I was walking around Bunnings one day and saw some "broom clips" decided to put them on the side of the van to hang stuff. Be a bit careful when you screw into the side, there may be electrical cables, I'm lucky to have a volt stick to detect the voltage. This all works a treat. Of course the Dyson comes off when we travel.
Let me know where you are I come around and help myself very handy pick up
Phil C said
01:14 PM Jun 27, 2015
No mate, cant happen we are on a private winery estate with two big dogs guarding the gate
Cheers..
03_Troopy said
02:23 PM Jun 27, 2015
Just wondering if you used the voltage stick on the outside of the van, and if the van cladding is aluminium (it looks like it is)? Not trying to flame your post Phil, it's just that voltage sticks in the hands of the inexperienced (not yourself, but other readers) can cause a very, very dangerous false sense of security.
But the broom clips do look pretty handy.
Edited for spelling error
-- Edited by 03_Troopy on Saturday 27th of June 2015 02:28:44 PM
brickies said
02:27 PM Jun 27, 2015
Well it a trap for people like me
Phil C said
02:48 PM Jun 27, 2015
Yipes, didn't know it would be such a stir... Just be careful and get someone to help if in doubt..
03_Troopy said
03:06 PM Jun 27, 2015
Sorry mate, didn't mean it to be negative. But I'm sure you've seen people like I have seen, when it comes to using test equipment, even the ones who should know better. If the cladding is ally, it probably won't show up any live wires behind it and some voltage sticks are less sensetive than others. Then there's things like flat batteries in the voltage tester, or even trying to test without 240V connected to the van.
I watched as a supposedly qualified electrician tested for 240V with a multimeter on a fluro fitting he had just relocated that didn't work. He said: "Well there's the problem, no 240V!" I had a look and pointed out that he probably wouldn't measure it too well on the DC setting. Then I took my Fluke 87V back off him before he stuffed it up, and told him to use the el cheapo workshop meter.
I can't remember what the problem was with the light now though.
Phil C said
05:34 PM Jun 27, 2015
Yeah no worries Troopy, I keep forgetting there are others out there who don't have an electrical clue. Thanks for being understanding.
Cheers
grahamg said
07:24 PM Jul 4, 2015
Everytime someone asks a question or puts up a simple hint someone has to bring up the old don't touch the 240v slogan. Getting a bit tried of the same old comments. We are all getting gumpy old men. We should be happy just to read these simple hints without these don't touch the 240v.
-- Edited by grahamg on Saturday 4th of July 2015 07:29:37 PM
03_Troopy said
09:49 PM Jul 4, 2015
grahamg wrote:
Everytime someone asks a question or puts up a simple hint someone has to bring up the old don't touch the 240v slogan. Getting a bit tried of the same old comments. We are all getting gumpy old men. We should be happy just to read these simple hints without these don't touch the 240v.
-- Edited by grahamg on Saturday 4th of July 2015 07:29:37 PM
No worries mate, you go a fiddle with all the 240V stuff you like..
Actually it was a warning about relying on Voltage Sticks to give you the all clear for working on, or drilling through live wires.. And.,. if you don't understand the reason for the warning, I suggest you don't use one either.
Hmm but then again...
grahamg said
10:12 PM Jul 4, 2015
Where did I say I was fiddling with 240V, I just don't need to be reminded in every post not to. This was a simple post about hanging things on the outside of the van I am sure we could have lived without another warning about the dangers of 240v.
03_Troopy said
02:45 PM Jul 5, 2015
Sorry graham, please ignore the warning about relying on voltage sticks... you obviously know all about them already, and the attention I brought their use is of no use to you. There, feel better now?
paddlingfool said
07:42 PM Jul 6, 2015
What are these voltage sticks, can I use them to jump start the tug? :)
03_Troopy said
12:27 PM Jul 7, 2015
paddlingfool wrote:
What are these voltage sticks, can I use them to jump start the tug? :)
I could tell you, but apparently it has nothing to do with hanging stuff, so I can't...
