41 outside so decided to ask opinions on Facebook. Put up the following question.

"A question about safe towing speeds, especially aimed at any truckies on this group.
I tow a 1.7t hybrid van with an 80 series (aerodynamics of a brick).
My optimum towing speed is 85 kph for fuel economy, and I am in no hurry. I will not be towing at 100 or more.
Is it better for safety reasons to tow at 85 so that trucks can pass me easily, or should I attempt to travel at 95.
Just not sure how easy it is for people to pass me if I am doing 95 when the speed limit on the open road is 100 kph."

Recieved lots of responses summarised as follows

Many thanks to those who have taken the time to respond. Quiet day for me as its 41 outside, so having a lazy day in front of the cricket. A summary of the feedback. About 270 comments. 8 say I should be travelling at or close to the speed limit. 2 say to do 85/90 and stuff everyone else. 7 say to watch towing weights and weight distribution. 15-20 wanted to debate legalities of going too slow. Several commented on people speeding up in passing lanes. 12 indicated to back off after a passing vehicle has started their passing procedure. Several commented on keeping a constant speed. 10 suggested pulling over to let people pass. 24 want me to use my CB to communicate with trucks behind. 30+ suggest that travelling at 85-90 is quite OK as it lets the passing vehicle have a good chance of overtaking.

Generally suggests that travelling at 85-90 is good for traffic to pass as long as I keep a constant speed, do not speed up on overtaking lanes and use the CB to keep in contact with vehicles behind me.

Tow at whatever speed you wish but when someone comes up behind and clearly wishes to overtake then give a few seconds of left indicator when you consider it's safe for them to do so and when they start the overtaking manoeuvre *slow down* in order to allow them to overtake quickly. If it's a truck behind and you have a UHF CB then call to him on that and tell him you'll slow down when he decides to go.

Also, with trucks, give them a long flash of your headlights when it's safe for them to pull back to the left after they have overtaken you.

*Driver Cooperation* -- it's something which is sadly lacking in Australia.

Mike Harding wrote:

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Tow at whatever speed you wish but when someone comes up behind and clearly wishes to overtake then give a few seconds of left indicator when you consider it's safe for them to do so and when they start the overtaking manoeuvre *slow down* in order to allow them to overtake quickly. If it's a truck behind and you have a UHF CB then call to him on that and tell him you'll slow down when he decides to go.

Also, with trucks, give them a long flash of your headlights when it's safe for them to pull back to the left after they have overtaken you.

*Driver Cooperation* -- it's something which is sadly lacking in Australia.

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 No way I will tell a semi it's safe for him to overtake as he sits much higher than I do and has the final say, also isn't it 2 flashes of the right indicator when OK to overtake ?

Regards

Kebbin wrote:

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The right indicator is used by the truck driver to thank someone for their help after overtaking.

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 That will only depend on who is around you..

many transport managers thes days instruct their drivers not to use indicators unless they are actually turning or changing lanes.

Dont rely on past myths or facts..

Kebbin wrote:

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The right indicator is used by the truck driver to thank someone for their help after overtaking.

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 I've always thought it was a quick left right  left right by the truckie.??

Shows just how much confusion there is amongst caravanners!!  (I'm not saying I am correct)

Regards

You are correct.....when I used to drive interstate in a B-Double,that was the generally

accepted means of saying Thanks to those who had used their headlights to indicate to you

that it was safe for you to return to the left lane.      

                                                                  Cheers.

God help us all!!!!

adreamer wrote:

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God help us all!!!!

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 Sorry, do not get the point of this comment.

Gday...

I find it interesting that, in many things, we all have different experiences, memories or knowledge about the same thing.

I was taught from back when I was knee high to a wombat's navel that when travelling slowly for whatever reason and there are vehicles behind that you would like to advise to overtake then two flicks of the right indicator was the 'universal' sign that "the road ahead is clear, I am aware you are there, overtake if you agree it is safe".

I was also advised that using the left indicator in the same situation would be an advice to those behind that you were intending to pull over as soon as practicable to allow them pass. The following vehicle/s would therefore wait for me to move off the road to give them space to execute the overtake.

It was also the 'universal' sign that when a truck, or vehicle with van/trailer, was overtaking you that you would wait until the rearmost part of the overtaking vehicle was one metre clear of my vehicle and to then do two flashes of the headlights - usually waiting until you saw the truck/vehicle's driver's face in their left mirror as he checked his left side before pulling in. The truck driver would then, if they were thankful for the 'assistance', give a left-right-left-right flash of their indicators.

