......I've been told by more than one CP owner that they've had problems with free campers sneaking in to use their various facilities (including dump points that they've installed at their own expense for use by their customers) without paying. One of the reasons most of them now have locks on the amenities and boom gates.
A CP owner told us that's why so many are now going with a pin number system for the amenities. He specifically pointed at backpackers who pass keys to one another. I guess someone must have paid to stay in said CP at some stage, but these people just walk in off the street with a key to the amenities block.
brickies said
03:41 AM Jan 7, 2013
If I owned a tourist village the people I would be trying to attract would be my children not me . These people are running a business not the Salvation army , I am getting ready for the rotten tomatoes but rest of the country should not have to subsidize your life style , If you own a business you need to make a profit
Santa said
03:44 AM Jan 7, 2013
brickies wrote:
If I owned a tourist village the people I would be trying to attract would be my children not me . These people are running a business not the Salvation army , I am getting ready for the rotten tomatoes but rest of the country should not have to subsidize your life style , If you own a business you need to make a profit
No rotten tomatoes from me Brickies, I agree wholeheartedly.
oldboar said
04:05 PM Jan 7, 2013
"Total agreement here as well. What I do object to though is when the CP owners agitate against independent camping by self contained units. On the other side of the coin, all users, particularly independent campers must be seen to be maintaining the cleanliness of rest stops etc, or we will lose them. Before the outcry starts I agree that in the main, grey nomads are the pick of those using the rest stops but we need to be recognised as such, rather than as tightarse morons stealing toilet paper.
Darrell & Sandra
dazren said
06:35 PM Jan 7, 2013
No rotten tomatoes from me either ? I fully understand that this whole camping Issue is a Very big Picture, and some on here are looking through a very small frame ??
turbopete said
06:47 PM Jan 7, 2013
once upon a time it used to cost a penny to dump hahaha lol
Beth54 said
07:57 PM Jan 7, 2013
turbopete wrote:
once upon a time it used to cost a penny to dump hahaha lol
In some countries it still does! And in some countries you have to pay for loo paper in a public loo!
jimricho said
10:09 PM Jan 7, 2013
jules47 wrote:
You are right jimricho - the basic thing is that the local council should be providing a public dump point in a convenient place - free of cost. A lot of caravan parks either do not allow people outside the park to use their dump point, or charge them for the privilege - but usually around $5 - $20 is a blatant rip off, which is why people have their knickers in knots!!!!!
I have to disagree with your point about caravan parks charging for the use of facilities that are provided for paying guests and not for freeloaders. Do you want free use of their showers and toilets too? CP owners think its a rip-off when freeloaders dishonestly sneak in to use their facilities without paying.
-- Edited by jimricho on Monday 7th of January 2013 10:11:14 PM
ken thomas said
10:32 PM Jan 7, 2013
This caravan park is owned by the council who put in managers to run it, but with them only lasting a few months they are not getting very good ones I have been very happy with the facilities provided by many councils around this big land, but some like echuca that promote a tourist area they should at least put in a dump point. I use both c/p and free camping and pay my way Ken
Happywanderer said
10:40 PM Jan 7, 2013
You certainly stirred up a hornets nest, didn't you Ken?
jules47 said
02:17 AM Jan 8, 2013
Good one Ken - $20 to dump your loo is ridiculous - especially as it is a council owned park - didn't realise that there wasn't another dump point in Echuca - what about all the people who head out on the river - Christies Beach etc? Do they all dig holes? And surely there is somewhere that the paddle boats dump their loads? That council really need to take a long look at what tourism is all about - they advertise they want you to come, there are all these caravan parks and free camping on the river, but no facilities for a dump ????? Crazy!!
Beth54 said
02:29 AM Jan 8, 2013
And if those river campers are all digging holes to bury their loos, what's that doing for the quality of the river water?
jules47 said
02:41 AM Jan 8, 2013
Yuk Beth - the thought is enough to make you sick!!!!
ken thomas said
02:57 AM Jan 8, 2013
Looks like I certainly did marj, but what the hell that is what these forums are all about, getting different opinions Ken
Beth54 said
03:07 AM Jan 8, 2013
ken thomas wrote:
Looks like I certainly did marj, but what the hell that is what these forums are all about, getting different opinions Ken
You certainly did Ken! And I've noticed that sometimes people don't read the original post properly and get the wrong end of the stick.
dazren said
04:26 AM Jan 8, 2013
Ken Thomas wrote, [ in part ] --
There is a sheet at the information centre for vanners to sign regarding a suitable dump point to be installed.