Ask Graham what they are used for.
Phil C said
03:34 PM Jul 9, 2015
Wow, what a stir. Volts sticks are an indicator of the presence of voltage. I have a fluke which is meant to be high quality, the volt stick will glow and beep (depending on the brand) when voltage is nearby.
If in doubt DONT.
BTW I agree with Troopy, don't stuff around with stuff that can kill you.
Cheers
Phil C said
08:23 PM Jul 19, 2015
grahamg wrote:
Everytime someone asks a question or puts up a simple hint someone has to bring up the old don't touch the 240v slogan. Getting a bit tried of the same old comments. We are all getting gumpy old men. We should be happy just to read these simple hints without these don't touch the 240v.
-- Edited by grahamg on Saturday 4th of July 2015 07:29:37 PM
Hi Graham, I've taken some time to digest your comments regarding 240 volts. I'm a bit torn between agreeing with you and tHe others
Yes, we do talk about safety with mains voltage a lot and probably to monotonous regularity, however if you get a thump from the mains you will know exactly why we do this.
as an electrician and then a trade instructor and school teacher, I have seen so many people take a dont care attitude toward electricity and end up in deep trouble.
I am absolutely sure you work safely and would not be the type to have an electrical accident, however there are those that are absolute idiots when it comes to dealing with the 240 volts on their caravan. My suggestion to use the volt stick is an easy rather cheap way to pick up the presence of voltage, if we don't check, its just guess work and touch and see if you get a boot.
Cheers
03_Troopy said
10:34 AM Jul 20, 2015
Phil C wrote:
grahamg wrote:
Everytime someone asks a question or puts up a simple hint someone has to bring up the old don't touch the 240v slogan. Getting a bit tried of the same old comments. We are all getting gumpy old men. We should be happy just to read these simple hints without these don't touch the 240v.
-- Edited by grahamg on Saturday 4th of July 2015 07:29:37 PM
Hi Graham, I've taken some time to digest your comments regarding 240 volts. I'm a bit torn between agreeing with you and tHe others
Yes, we do talk about safety with mains voltage a lot and probably to monotonous regularity, however if you get a thump from the mains you will know exactly why we do this.
as an electrician and then a trade instructor and school teacher, I have seen so many people take a dont care attitude toward electricity and end up in deep trouble.
I am absolutely sure you work safely and would not be the type to have an electrical accident, however there are those that are absolute idiots when it comes to dealing with the 240 volts on their caravan. My suggestion to use the volt stick is an easy rather cheap way to pick up the presence of voltage, if we don't check, its just guess work and touch and see if you get a boot.
Cheers
Providing:
1) The volt stick works.
2) Providing the volt stick isn't being shielded by the external aluminium of the caravan.
GrahamG please don't read this post.
Phil C said
01:39 PM Jul 21, 2015
Agree troopy, thats why you should always test meters, voltsticks etc on a known working appliance.
Voltsticks will work through aluminium as ally has a relative permeability of zero, same as air. So it wont shield the magnetism needed to work the voltstick..
Cheers
03_Troopy said
04:37 PM Jul 21, 2015
Phil C wrote:
Agree troopy, thats why you should always test meters, voltsticks etc on a known working appliance.
Voltsticks will work through aluminium as ally has a relative permeability of zero, same as air. So it wont shield the magnetism needed to work the voltstick..
Cheers
Actually they work by capacitive coupling, but can be affected by magnetic fields too.
from a pdf file Powerlogic.com.au:
The voltage or more correctly the electric field produced by the voltage is measured using capacitive coupling. If you remember that a capacitor is two metallic plates separated by an insulator or dielectric, then you have the basis for understanding how proximity testers work. The live metallic component such as a live wire is the first plate and the other plate is inside the tester. The operator or person holding the tester also forms a direct circuit or by capacitive coupling to ground if isolated from ground e.g. by shoes or carpet. The sensing circuit of the tester then detects that there is a capacitive voltage and initiates a signal to show that there is voltage present. You can prove this by placing a proximity tester on an insulated table next to a live power cord or outlet. The tester will alarm while your holding it but will turn off when you remove your hand. Therefore, the proximity tester may not work if the operator is isolated from ground
also:
Proximity testers cannot work where the live wires being tested are shielded, such as in a metallic conduit or where the cable has a metallic shield. However, the tester will measure a voltage if the metallic conduit or cable screen is live.