Jest sayin'  

Cheers - John

[EDIT: OH, and all the above is immaterial if one has a UHF and has been chatting to the truck since they were about 10 or so car lengths behind. Indicators become superfluous as truckie will know you see him, know you are waiting for him to tell you he is overtaking (sometimes they just flash their headlights to let you know they are gonna pull out and overtake) and then the overtake is completed with a friendly "clear" statement on the UHF ... and we both thank each other's mum for the rabbits and get on wif the trials of the long drive.]

Hi John....Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this subject,which describe

exactly how things were done when I was driving 5000km/week.I have discussed this

with a friend,who is long-time interstate driver,and he agrees with your comments.

Thanks again.

              Cheers

.

God help us all......please explain this comment.

A couple of flashes of the blinker while maintaining your speed,is a totally different situation

from turning-on your right blinker as you slow to turn right into a driveway.

-- Edited by yobarr on Saturday 6th of January 2018 09:26:33 AM

KevinC wrote:

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When I drove trucks, I was frequently required to turn right into properties on country roads. The idiot car drivers behind me would overtake as I was about to turn, making for some very interesting situations. If an accident had occurred, who do you think would be found to be at fault? Me for signalling my intent, or the following driver for believing I was just being courteous?
For my money, blinkers are to be used as turn signals.
Back to the OP. Driving at the speed limit is generally too slow for many drivers who want to be going a few clicks over. Even the police seem to turn a blind eye to those traveling less than 10 over the limit. So there's never going to be a right answer to this question. Just drive courteously and pray we never get to the ludicrous situation that exists in New Zealand where you are legally obliged to pull over if you get a few cars behind you.

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Gday...

Gotcha Kev ... but let's think this through 

Perhaps it is a bit presumptuous, but one would think that if one was hooting along the highway and there was the need to turn right into a property, or at the next intersection, then one would definitely whack on the indicator. Now, perhaps I am wrong, but one would assume in that circumstance, the indicator is put on at least 30 metres before the need to diverge right, and you had checked the mirror to see just what was behind ... indicator flashing continuously. Now, if the whacker behind saw the first flash of the indicator, 30 metres BEFORE you made any move to execute the right turn, and then they thought they could be off like a rabbit with a flare up its dinger pretty quickly - you had yet to diverge, so nothing unsafe - disconcerting praps ...but not yet unsafe.

Now with your indicator having been flashing for 30 metres or so, probably for at least 6 to 10 seconds (count that out - it is a long-ish time) the whacker behind would have figured out you were actually going to diverge ... and would prefer not to want to lodge an insurance claim for a wrecked vehicle. Even if this whacker did pullout to overtake then, as a professional driver, one would assume you would have checked your mirror before actually executing the turn to ensure it was safe and not likely to cause, if nothing else, damage to your rig. Safe overtaking 101.

Now, if you only did two flashes of the right indicator, that whacker behind, if they were actually paying attention, would think "HMMM praps he is calling me past." My experience is that, these days of the modern young uninformed drivers, particularly city drivers out in the country for a rare excursion into the real world, doesn't even realise the two flashes are an invitation by me for them to check the road ahead and if clear to get their backside outta here. They just sit there and probably turn up their smart-phone music.

Anyway, I gotcha message... I'm jest sayin' 

Cheers - John

rockylizard wrote:

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KevinC wrote:

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When I drove trucks, I was frequently required to turn right into properties on country roads. The idiot car drivers behind me would overtake as I was about to turn, making for some very interesting situations. If an accident had occurred, who do you think would be found to be at fault? Me for signalling my intent, or the following driver for believing I was just being courteous?
For my money, blinkers are to be used as turn signals.
Back to the OP. Driving at the speed limit is generally too slow for many drivers who want to be going a few clicks over. Even the police seem to turn a blind eye to those traveling less than 10 over the limit. So there's never going to be a right answer to this question. Just drive courteously and pray we never get to the ludicrous situation that exists in New Zealand where you are legally obliged to pull over if you get a few cars behind you.

---

Gday...

Gotcha Kev ... but let's think this through 

Perhaps it is a bit presumptuous, but one would think that if one was hooting along the highway and there was the need to turn right into a property, or at the next intersection, then one would definitely whack on the indicator. Now, perhaps I am wrong, but one would assume in that circumstance, the indicator is put on at least 30 metres before the need to diverge right, and you had checked the mirror to see just what was behind ... indicator flashing continuously. Now, if the whacker behind saw the first flash of the indicator, 30 metres BEFORE you made any move to execute the right turn, and then they thought they could be off like a rabbit with a flare up its dinger pretty quickly - you had yet to diverge, so nothing unsafe - disconcerting praps ...but not yet unsafe.

