:38 AM
oldtrack123 said
03:18 PM Oct 26, 2014
Gundog wrote:
I'm confused it appears everyone is debating about this verses that and so on.
I simple speak could you set up say a 1kw standalone system with a bank of batteries invertor and the whole 9 yards of 240v power, if you have sufficient surface area available to mount the panels and available space and weight for extra batteries ?
totally new to solar power consideration
HI Gundog
There is no limit to what you can set up,IF you have the space the weight allowance & the money
A more direct answer :
You may be able to fit in 10x100W or5x200W panel on te roof depending on what obstructions are on the roof
A very rough rule is for thecombined battery Amphrs[@12V]to be equal to the combined panel Watts
For batterries tohandle that setup I would suggest serious consideration for LiFe Po4s based on weight factor alone
[That should raise some eyebrows]
Butthis is another situation where it is best to do a list of what you would like to use,from that calculate your daily power use
Then you can work out if that is practical & achievable & for how long you wish to stay OFF other means of recharging [mains,generator, .going for long drive if it is a MH,
Ifnot then time to prune the list down a bit
nb To make upthat list you need to know the actual wattage of each item & estimate the expected hrs of daily use for each
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Sunday 26th of October 2014 03:21:38 PM
rockylizard said
09:34 PM Oct 28, 2014
Gday...
You jogged my memory Oldtrack123 ... perhaps you and others could have a gander at this spreadsheet I got from some forum somewhere (too long ago to remember )
I found it helpful in my early days figuring out my solar/battery needs.
If it is still a relevant 'calculator' - please let the thread know - but if it is no longer relevant (or accurate) please just say so on this thread so others can therefore ignore it.
I'm confused it appears everyone is debating about this verses that and so on.
I simple speak could you set up say a 1kw standalone system with a bank of batteries invertor and the whole 9 yards of 240v power, if you have sufficient surface area available to mount the panels and available space and weight for extra batteries ?
the bus is still a work in progress as I'm getting to the stage of finalizing everything... I Currently have 1200W of Solar Panels which gives me about 800w of usable Solar collection for summer in Victoria.. I'm running a Set of Lithium LiFePO4y Batteries.. 300Ah @ 24v which give me a 240Ah @ 80% Depth of Discharge or 20% State of charge.. I'm running 2 @ 24v Inverters with their own Separate 240v system's..
a 350w Inverter which Powers up the basic stuff.. Domestic [ Household ] 240v Fridge.. [Samsung inverter fridge - New Technology[ 50-60w] and I also run a 12v Battery charger which Trickle a standalone 12v AGM battery for basic 12v loads.. Car stereo, 12v cig loads in the main Cab area[front of bus]..
I also run a 2400w/4800w Inverter for All the high end Loads.. Like
-240v cooking and Coffee and toaster and full Gaming Laptop[With all the Bell and Whistles from my American Trip]
so yes it is Possible..
some of the benefits of my system.. My Batteries Weigh in at Less than 80kg All up compared to 2-3 times that figure for a set of Lead acid Batteries that has the SAME USABLE AH's [Weight varies to different manufacturer's] You would need to have a 440Ah @ 24v System to Match my system...
Some people say I have a Power station in my bus.. I would have to say yes I do..
- Can the General bloke/Gal do it... Maybe.. With the right information[Watch this space] and the right Gear.. [ My system Does note use a STORE BOUGHT Battery Management System, If you Don't manage the Lithium's You can DESTROY them..] Psst it not hard to do once you have the right information..
The 240v side of the system NEEDS TO BE DONE BY A QUALIFIED " A " GRADE ELECTRICIAN.... NO IF OR BUTT'S..... You need that piece of Paper to give to the engineer to get it complied..
If you want the information on the Lithium Batteries, You can do What I did.. READ EVERYTHING you can find written by T1 TERRY.. ON every forum you can find that he has posted on.. One of those forums has been deleted..[The old CMCA Forum, I don't even think it was archived] - Meet up the the people that have the systems and then try to get an invite to the Forum's [ Not these forum's ] and No it is ONLY an INVITE ONLY FORUM..
My system is one of MANY different variates of a Lithium Build.. Not all system are standardized at this stage but we are working on making a plug and play system..
So Gundog I hope this answer the comment question that you have about a LARGE system.. Which I'm not the largest by far.. I think I'm towards the Lower end.. I do know of a 700Ah @ 12v system and maybe even a few bigger..
John that Solar Battery Calc spread sheet is valid for Lead Acid Batteries.. and is sill fairly good as a reference..
Juergen
Psst if you want me to post about the Lithium Batteries Verses Lead Acids that I did early on I can try to resurrect the original Table that I created.. The cost will have changed for Lead Acids.. and maybe even for the Lithium's..