You can test the latter by holding your voltage stick above a live extension lead at a point where it just registers, then slip a sheet of aluminium foil under it the volt stick, and you can see it is much less responsive.
Anyway, it's something I would never rely on to tell me it is safe to drill through a wall, but plenty of others do, and a few more used to lol
Phil C said
08:38 PM Jul 21, 2015
OK I was under the assumption that these worked on the magnetic field produced by a live conductor. If it's capacitive as you suggest, I would be very wrong indeed. Therefore I stand corrected, however as an indicator and indicator only its pretty handy
Cheers
03_Troopy said
08:16 AM Jul 22, 2015
Phil C wrote:
OK I was under the assumption that these worked on the magnetic field produced by a live conductor. If it's capacitive as you suggest, I would be very wrong indeed. Therefore I stand corrected, however as an indicator and indicator only its pretty handy
Cheers
Yep Phil, a very handy tool for tracing where power is running. As long as you work by the rule that; if it blinks, there IS power present. If it doesn't blink, there MAY not be power present, so further investigation is required.
Phil C said
11:23 AM Jul 22, 2015
100% troopy.
grahamg said
07:16 PM Jul 24, 2015
I say no more.
-- Edited by grahamg on Friday 24th of July 2015 07:56:03 PM
-- Edited by grahamg on Friday 24th of July 2015 07:56:31 PM
Santa said
07:56 PM Jul 24, 2015
grahamg wrote:
I Say no more, I could go on but what is the use! Again this post was about putting up a bracket and was hijacked again.
Seems to be par for the course Graham, very few threads finish up on the topic they started on, most stay on topic for a couple of posts then degenerate into personal asides i.e. hows Marge, my dog has fleas, the other favorites are electrical or battery related subjects.
03_Troopy said
11:32 AM Jul 25, 2015
It wasn't hijacked. One of the points brought up in the OP needed a bit of clarification. If you don't see why, then you are exactly the ones who needed it pointed out to you. But, never mind stick your head in the sand and everything will be fine.
Santa said
11:40 AM Jul 25, 2015
03_Troopy wrote:
It wasn't hijacked. One of the points brought up in the OP needed a bit of clarification. If you don't see why, then you are exactly the ones who needed it pointed out to you. But, never mind stick your head in the sand and everything will be fine.
Hijacked! well and truly.
03_Troopy said
11:45 AM Jul 25, 2015
Thank god for the Darwin theory I say..
Peterpan said
02:42 PM Jul 25, 2015
Apart from the electrical restrictions, I thought the idea of hanging stuff was a great one.
grahamg said
12:23 PM Jul 27, 2015
Troopy, I fine you comments rude, You have no idea of my technical knowledge and nowhere in my comments did I make any technical statements as far as I can see and comments such as yours
"But, never mind stick your head in the sand and everything will be fine" and "Thank god for the Darwin theory I say.." I find you have have gone to far.
hi all,
I was walking around Bunnings one day and saw some "broom clips" decided to put them on the side of the van to hang stuff. Be a bit careful when you screw into the side, there may be electrical cables, I'm lucky to have a volt stick to detect the voltage. This all works a treat. Of course the Dyson comes off when we travel.
Cheers
Cheers..
Just wondering if you used the voltage stick on the outside of the van, and if the van cladding is aluminium (it looks like it is)? Not trying to flame your post Phil, it's just that voltage sticks in the hands of the inexperienced (not yourself, but other readers) can cause a very, very dangerous false sense of security.
But the broom clips do look pretty handy.
