I have a Hitachi excavator that has a solenoid operated valve to make the digging equipment work when all safety switches are in the correct position.
It has a moving center pin that pushes on a spool that allows oil to flow to the controls..
The winding on the solenoid is burnt out and I need to replace it..
The OEM coil is $520 +GST + Freight..
Question 1. why do some coils make the armature pull in and others make it push out.
Question 2. what criteria would I need to know to use an after market coil apart from the inner bore of the coil.
The coil on the left in the photo is the faulty coil and the one on the right is one I have a loan of.
the new one pulls the armature in but I need one to push it out..
Any advice would be greatly appreciated..
It has been a marathon job firstly finding the solenoid (buried in the guts of the machine) and then finding a way to bypass it while I try to find one to do the job..
I have put a longer pin (armature) in to hold the shuttle open permanently and all is good for me but I would like to reinstate the safety feature of it not working untill all safety switches are in their correct position..
You could try Reversing the polarity to the solenoid & see if it will push rather than pull. What are the dimensions of the hole in the solenoid & length?
oldbobsbus said
06:03 PM Jun 3, 2014
The ID is 12mm the OD is 32mm and the length is 38mm..
I did try reversing the polarity without success....
I even tried turning it over but as the top ID is slightly smaller on the good coil it didn't really work very well....
I also have a feeling the new coil I have isn't strong enough but thats only a guess as it works the wrong way
-- Edited by oldbobsbus on Tuesday 3rd of June 2014 06:06:09 PM
PJK said
06:54 PM Jun 3, 2014
Bob,
the coils are rated according to the following specs -
1. Push or pull?? (I am not sure how they achieve that electrically, but assume it is to do with the winding.)
2. Voltage - 12 or 24 VDC for the excavator??
3. Watts - quite a spread as this varies according to the loads generated on the spool when hydraulic pressure is operating.
4. Physical size ID OD and length??
5. External casing material??
6. Connector type for the wiring??
7. Method of retaining the solenoid on the core?? Can be a nut, circlip, or 4 screws through the housing on some models.
With all the above variables, there are literally thousands of different solenoids used.
If there are any numbers or brand names, that would increase your chances.
If not on the solenoid, look on the valve itself.
If you do chance upon the correct replacement, it will most likely cost between $30 and $100, certainly not the rip off $500 you have been quoted.
I have worked in hydraulics (mostly marine) since the 1970's so might be able to determine a replacement with a photo of the valve, or any numbers off the valve. Can't do if just from the solenoid.
Regards
Peter
PJK
03_troopy said
07:22 PM Jun 3, 2014
Answer to Q1: the direction of movement of the valve piston/rod is determined by the direction of coil winding, ie clockwise or anticlockwise. So you'll need to use the new coil flipped over to achieve the opposite direction of thrust, which as you said isn't possible with the shape of the coil.
Answer to Q2: Apart from physical dimensions, You'll need to know the Duty Cycle of the valve/solenoid, ie Continuous or Intermittent (sounds like yours is continuous if the solenoid is powered up full time while machine is in use with safety interlocks made) Obviously the Voltage rating, and Wattage of the coil. Continuous Duty will be of a lower wattage than what you can get in an Intermittent Duty lower power=less heat. higher power=more heat for shorter time.
Actually Bob, there's a heap of info available via Google on solenoids.
Edit: oops.. looks like PJK already answered..
-- Edited by 03_troopy on Tuesday 3rd of June 2014 07:25:52 PM
oldbobsbus said
07:26 PM Jun 3, 2014
Hi Peter..