Now with your indicator having been flashing for 30 metres or so, probably for at least 6 to 10 seconds (count that out - it is a long-ish time) the whacker behind would have figured out you were actually going to diverge ... and would prefer not to want to lodge an insurance claim for a wrecked vehicle. Even if this whacker did pullout to overtake then, as a professional driver, one would assume you would have checked your mirror before actually executing the turn to ensure it was safe and not likely to cause, if nothing else, damage to your rig. Safe overtaking 101.

Now, if you only did two flashes of the right indicator, that whacker behind, if they were actually paying attention, would think "HMMM praps he is calling me past." My experience is that, these days of the modern young uninformed drivers, particularly city drivers out in the country for a rare excursion into the real world, doesn't even realise the two flashes are an invitation by me for them to check the road ahead and if clear to get their backside outta here. They just sit there and probably turn up their smart-phone music.

Anyway, I gotcha message... I'm jest sayin' 

Cheers - John

 

Hear,hear!....although I would suggest that 30 metres could be cutting things a bit fine!

Good post though John.

                         Cheers 

 

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Personally, I leave the indicators alone, all it does is complicate things. There is no "rule" about which side to flash or how many flashes etc. just various interpretations of the message you're trying to send - dangerous stuff if the receiver's interpretation of your message is different to your intent. I also prefer to let the truck take control, he can see past you and will assess if/when it's safe to overtake at your current speed. Once he pulls out I maintain speed, or maybe drop back slightly and keep well left. Every time I've done this I get a quick left/right, left/right "thank you" once he's pulled back in.

Hewy54 wrote:

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Due to some confusion with indicators I tend to not use them for indicating(LOL) passing intent. Much prefer the vehicle behind to let me know when they intend to pass on the CB. They have a much better idea of how much room they need. ZACTLY ... good if you and they have a UHF. Experience has shown that there isn't a truckie in the world who will simply pull out because I have flicked twice on me indicator ... they will check and will rarely pull out 'trusting that bloody caravanner' 

Not keen also on passing anyone else when they indicate it it is safe. How do they know how much room I need, and I am not prepared to put my life in the hands of a stranger. If someone indicates it is safe to pass I may have a peek and make my own judgement. ZACTLY ... one would be a trifle thick to simply, and blindly, put the welly to the floor, pull out and hope for the best .(had a very unfortunate incident many years ago when a truck indicated it was safe to pass so I pulled out almost into the path of an oncoming truck. Led to a "duel" type event when he tried to run me off the road several times. Once bitten twice shy)

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Gday...

Also, I would NEVER tell a truckie "go for it sunshine - she'll be right" ... It is ALWAYS his call.

I have no idea of his load, if his truck has the where-withal to boogie enough to get past in what is "my judgement" of passing distance - sitting snugly in my air-conditioned rig assuming he will respond instantly to my signal ... that is on the rare occasion I haven't got the UHF with me - I use a handheld. Never use the indicators for overtaking if I got the UHF.

Additionally, most truckies know those highways like the back of their hand ... their judgement is 99% of the time far better than mine. All the 'two flicks on indicator' mean is "I see ya, I reckon it's clear ahead, go if and when ya ready'.

Cheers - John

Dickodownunder wrote:

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Get a UHF radio... tune it to the appropriate highway channel.... let the truckie know that you know that they want to pass...then when THEY TELL YOU that they will pass then ... once they have pulled out... then and only then...drop your speed so that they may pass quickly and safely.
DO NOT SPEED UP IN THE 3 LANE.
For those that dont know... the 3 lane is the road with the passing lane on the side that YOU ARE TRAVELLING.
Take the time and listen on the UHF on the truck / Highway channels.
You never know but just buy understanding how things really work when sharing the highway with trucks then most may find that their trip is safer and more enjoyable.

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^^^^^^^^^as I said in this post in reply to less than accurate information that was being posted^^^^^^^^

The Spoken Word is not confusing

 Some transport managers forbid the use of indicators for anything but indicating their drivers intention to turn or change lanes.

The reason is that trucks quite often have to enter gates, turn at farms, enter freight premises etc etc and the use of indicators for other reasons can become dangerous and confusing.

There are also insurance implications should a well intended indictor flash be misunderstood.

The extensive use of dash cams can be an easy source of "fuel" for a claim and leave the well intentioned truck operator in financial bother.

This can also work against a well intentioned caravan operator or any motorist for that matter.