-- Edited by SnowT on Tuesday 28th of October 2014 11:42:07 PM
SnowT said
11:42 PM Oct 28, 2014
With my Last Post have I just Kicked the BullAnts Nest....??
We will find out..
Juergen
oldtrack123 said
03:30 PM Oct 29, 2014
rockylizard wrote:
Gday...
You jogged my memory Oldtrack123 ... perhaps you and others could have a gander at this spreadsheet I got from some forum somewhere (too long ago to remember )
I found it helpful in my early days figuring out my solar/battery needs.
If it is still a relevant 'calculator' - please let the thread know - but if it is no longer relevant (or accurate) please just say so on this thread so others can therefore ignore it.
Cheers - and thanks - John
HI John
Yes, it is still very relevent., for the power required
You must always put in more than you take out
Actually, when i went to the link & decided to save it I found it was already" buried" somewhere in" myDocs"/for the files
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 29th of October 2014 03:36:43 PM
There could easily be relays added to above light circuit?
Depends on what you want? If camping for a few days and driving often ?
The alternator ( or an extra alternator) can be set up to assist in charging the house batteries..
-- Edited by Aus-Kiwi on Friday 24th of October 2014 11:25:53 PM
HI
Just revisited
www.ebay.com.au/itm/120-watt-Flexible-Caravan-Solar-Charging-System-with-300watt-Inverter-and-/221581121738
Strange things have happenned.
for one:
The reg is now only a PWM not a MPPT with up to 30% more output
.I wonder how many have been misled.
I also noted that a 240V magnetic based led machine light has diappeared, since I asked questions about it compliance to Aus standards
For the electrical minded, IT looked EXACTLY like a light that questions were asked about on another forum
THAT used series resistors to reduce the voltage from 240V
Absolutly no isolation between240v & EXTRA low voltage leds
Also only had a SINGLE pole switch
A DEATH TRAP
I'll say it again
BEWARE when you buy from ebay, especially with 240v gear
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Saturday 25th of October 2014 12:06:31 AM
HI
Yes, there are many options
That again is why there is not one easy answer
Each situation should becarefully considered for possible future expansion.
If you reread my earlier posts I did say there were ways around that but that would be far beyond Mr Average
Yes, there are many ways of adding other charging
That I also mentioned but that adds to the problems of SOC monitoring
But since the inverter does not go through it ,[as depicted]it is useless as a SOC unless it is purely a %SOC calbrated voltmeter
Even then it would be not very accurate & not using Amphrs in against Amphrs out plus not using MR P's formula[more has to go in than was taken out
]
PeterQ
If you are worried about the state of charge of your Batteries..
victron BMS..
this is one of many different types of Metering systems..
Juergen
Barb, unfortunately it is difficult to write an article that is accurate. If you write something up from something like Blue's site that is full of holes there will be those in your club that will give you the same sort of feedback as Blue is coping. You are better off plagiarising someone elses work and publishing it, but don't forget to acknowledge the author. Authors like Collyn Rivers will allow you to use their work if you reproduce the full script including the bits at the bottom with the links to their web sites. If you take something that is reliable you will not start another lot of crap, corruption and corrections like is going on here.
Another thing about dumbing things down and removing technicalities is you loose accuracy. Try to use technicalities in a simplified way. I would also suggest that if people can not follow the technical jargon then they will not be sufficiently equipped to carry out a successful reliable installation.
Another thing. When Oldtrack, a few others and I come on with our corrections it is not to big note ourselves, it is to assist in preventing others from being led up the garden path.
edit, have a look at your private messages (PM) I have dropped some extra info there.
-- Edited by PeterD on Saturday 25th of October 2014 05:16:03 PM
HI Snow
Yes, that is one of the upmarket battery MONITORS
But A simple" low voltage Cutout" is something that should be on ALL house batteries, to help get max battery life.
Many options from $40<$100
Low current ones can even be used to actuate a high current load relay.
PeterQ
I simple speak could you set up say a 1kw standalone system with a bank of batteries invertor and the whole 9 yards of 240v power, if you have sufficient surface area available to mount the panels and available space and weight for extra batteries ?
totally new to solar power consideration
I suppose my question becomes a little clearer when you consider most novices leaving the bricks and mortar for the life on the road, when we pull up for free camping be it overnight or for a few days, we think of the standard creature comforts like the aircon, TV inc sat receiver etc so how much reserve power would one need when the sun has gone to bed.
Mobile phones, portable internet, tablets and even laptops can be charged easily from 12v so there not an issue.
One of the many things I learnt in the Army is how to quieten a generator, add a threaded connector to the exhaust, add a length of flexible suitable hose connected to a can filled with a filling like course steel wool and bury the secondary muffler. ( word of caution when digging the hole for the secondary muffler ensure there are no tree roots there because you could cause an underground fire) you can fill the hole with water before you back fill it. It works a crewman on as Armoured Command Vehicle, we had a large portable generator and part of its accessories was a secondary muffler system.