It is a 12v system and it is a ex33u 1999 machine.... the wattage is unknown..
the size I have given above..
the external material is like Bakelite but may not be..
the connections are not important as i can change either end to suit
the old coil had an outer cover that held it in place but again I am happy to hold it inplace with a zip tie or tape as there is no load on the coil..
the OEM part number is 0685606...
oldbobsbus said
07:33 PM Jun 3, 2014
I will photocopy some of the pages out of the workshop manual that show the solenoid and it's function
and post them in the morning when I have access to a copier..
valiant81 said
07:40 PM Jun 3, 2014
Hi;
Have you tryed taking the coil wire assembly to a motor rewinder premisses. They could remove the old wire, check the wire size and replace the winding with new wire. It may cost a couple of $$, but would be a lot cheaper than a replacement. Most likely removing the old wire and winding on new wire would not be a problem, and would most likely done on a lathe.Some thing to think about.
-- Edited by valiant81 on Tuesday 3rd of June 2014 07:41:40 PM
oldbobsbus said
07:46 PM Jun 3, 2014
valiant81 wrote:
Hi;
Have you tryed taking the coil wire assembly to a motor rewinder premisses. They could remove the old wire, check the wire size and replace the winding with new wire. It may cost a couple of $$, but would be a lot cheaper than a replacement. Most likely removing the old wire and winding on new wire would not be a problem, and would most likely done on a lathe.Some thing to think about.
-- Edited by valiant81 on Tuesday 3rd of June 2014 07:41:40 PM
We don't have a motor rewinder in Grafton we are only a country hick town but do have a MacDonalds and a KFC...lol
As you can see by the pic it is a fully sealed unit..
oldtrack123 said
09:24 PM Jun 3, 2014
HI Bob
Now that the old coil is stuffed it is near imposible to obtain any info from it regarding its power[watts]
If it could be dismantled then as suggested a rewind could be the way to g,o but one would need to get the wire dia, strip off the old winding & THEN REWIND UNTIL FULL TO THE SAME LEVEL AS THE OLS WINDING
Without seeing the full assembly I cannot offer any comment on the pull in -pull out problem
But it does not matter which way the Coil is wound as changing the feeds around does simply correct that!
but again that will only have an effect if the piston rod is a permanent magnet
If a nonmagenetised piston it will simply attempt to pull into the coil
what can effect the direction of pull is the actual location of the piston in the coil in the unpowered position
It will either try to centralise itself or if the coil has a steel end piece on the top of the tube pull up to that.
If you can post some pics of the actual piston & actuator we may be able to see why that is not so.
Other than that, any 12V coil that is phsically near the same size ,in all aspects, & is continuosly rated should be ok .
PeterQ
Baz421 said
09:25 PM Jun 3, 2014
Hi Bob
you may be able to buy from overseas if you can't get it rewound (assuming it is rewindable that is).
found these sites, some have tech diag to ensure it's the same valve body (I hope)
Hi Baz, you are a better searcher than me they are all the correct solenoid and thats the body they fit into mate...
Now all I have to do is find out if I can get a price and buy one IF it isn't to expensive an help in that direction would also be appreciated..
PeterQ. Thanks for the extra details on why it pushes the pin out..
Also thanks to everyone that has tried to help, I said to a mate that came to help get to the bottom of the problem and then get it going by making a longer pin to make it work without the solenoid working that I would ask for help on this forum... he laughed and said good luck.... not knowing we have lots of experience between us all and sure enough the answer has been found and the mystery of solenoids explained..
oldbobsbus said
07:39 AM Jun 4, 2014
This is a page out of the service manual showing the solenoid and it's function...
Also a photo of the tiny pin that does the moving inside the tube (now back in place on the valve block with a longer pin in it) that the solenoid fits over..
This is only a guess Bob. For the solenoid to push a pin, the armature is probably similar as ive drawn it. If this is so then all you need to find is a solenoid of the same dimensions & it should work.
This is only a guess Bob. For the solenoid to push a pin, the armature is probably similar as ive drawn it. If this is so then all you need to find is a solenoid of the same dimensions & it should work.
HI
Yes, DeBe
That illustrates a plunger that will pull DOWN into the coil & will not be polarity sensitive..