Really....what cost is a UHF radio when it comes to operating safely.

rockylizard wrote:

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Hewy54 wrote:

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Due to some confusion with indicators I tend to not use them for indicating(LOL) passing intent. Much prefer the vehicle behind to let me know when they intend to pass on the CB. They have a much better idea of how much room they need. ZACTLY ... good if you and they have a UHF. Experience has shown that there isn't a truckie in the world who will simply pull out because I have flicked twice on me indicator ... they will check and will rarely pull out 'trusting that bloody caravanner' 

Not keen also on passing anyone else when they indicate it it is safe. How do they know how much room I need, and I am not prepared to put my life in the hands of a stranger. If someone indicates it is safe to pass I may have a peek and make my own judgement. ZACTLY ... one would be a trifle thick to simply, and blindly, put the welly to the floor, pull out and hope for the best .(had a very unfortunate incident many years ago when a truck indicated it was safe to pass so I pulled out almost into the path of an oncoming truck. Led to a "duel" type event when he tried to run me off the road several times. Once bitten twice shy)

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Gday...

Also, I would NEVER tell a truckie "go for it sunshine - she'll be right" ... It is ALWAYS his call.

I have no idea of his load, if his truck has the where-withal to boogie enough to get past in what is "my judgement" of passing distance - sitting snugly in my air-conditioned rig assuming he will respond instantly to my signal ... that is on the rare occasion I haven't got the UHF with me - I use a handheld. Never use the indicators for overtaking if I got the UHF.

Additionally, most truckies know those highways like the back of their hand ... their judgement is 99% of the time far better than mine. All the 'two flicks on indicator' mean is "I see ya, I reckon it's clear ahead, go if and when ya ready'.

Cheers - John

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 Once again John has got it right,with the last sentence summing up the situation perfectly.

All the two flicks on the indicator says is that it is clear ahead so the truckie can pull out and have a look

if he wishes.

Dickodownunder wrote:

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Dickodownunder wrote:

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Get a UHF radio... tune it to the appropriate highway channel.... let the truckie know that you know that they want to pass...then when THEY TELL YOU that they will pass then ... once they have pulled out... then and only then...drop your speed so that they may pass quickly and safely.
~~~SNIP

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~~~SNIP Really....what cost is a UHF radio when it comes to operating safely.

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Gday...

Dicko, we are singin' from the same songsheet

I think the only thing that has been missing from the to-ing and fro-ing of 'advice' being bandied around is that, on the OPEN HIGHWAY using the indicators as a method of communicating WHEN THERE IS NO UHF TO USE BETWEEN THE VEHICLES is a practical and oft-used method.

I agree, it is exceedingly rare for a TRUCK to use their indicators to 'call' a car/motorbike/caravanner around. There is no need as the car/motorbike can more easily flick past if the truck has slowed (eg up hill) etc ... and the truckie couldn't care less what the car or motorbike does unless they suddenly lose them in their mirrors. Then he worries about just what the car or motorbike might be doing.   Otherwise, they are happy to leave em sitting behind.

As I have always said on this forum using the UHF to keep in touch with trucks (and other users with UHF) on the OPEN HIGHWAY is ALWAYS the safest way. And as I have repeatedly reiterated on posts on this forum .... "I see ya, I reckon it's clear ahead, go if and when ya ready" and "if one has a UHF and has been chatting to the truck since they were about 10 or so car lengths behind. Indicators become superfluous as truckie will know you see him, know you are waiting for him to tell you he is overtaking (sometimes they just flash their headlights to let you know they are gonna pull out and overtake) and then the overtake is completed with a friendly "clear" statement on the UHF ... and we both thank each other's mum for the rabbits and get on wif the trials of the long drive."

Like I said Dicko, we are definitely on the same song sheet.

cheers - and safe travellin' - John

brickies wrote:

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But question is what is the right speed , Who knows maybe 60 kph .

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Gday...

To be quite honest, I reckon the answer was provided in the original post -

1. 8 say I should be travelling at or close to the speed limit.
2. 2 say to do 85/90 and stuff everyone else.
3. 7 say to watch towing weights and weight distribution.
4. 15-20 wanted to debate legalities of going too slow. Several commented on people speeding up in passing lanes.
5. 12 indicated to back off after a passing vehicle has started their passing procedure. Several commented on keeping a constant speed.
6. 10 suggested pulling over to let people pass.
7. 24 want me to use my CB to communicate with trucks behind.
8. 30+ suggest that travelling at 85-90 is quite OK as it lets the passing vehicle have a good chance of overtaking.

The whole thing is subjective and completely personal preference regarding, abilities, confidence, conditions, type of vehicle and van, and whether I had a good night's sleep last night.

Personally, I agree with the 30+ mob at number 8 ... 85-90 most of the time. 

cheers - John

Double post apology....