I would not worry about the hornets nest Ken, As you stated in your original post, even the Infomation centre, has a form to sign requesting the council supply a suitable dump point ???
Some on here like to go on the attack, and apparently know more about Echuca, than the Information centre does ???? I personally found your post informative and learnt something, so thank you ?
jimricho said
05:00 AM Jan 8, 2013
There's a "grey' area here. If the ground is being leased to managers to operate the park as a business rather than just employing a manager and using council staff to do all the various work then it is in effect a privately run caravan park, the only difference being that the physical assets and land is being leased rather than owned outright. If this is the case then the operators, as owners of the business (even if not the land and the physical assets) have every right to apply a charge for outsiders using the facilities provided for the park's customers.
Who is charging and collecting the $20? The council? or the operators as part of their lease agreement?
I think there's one thing we do all agree on and that is there should be a public dump point in a town and tourist destination the size of Echuca.
jules47 said
05:35 AM Jan 8, 2013
You are right jimricho - the basic thing is that the local council should be providing a public dump point in a convenient place - free of cost. A lot of caravan parks either do not allow people outside the park to use their dump point, or charge them for the privilege - but usually around $5 - $20 is a blatant rip off, which is why people have their knickers in knots!!!!!
Firefly said
06:42 AM Jan 8, 2013
So when you make a deposit into a dump point, where does your deposit go?
Does a worker have to come and empty a big vat once its full or is it taken away via sewrage?
I have always wondered about that.
neilnruth said
06:45 AM Jan 8, 2013
Our town's dump point (which is council owned and free) goes into the sewer - I think that's why there are restrictions as to where they are placed. Someone might know otherwise.
Firefly said
06:54 AM Jan 8, 2013
Thanks mate.
I thought, to be charging a fee of any sort for a loo, so to speak, there must have been labour involved to get rid of the waste.
Looks like just plain old greed if thats the case.
I have the money to pay for everything we see and do but I wouldn't pay that sort of money. A token in a van park is fine but no dump point to use freely usually leads to people dumping there waste or whatever, illegally.
I am at a loss why each time someone says something is too overpriced, they get jumped on for offering their opinion. Caw blimey guys, chill.
We have been through some tiny little towns and even had to line up at dump points but I have never seen one locked or chargable.
I would dump in the bush if that was the case, dig the hole and bury it. We are chemical free so its all good but if everyone did it, wouldn't be so good.
You want my dollar, offer me something to entice it outa my wallet.
Santa said
03:29 PM Jan 8, 2013
jimricho wrote:
I think there's one thing we do all agree on and that is there should be a public dump point in a town and tourist destination the size of Echuca.
I agree.
jimricho said
03:32 PM Jan 8, 2013
Firefly wrote:
I am at a loss why each time someone says something is too overpriced, they get jumped on for offering their opinion. Caw blimey guys, chill.
It's pointless even having a forum if we can't debate an issue as long as we "play the ball and not the man (or lady)"
I'll regularly take a devil's advocate approach to balance the debate at times, especially when I see busnesses being challenged for wanting a reasonable return on their very considerable investment and the long hours they often put in. I expect my opinions to be challenged and they often are but I don't take it personally when it happens.
Dump points cost money to install and maintain and private operators have every right to charge non-customers to use their facilities even to the extent of discouraging their use by outsiders. This equally applies whether the facilities are owned or leased.
brickies said
03:46 PM Jan 8, 2013
Has a rate payer I pay $175 a quarter to have access to the sewer at our home , So it is a great privilege to be giving access to free dump points
biggles said
04:45 PM Jan 8, 2013
comment withdrawn ..
-- Edited by biggles on Tuesday 8th of January 2013 04:56:47 PM
ken thomas said
08:26 PM Jan 8, 2013
The council do provide toilets at the Information centre and it would not take a lot to put a dump point in next to this already existing facility. This topic was brought up on another forum last year and the same comments were applicable. I sent off emails to the Mayor and other councillors relaying this topic to them and the only reply I had was one saying the Mayor is on leave and would be looked at upon his coming back to the office,, guess what no reply Will have to try again and see what happens Ken
jules47 said
11:27 PM Jan 8, 2013
jimricho - I did not say that the caravan parks should allow people to use their facilities for free - and I also think that paying $5 for the privilege was reasonable - lots of CP's allow campers to use their showers etc for a nominal fee - and that is terrific and forward thinking - in my opinion.