AS can be seen the actual plunger is above the windings & will just attempt to centralise itself within the COIL length
That is a special arrangement & most off the shelf solenoid will not be designed that way
Bob , from the pic you show, it seems the pin is much smaller thah the coil ID
, I think you will find the the actual plunger is still inside the coil .
AT the very top, would be it's normal open position
If you can get it out & it is the same clearance od with the new coil , it may work Ok
Actually any soft iron round steel could still work.[soften by heating to red hot, then slooooDwly cool]D
Depends on how much you want to experiment
PeterQ
Remembering that all selonoids work on the same principle, the plunger will be pulled into the centre of the coil, .that does not matter what polarity the source or if it is AC or DC
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 4th of June 2014 10:45:54 AM
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 4th of June 2014 11:03:39 AM
DeBe said
11:55 AM Jun 4, 2014
Also notice the borrowed coil is a closed frame, this will act differently to the original open coil.
PJK said
02:15 PM Jun 4, 2014
oldbobsbus wrote:
Hi Peter..
It is a 12v system and it is a ex33u 1999 machine.... the wattage is unknown..
the size I have given above..
the external material is like Bakelite but may not be..
the connections are not important as i can change either end to suit
the old coil had an outer cover that held it in place but again I am happy to hold it inplace with a zip tie or tape as there is no load on the coil..
the OEM part number is 0685606...
Hi Bob,
well the level of help offered has been great, and very informative. Thanks to PeterQ and Debe, I now know why some solenoids push, and others pull. The excellent search done by Baz has given some leads on getting a new solenoid through the OEM number system.
If you can buy it direct from overseas and wait a week for it to arrive, the price should be about 1/3 what you have been quoted. In the hydraulics industry standard markups on imported goods is around 300 - 400%. Highway robbery, but if they all do it, and you want the item, you have very little choice.
I was going to try and get to the actual manufacturer of the valve, because the valves, pumps, etc, used on this type of machinery are normally made by specialist hydraulic manufacturers such as Bosch Rexroth, Linde, Eaton etc.
If you would still like for me to do that, I would need any numbers off the valve block, and would then follow up with valve suppliers such as Sun, Sterling, Oil Control, etc.
Wish I was there. With the valve in my hands I could take enough measurements to order a new one off the shelf in Australia.
Let me know how you get on.
Peter K.
oldbobsbus said
05:20 PM Jun 4, 2014
Hi Peter K.
You are 100% correct the help received from the GN members is over whelming and I really appreciate it, also thanks for your kind offer but short of pulling the whole assembly out I cant see any thing on it
I now have a couple more pix if the valve block and where it is and have had a super close look but as far as I can see there are no identifying marks on it..
I have put the new solenoid over the tube that contains the actuating pin and it fits both ways so as soon as I can afford to stop the machine for a whole day (Fri or Sat) I will pull the temporary pin out of it and fit the original pin..
Here are the pix I took today..
I have send a request away to one of the companies in the links that Baz supplied and am still waiting for a reply..
-- Edited by oldbobsbus on Wednesday 4th of June 2014 05:22:11 PM
Bob, the mounting flange arrangement is rather unique.
I will see what I can find with that type of mounting.
Keep going with your enquiries as well and we will see what happens.
Peter K
oldbobsbus said
07:51 PM Jun 4, 2014
Thanks Peter..
Baz421 said
08:49 PM Jun 4, 2014
PJK wrote:
Bob, the mounting flange arrangement is rather unique. I will see what I can find with that type of mounting.
Keep going with your enquiries as well and we will see what happens.
Peter K
Hey Peter
seeing you are in the industry there may be another way to tackle this. There are MANY MANY Chinese manufacturing companies n the web that only manufacture solenoids BUT they must number their own products separately, as I couldn't cross reference the OEM part number to any they make.
maybe you have access to some cross referencing info??? Just a thought.
Cheers Baz
Baz421 said
09:55 PM Jun 4, 2014
Bob Oz company wrecking Hitachi's,,, maybe they can help or know someone who can.