-- Edited by Gundog on Sunday 26th of October 2014 11:00:38 AM
HI Gundog
There is no limit to what you can set up,IF you have the space the weight allowance & the money
A more direct answer :
You may be able to fit in 10x100W or5x200W panel on te roof depending on what obstructions are on the roof
A very rough rule is for thecombined battery Amphrs[@12V]to be equal to the combined panel Watts
For batterries tohandle that setup I would suggest serious consideration for LiFe Po4s based on weight factor alone
[That should raise some eyebrows
]
Butthis is another situation where it is best to do a list of what you would like to use,from that calculate your daily power use
Then you can work out if that is practical & achievable & for how long you wish to stay OFF other means of recharging [mains,generator, .going for long drive if it is a MH,
Ifnot then time to prune the list down a bit
nb To make upthat list you need to know the actual wattage of each item & estimate the expected hrs of daily use for each
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Sunday 26th of October 2014 03:21:38 PM
Gday...
You jogged my memory Oldtrack123 ... perhaps you and others could have a gander at this spreadsheet I got from some forum somewhere (too long ago to remember
)
I found it helpful in my early days figuring out my solar/battery needs.
If it is still a relevant 'calculator' - please let the thread know - but if it is no longer relevant (or accurate) please just say so on this thread so others can therefore ignore it.
Cheers - and thanks - John
I think your Talking of a system Like this...
SnowT's Bus
the bus is still a work in progress as I'm getting to the stage of finalizing everything... I Currently have 1200W of Solar Panels which gives me about 800w of usable Solar collection for summer in Victoria..
I'm running a Set of Lithium LiFePO4y Batteries.. 300Ah @ 24v which give me a 240Ah @ 80% Depth of Discharge or 20% State of charge..
I'm running 2 @ 24v Inverters with their own Separate 240v system's..
a 350w Inverter which Powers up the basic stuff.. Domestic [ Household ] 240v Fridge.. [Samsung inverter fridge - New Technology[ 50-60w] and I also run a 12v Battery charger which Trickle a standalone 12v AGM battery for basic 12v loads.. Car stereo, 12v cig loads in the main Cab area[front of bus]..
I also run a 2400w/4800w Inverter for All the high end Loads.. Like
- 240v Hot water system.
- 240v domestic Split Aircon system[not installed yet.
-240v cooking and Coffee and toaster and full Gaming Laptop[With all the Bell and Whistles from my American Trip]
so yes it is Possible..
some of the benefits of my system.. My Batteries Weigh in at Less than 80kg All up compared to 2-3 times that figure for a set of Lead acid Batteries that has the SAME USABLE AH's [Weight varies to different manufacturer's] You would need to have a 440Ah @ 24v System to Match my system...
Some people say I have a Power station in my bus.. I would have to say yes I do..
- Can the General bloke/Gal do it... Maybe.. With the right information[Watch this space] and the right Gear.. [ My system Does note use a STORE BOUGHT Battery Management System, If you Don't manage the Lithium's You can DESTROY them..] Psst it not hard to do once you have the right information..
The 240v side of the system NEEDS TO BE DONE BY A QUALIFIED " A " GRADE ELECTRICIAN.... NO IF OR BUTT'S..... You need that piece of Paper to give to the engineer to get it complied..
If you want the information on the Lithium Batteries, You can do What I did.. READ EVERYTHING you can find written by T1 TERRY.. ON every forum you can find that he has posted on.. One of those forums has been deleted..[The old CMCA Forum, I don't even think it was archived] - Meet up the the people that have the systems and then try to get an invite to the Forum's [ Not these forum's ] and No it is ONLY an INVITE ONLY FORUM..
My system is one of MANY different variates of a Lithium Build.. Not all system are standardized at this stage but we are working on making a plug and play system..
So Gundog I hope this answer the comment question that you have about a LARGE system.. Which I'm not the largest by far.. I think I'm towards the Lower end.. I do know of a 700Ah @ 12v system and maybe even a few bigger..
John that Solar Battery Calc spread sheet is valid for Lead Acid Batteries.. and is sill fairly good as a reference..
Juergen
Psst if you want me to post about the Lithium Batteries Verses Lead Acids that I did early on I can try to resurrect the original Table that I created.. The cost will have changed for Lead Acids.. and maybe even for the Lithium's..
-- Edited by SnowT on Tuesday 28th of October 2014 11:42:07 PM
We will find out..
Juergen
HI John
Yes, it is still very relevent., for the power required
You must always put in more than you take out
Actually, when i went to the link & decided to save it I found it was already" buried" somewhere in" myDocs"/for the files
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 29th of October 2014 03:36:43 PM