Edited for spelling error
-- Edited by 03_Troopy on Saturday 27th of June 2015 02:28:44 PM
I watched as a supposedly qualified electrician tested for 240V with a multimeter on a fluro fitting he had just relocated that didn't work. He said: "Well there's the problem, no 240V!" I had a look and pointed out that he probably wouldn't measure it too well on the DC setting. Then I took my Fluke 87V back off him before he stuffed it up, and told him to use the el cheapo workshop meter.
I can't remember what the problem was with the light now though.
Cheers
Everytime someone asks a question or puts up a simple hint someone has to bring up the old don't touch the 240v slogan. Getting a bit tried of the same old comments. We are all getting gumpy old men. We should be happy just to read these simple hints without these don't touch the 240v.
-- Edited by grahamg on Saturday 4th of July 2015 07:29:37 PM
No worries mate, you go a fiddle with all the 240V stuff you like..
Actually it was a warning about relying on Voltage Sticks to give you the all clear for working on, or drilling through live wires.. And.,. if you don't understand the reason for the warning, I suggest you don't use one either.
Hmm but then again...
Sorry graham, please ignore the warning about relying on voltage sticks... you obviously know all about them already, and the attention I brought their use is of no use to you.
There, feel better now?
I could tell you, but apparently it has nothing to do with hanging stuff, so I can't...
Ask Graham what they are used for.
If in doubt DONT.
BTW I agree with Troopy, don't stuff around with stuff that can kill you.
Cheers
Hi Graham, I've taken some time to digest your comments regarding 240 volts. I'm a bit torn between agreeing with you and tHe others
Yes, we do talk about safety with mains voltage a lot and probably to monotonous regularity, however if you get a thump from the mains you will know exactly why we do this.
as an electrician and then a trade instructor and school teacher, I have seen so many people take a dont care attitude toward electricity and end up in deep trouble.
I am absolutely sure you work safely and would not be the type to have an electrical accident, however there are those that are absolute idiots when it comes to dealing with the 240 volts on their caravan. My suggestion to use the volt stick is an easy rather cheap way to pick up the presence of voltage, if we don't check, its just guess work and touch and see if you get a boot.
Cheers
Providing:
1) The volt stick works.
2) Providing the volt stick isn't being shielded by the external aluminium of the caravan.
GrahamG please don't read this post.
Voltsticks will work through aluminium as ally has a relative permeability of zero, same as air. So it wont shield the magnetism needed to work the voltstick..
Cheers
Actually they work by capacitive coupling, but can be affected by magnetic fields too.
from a pdf file Powerlogic.com.au:
also:
.
You can test the latter by holding your voltage stick above a live extension lead at a point where it just registers, then slip a sheet of aluminium foil under it the volt stick, and you can see it is much less responsive.
Anyway, it's something I would never rely on to tell me it is safe to drill through a wall, but plenty of others do, and a few more used to lol
Cheers
Yep Phil, a very handy tool for tracing where power is running. As long as you work by the rule that; if it blinks, there IS power present. If it doesn't blink, there MAY not be power present, so further investigation is required.
I say no more.
-- Edited by grahamg on Friday 24th of July 2015 07:56:03 PM
-- Edited by grahamg on Friday 24th of July 2015 07:56:31 PM
Seems to be par for the course Graham, very few threads finish up on the topic they started on, most stay on topic for a couple of posts then degenerate into personal asides i.e. hows Marge, my dog has fleas, the other favorites are electrical or battery related subjects.
It wasn't hijacked. One of the points brought up in the OP needed a bit of clarification. If you don't see why, then you are exactly the ones who needed it pointed out to you. But, never mind stick your head in the sand and everything will be fine.
Hijacked! well and truly.
Apart from the electrical restrictions, I thought the idea of hanging stuff was a great one.
"But, never mind stick your head in the sand and everything will be fine" and "Thank god for the Darwin theory I say.." I find you have have gone to far.
I will no be making any further comments
Fair comment.............