Hi Baz, I have been intouch with Excavator Parts and they claim they don't have the part but can get me the OEM part this also goes for Tilleys in Toowoomba who claim the machine is stripped down to the metal and there is nothing left of it I think I have contacted every excavator wrecker in Oz and no one has the part we need..
I am now still waiting for a reply from the mob you gave me the link to on Wed evening..
I will get it back in the workshop later today or tomorra (Fri) and try the solenoid I have otherwise it looks like the long pin goes back into it..
Thanks everyone for all you help.. anytime you are passing this way feel free to drop in for a day or so as we have plenty of room here on the farm..
oldtrack123 said
09:59 AM Jun 5, 2014
HI Bob
Looking at your last pics ,it seems you still have a smilar soloniod on the unit
Can you check the resistance of that coil & compare it to the new one?
If it is near the same, that is a fair indication of being the same power.
The other thing is are they the same length?
When I looked at you first set of pics I thought the lump on the top of the original was part of the coil assemby ,I now see it actually an extension of the actuator sealed assembly.
If your replacement is longer than the oriiginal , the action on the plunger will not be the same , remember what I said about the plunger centralising in the selonoid
Equaly so if it is shorter you may have to raise the coil to get correct operation for max pull
MAX pull or push is obtained just in the last few millimetres of travel[to the centre
I would expect the actual movement of the pin would be relatively short ?
PeterQ
DeBe said
11:45 AM Jun 5, 2014
This is a long shot if you get desperate. Photo of a 12V , 12Watt Solenoid of a car LPG converter. Its 41mm long 35mm dia OD, 13.3mm hole in the middle. The brass sleeve could be machined to give 12mm inside diam. If you get desperate I could post it to you to try.
WoooooooHoooooooo, as it is a bit cold and overcast here today I decided to bring the machine into the workshop and have a go at fitting the new solenoid...
I put it on upside down and connected it up to the plug and WooooHoooo it worked perfectly first try so apart from giving it a days work to test the coils ability to stay stimulated for a prolonged time all is now good...
As you can see I have zip tied it in place and sealed the plug connection with silicone in such a manner as to be able to pull it apart later if need be without damaging the wires..
A couple of pix of the new unit in place and one showing where it is and also one with all the covers in place which is why it was sooo friggen hard to find in the first place..
Again a BIG THANK YOU to everyone that helped and as I said before if any of you are up here near Grafton feel free to drop in and have a yarn for a day or so as there is plenty of room here on the farm..
My phone number can be found on the Country Music website below if ya want to call and say G'Day anytime..
I have a Hitachi excavator that has a solenoid operated valve to make the digging equipment work when all safety switches are in the correct position.
It has a moving center pin that pushes on a spool that allows oil to flow to the controls..
The winding on the solenoid is burnt out and I need to replace it..
The OEM coil is $520 +GST + Freight..
Question 1. why do some coils make the armature pull in and others make it push out.
Question 2. what criteria would I need to know to use an after market coil apart from the inner bore of the coil.
The coil on the left in the photo is the faulty coil and the one on the right is one I have a loan of.
the new one pulls the armature in but I need one to push it out..
Any advice would be greatly appreciated
..
It has been a marathon job firstly finding the solenoid (buried in the guts of the machine) and then finding a way to bypass it while I try to find one to do the job..
I have put a longer pin (armature) in to hold the shuttle open permanently and all is good for me but I would like to reinstate the safety feature of it not working untill all safety switches are in their correct position..
You could try Reversing the polarity to the solenoid & see if it will push rather than pull. What are the dimensions of the hole in the solenoid & length?
The ID is 12mm the OD is 32mm and the length is 38mm..
I did try reversing the polarity without success....
I even tried turning it over but as the top ID is slightly smaller on the good coil it didn't really work very well....