And yes, it does cost to install a dump point, but if you have the sewage available nearby, at the public toilets etc., it is a one off cost, once it is installed, then it would become part of the public toilet maintenance program, surely.
And I love the forum when it gets a bit heated - but not when it becomes a personal attack.
brickies said
04:07 AM Jan 9, 2013
Dump point is not a one off cost the waste has to be treated ,and I would think the pipe diameters would need to be larger than domestic pipe work and manhole to cope volume , So it would not be has simple has connecting to existing service
neilnruth said
06:23 AM Jan 9, 2013
Our council dump point goes straight into the sewer at a sewer inspection point. My hubby doesn't feel there are any special extra big pipes.
gordon_adl said
06:51 AM Jan 9, 2013
I know I started this storm of a conversation. I've been very busy the last few days and have been reading all following posts but I will reply with a proper comment tomorrow when I have more time.
A CP owner told us that's why so many are now going with a pin number system for the amenities. He specifically pointed at backpackers who pass keys to one another. I guess someone must have paid to stay in said CP at some stage, but these people just walk in off the street with a key to the amenities block.
No rotten tomatoes from me Brickies, I agree wholeheartedly.
Darrell & Sandra
In some countries it still does!
And in some countries you have to pay for loo paper in a public loo! 
I have to disagree with your point about caravan parks charging for the use of facilities that are provided for paying guests and not for freeloaders. Do you want free use of their showers and toilets too? CP owners think its a rip-off when freeloaders dishonestly sneak in to use their facilities without paying.
-- Edited by jimricho on Monday 7th of January 2013 10:11:14 PM
I have been very happy with the facilities provided by many councils around this big land, but some like echuca that promote a tourist area they should at least put in a dump point.
I use both c/p and free camping and pay my way
Ken
Crazy!!
And if those river campers are all digging holes to bury their loos, what's that doing for the quality of the river water?
Ken
You certainly did Ken!
And I've noticed that sometimes people don't read the original post properly and get the wrong end of the stick. 
There is a sheet at the information centre for vanners to sign regarding a suitable dump point to be installed.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would not worry about the hornets nest Ken, As you stated in your original post, even the Infomation centre, has a form to sign requesting the council supply a suitable dump point ???
Some on here like to go on the attack, and apparently know more about Echuca, than the Information centre does ???? I personally found your post informative and learnt something, so thank you ?
Who is charging and collecting the $20? The council? or the operators as part of their lease agreement?
I think there's one thing we do all agree on and that is there should be a public dump point in a town and tourist destination the size of Echuca.
So when you make a deposit into a dump point, where does your deposit go?
Does a worker have to come and empty a big vat once its full or is it taken away via sewrage?
I have always wondered about that.
Thanks mate.
I thought, to be charging a fee of any sort for a loo, so to speak, there must have been labour involved to get rid of the waste.
Looks like just plain old greed if thats the case.
I have the money to pay for everything we see and do but I wouldn't pay that sort of money. A token in a van park is fine but no dump point to use freely usually leads to people dumping there waste or whatever, illegally.
I am at a loss why each time someone says something is too overpriced, they get jumped on for offering their opinion. Caw blimey guys, chill.
We have been through some tiny little towns and even had to line up at dump points but I have never seen one locked or chargable.
I would dump in the bush if that was the case, dig the hole and bury it. We are chemical free so its all good but if everyone did it, wouldn't be so good.
You want my dollar, offer me something to entice it outa my wallet.
I agree.
It's pointless even having a forum if we can't debate an issue as long as we "play the ball and not the man (or lady)"
I'll regularly take a devil's advocate approach to balance the debate at times, especially when I see busnesses being challenged for wanting a reasonable return on their very considerable investment and the long hours they often put in. I expect my opinions to be challenged and they often are but I don't take it personally when it happens.
Dump points cost money to install and maintain and private operators have every right to charge non-customers to use their facilities even to the extent of discouraging their use by outsiders. This equally applies whether the facilities are owned or leased.
comment withdrawn ..
-- Edited by biggles on Tuesday 8th of January 2013 04:56:47 PM
This topic was brought up on another forum last year and the same comments were applicable. I sent off emails to the Mayor and other councillors relaying this topic to them and the only reply I had was one saying the Mayor is on leave and would be looked at upon his coming back to the office,, guess what no reply
Will have to try again and see what happens
Ken
And yes, it does cost to install a dump point, but if you have the sewage available nearby, at the public toilets etc., it is a one off cost, once it is installed, then it would become part of the public toilet maintenance program, surely.
And I love the forum when it gets a bit heated - but not when it becomes a personal attack.