I also have a feeling the new coil I have isn't strong enough but thats only a guess as it works the wrong way
-- Edited by oldbobsbus on Tuesday 3rd of June 2014 06:06:09 PM
the coils are rated according to the following specs -
1. Push or pull?? (I am not sure how they achieve that electrically, but assume it is to do with the winding.)
2. Voltage - 12 or 24 VDC for the excavator??
3. Watts - quite a spread as this varies according to the loads generated on the spool when hydraulic pressure is operating.
4. Physical size ID OD and length??
5. External casing material??
6. Connector type for the wiring??
7. Method of retaining the solenoid on the core?? Can be a nut, circlip, or 4 screws through the housing on some models.
With all the above variables, there are literally thousands of different solenoids used.
If there are any numbers or brand names, that would increase your chances.
If not on the solenoid, look on the valve itself.
If you do chance upon the correct replacement, it will most likely cost between $30 and $100, certainly not the rip off $500 you have been quoted.
I have worked in hydraulics (mostly marine) since the 1970's so might be able to determine a replacement with a photo of the valve, or any numbers off the valve. Can't do if just from the solenoid.
Regards
Peter
PJK
Answer to Q1: the direction of movement of the valve piston/rod is determined by the direction of coil winding, ie clockwise or anticlockwise. So you'll need to use the new coil flipped over to achieve the opposite direction of thrust, which as you said isn't possible with the shape of the coil.
Answer to Q2: Apart from physical dimensions, You'll need to know the Duty Cycle of the valve/solenoid, ie Continuous or Intermittent (sounds like yours is continuous if the solenoid is powered up full time while machine is in use with safety interlocks made) Obviously the Voltage rating, and Wattage of the coil. Continuous Duty will be of a lower wattage than what you can get in an Intermittent Duty lower power=less heat. higher power=more heat for shorter time.
Actually Bob, there's a heap of info available via Google on solenoids.
Edit: oops.. looks like PJK already answered..
-- Edited by 03_troopy on Tuesday 3rd of June 2014 07:25:52 PM
Hi Peter..
It is a 12v system and it is a ex33u 1999 machine.... the wattage is unknown..
the size I have given above..
the external material is like Bakelite but may not be..
the connections are not important as i can change either end to suit
the old coil had an outer cover that held it in place but again I am happy to hold it inplace with a zip tie or tape as there is no load on the coil..
the OEM part number is 0685606...
I will photocopy some of the pages out of the workshop manual that show the solenoid and it's function
and post them in the morning when I have access to a copier..
Hi;
Have you tryed taking the coil wire assembly to a motor rewinder premisses. They could remove the old wire, check the wire size and replace the winding with new wire. It may cost a couple of $$, but would be a lot cheaper than a replacement. Most likely removing the old wire and winding on new wire would not be a problem, and would most likely done on a lathe.Some thing to think about.
-- Edited by valiant81 on Tuesday 3rd of June 2014 07:41:40 PM
We don't have a motor rewinder in Grafton we are only a country hick town but do have a MacDonalds and a KFC...lol
As you can see by the pic it is a fully sealed unit..
HI Bob
Now that the old coil is stuffed it is near imposible to obtain any info from it regarding its power[watts]
If it could be dismantled then as suggested a rewind could be the way to g,o but one would need to get the wire dia, strip off the old winding & THEN REWIND UNTIL FULL TO THE SAME LEVEL AS THE OLS WINDING
Without seeing the full assembly I cannot offer any comment on the pull in -pull out problem
But it does not matter which way the Coil is wound as changing the feeds around does simply correct that!
but again that will only have an effect if the piston rod is a permanent magnet
If a nonmagenetised piston it will simply attempt to pull into the coil
what can effect the direction of pull is the actual location of the piston in the coil in the unpowered position
It will either try to centralise itself or if the coil has a steel end piece on the top of the tube pull up to that.
If you can post some pics of the actual piston & actuator we may be able to see why that is not so.
Other than that, any 12V coil that is phsically near the same size ,in all aspects, & is continuosly rated should be ok .
PeterQ
Hi Bob
you may be able to buy from overseas if you can't get it rewound (assuming it is rewindable that is).
found these sites, some have tech diag to ensure it's the same valve body (I hope)
http://777parts.net/johndeere/0685606-solenoid/p179548.html
http://en.technikexpert.com/HITACHI-0685606-SOLENOID_detail_1949343.html
http://cn.777parts.net/hitachi/0685606-SOLENOID/p8431.html
might be useful
Cheers Baz
Hi Baz, you are a better searcher than me they are all the correct solenoid and thats the body they fit into mate...
Now all I have to do is find out if I can get a price and buy one IF it isn't to expensive an help in that direction would also be appreciated..
PeterQ. Thanks for the extra details on why it pushes the pin out..
Also thanks to everyone that has tried to help, I said to a mate that came to help get to the bottom of the problem and then get it going by making a longer pin to make it work without the solenoid working that I would ask for help on this forum... he laughed and said good luck.... not knowing we have lots of experience between us all and sure enough the answer has been found and the mystery of solenoids explained..
This is a page out of the service manual showing the solenoid and it's function...
Also a photo of the tiny pin that does the moving inside the tube (now back in place on the valve block with a longer pin in it) that the solenoid fits over..
The Grey Nomad Team to the rescue again.
Hope it all works in your favour Bob.
This is only a guess Bob. For the solenoid to push a pin, the armature is probably similar as ive drawn it. If this is so then all you need to find is a solenoid of the same dimensions & it should work.
HI
Yes, DeBe
That illustrates a plunger that will pull DOWN into the coil & will not be polarity sensitive..
AS can be seen the actual plunger is above the windings & will just attempt to centralise itself within the COIL length
That is a special arrangement & most off the shelf solenoid will not be designed that way
Bob , from the pic you show, it seems the pin is much smaller thah the coil ID
, I think you will find the the actual plunger is still inside the coil .
AT the very top, would be it's normal open position
If you can get it out & it is the same clearance od with the new coil , it may work Ok
Actually any soft iron round steel could still work.[soften by heating to red hot, then slooooDwly cool]D
Depends on how much you want to experiment
PeterQ
Remembering that all selonoids work on the same principle, the plunger will be pulled into the centre of the coil, .that does not matter what polarity the source or if it is AC or DC
PeterQ
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 4th of June 2014 10:45:54 AM
-- Edited by oldtrack123 on Wednesday 4th of June 2014 11:03:39 AM
Also notice the borrowed coil is a closed frame, this will act differently to the original open coil.
Hi Bob,
well the level of help offered has been great, and very informative. Thanks to PeterQ and Debe, I now know why some solenoids push, and others pull. The excellent search done by Baz has given some leads on getting a new solenoid through the OEM number system.
If you can buy it direct from overseas and wait a week for it to arrive, the price should be about 1/3 what you have been quoted. In the hydraulics industry standard markups on imported goods is around 300 - 400%. Highway robbery, but if they all do it, and you want the item, you have very little choice.
I was going to try and get to the actual manufacturer of the valve, because the valves, pumps, etc, used on this type of machinery are normally made by specialist hydraulic manufacturers such as Bosch Rexroth, Linde, Eaton etc.
If you would still like for me to do that, I would need any numbers off the valve block, and would then follow up with valve suppliers such as Sun, Sterling, Oil Control, etc.
Wish I was there. With the valve in my hands I could take enough measurements to order a new one off the shelf in Australia.
Let me know how you get on.
Peter K.
Hi Peter K.
You are 100% correct the help received from the GN members is over whelming and I really appreciate it, also thanks for your kind offer but short of pulling the whole assembly out I cant see any thing on it
I now have a couple more pix if the valve block and where it is and have had a super close look but as far as I can see there are no identifying marks on it..
I have put the new solenoid over the tube that contains the actuating pin and it fits both ways so as soon as I can afford to stop the machine for a whole day (Fri or Sat) I will pull the temporary pin out of it and fit the original pin..
Here are the pix I took today..
I have send a request away to one of the companies in the links that Baz supplied and am still waiting for a reply..
-- Edited by oldbobsbus on Wednesday 4th of June 2014 05:22:11 PM
I will see what I can find with that type of mounting.
Keep going with your enquiries as well and we will see what happens.
Peter K
Thanks Peter..
Hey Peter
seeing you are in the industry there may be another way to tackle this. There are MANY MANY Chinese manufacturing companies n the web that only manufacture solenoids BUT they must number their own products separately, as I couldn't cross reference the OEM part number to any they make.
maybe you have access to some cross referencing info??? Just a thought.
Cheers Baz
Bob Oz company wrecking Hitachi's,,, maybe they can help or know someone who can.
http://excavatorparts.com.au/category/hitachi/parts-hitachi/
plus just found another USA based may be useful
http://ihmusedparts.com/hitachi-parts/
-- Edited by Baz421 on Wednesday 4th of June 2014 10:12:48 PM
Bob at the wreckers in Oz
http://www.marketbook.com.au/listingsdetail/detail.aspx?OHID=10012203&LP=MAT
the above was found here, some in Oz some overseas
http://www.machinerytrader.com/list/partssearch.aspx?Manu=HITACHI
Hi Baz, I have been intouch with Excavator Parts and they claim they don't have the part but can get me the OEM part this also goes for Tilleys in Toowoomba who claim the machine is stripped down to the metal and there is nothing left of it
I think I have contacted every excavator wrecker in Oz and no one has the part we need..
I am now still waiting for a reply from the mob you gave me the link to on Wed evening..
I will get it back in the workshop later today or tomorra (Fri) and try the solenoid I have otherwise it looks like the long pin goes back into it..
Thanks everyone for all you help.. anytime you are passing this way feel free to drop in for a day or so as we have plenty of room here on the farm..
HI Bob
Looking at your last pics ,it seems you still have a smilar soloniod on the unit
Can you check the resistance of that coil & compare it to the new one?
If it is near the same, that is a fair indication of being the same power.
The other thing is are they the same length?
When I looked at you first set of pics I thought the lump on the top of the original was part of the coil assemby ,I now see it actually an extension of the actuator sealed assembly.
If your replacement is longer than the oriiginal , the action on the plunger will not be the same , remember what I said about the plunger centralising in the selonoid
Equaly so if it is shorter you may have to raise the coil to get correct operation for max pull
MAX pull or push is obtained just in the last few millimetres of travel[to the centre
I would expect the actual movement of the pin would be relatively short ?
PeterQ
This is a long shot if you get desperate. Photo of a 12V , 12Watt Solenoid of a car LPG converter. Its 41mm long 35mm dia OD, 13.3mm hole in the middle. The brass sleeve could be machined to give 12mm inside diam. If you get desperate I could post it to you to try.
WoooooooHoooooooo, as it is a bit cold and overcast here today I decided to bring the machine into the workshop and have a go at fitting the new solenoid...
I put it on upside down and connected it up to the plug and WooooHoooo it worked perfectly first try so apart from giving it a days work to test the coils ability to stay stimulated for a prolonged time all is now good...
As you can see I have zip tied it in place and sealed the plug connection with silicone in such a manner as to be able to pull it apart later if need be without damaging the wires..
A couple of pix of the new unit in place and one showing where it is and also one with all the covers in place which is why it was sooo friggen hard to find in the first place..
Again a BIG THANK YOU to everyone that helped and as I said before if any of you are up here near Grafton feel free to drop in and have a yarn for a day or so as there is plenty of room here on the farm..
My phone number can be found on the Country Music website below if ya want to call and say G'Day anytime..
Good to see you have a winner.
I had thought of giving one of those solenoids a try DeBe, because I would have a few of them in the boxes of old Auto Gas bits...
Thanks heaps for your help..Bob
