We are considering purchasing a new "semi off road" caravan. I am seeking info on whether members consider a grey water tank essential. The van we are thinking of offers it as an option.
I would greatly appreciate some feedback please.
Cheers
David.
Keith19837 said
07:25 PM Nov 5, 2013
Davemate wrote:
We are considering purchasing a new "semi off road" caravan. I am seeking info on whether members consider a grey water tank essential. The van we are thinking of offers it as an option.
I would greatly appreciate some feedback please.
Cheers
David.
G'day David, my MH came with one fitted. Advantages: I find it to be handy to stop 'soggy' areas around the MH when free camping. I then empty when I get to an appropriate drain point. I don't have to worry about pipes and connections at each stop.
However if you're parked somewhere that has natural or man made drainage there's no problem, or possibly a large bucket/old fashioned Boy Scout 'wet pit' would do.
Disadvantages: The tank up a certain amount of room that could be used for other storage/slide outs or whatever. I'm carrying extra weight between stops until I can empty out. Extra fuel consumption etc.
Overall: I wouldn't spend the extra to have one fitted thus saving a bit of money, some room and fuel consumption.
For what it's worth.
Old Crofter said
07:39 PM Nov 5, 2013
If you have shower etc all in then get it, try as much as possible to get everything so you can get a "self containment certificate" for when they come in, Will assist you in the future for regulated freedom camping.
my opinion only
Bob
Keith19837 said
07:52 PM Nov 5, 2013
Old Crofter wrote:
If you have shower etc all in then get it, try as much as possible to get everything so you can get a "self containment certificate" for when they come in, Will assist you in the future for regulated freedom camping.
my opinion only
Bob
G'day Old Crofter. I'm unaware of a Self containment certificate. Is this an Australia wide reg or in certain states only?
Old Crofter said
08:31 PM Nov 5, 2013
Hi Keith, as I said in "my opinion", I have noticed on threads on GN and other places that self containment is starting to get some airplay with councils and regulatory bodies, as well as caravan and motor home clubs.
Up on the Murray, Renmarks and other camps there are signs up "self contained motorhomes only" this has caused some angst among the caravan fraternity and rightly so, but the stratagy was I think on self containment. With more and more caravans now being with showers toilets etc I believe that it will change and the containment principle will be applied.
"Fully self contained" has also been a catch cry by some of the lobby groups that are fighting against the caravan park lobby group who are hell bent on getting our free camping areas shut down, my view is that if you are self contained, you will have a greater chance of keeping the freedom of free and low cost camps.
I am not aware of any authority that is certifying, rather there are programs that have been regognised by some councils such as "Leave no Trace"etc.
Bob
Peter_n_Margaret said
09:41 PM Nov 5, 2013
In many places it is not appropriate to dump grey water on the ground for ecological reasons.
In other places the 'controller' of the land will not allow it.
If you have a grey water tank, you have the choice.
My strong advise is to fit one. It is easier to do that now rather than later.
I fitted my own 70L tank. It cost less than $100.
Cheers,
Peter
Baz421 said
09:43 PM Nov 5, 2013
Davemate wrote:
We are considering purchasing a new "semi off road" caravan. I am seeking info on whether members consider a grey water tank essential. The van we are thinking of offers it as an option.
I would greatly appreciate some feedback please.
Cheers
David.
Essential if you want 100% freedom these days,,, ours was fitted in 2007 and has well and truly paid its way.
Heaps of people at Theresa Ck dam near Clermont QLD, now have to carry grey water to dump point in buckets as you can't just "dump" and forget it.
Raveshoe Railway Camp has grey water dump point also.
Others are following,, so if you have the option go for it.
Keith19837 said
03:15 AM Nov 6, 2013
Old Crofter wrote:
Hi Keith, as I said in "my opinion", I have noticed on threads on GN and other places that self containment is starting to get some airplay with councils and regulatory bodies, as well as caravan and motor home clubs.
Up on the Murray, Renmarks and other camps there are signs up "self contained motorhomes only" this has caused some angst among the caravan fraternity and rightly so, but the stratagy was I think on self containment. With more and more caravans now being with showers toilets etc I believe that it will change and the containment principle will be applied.
"Fully self contained" has also been a catch cry by some of the lobby groups that are fighting against the caravan park lobby group who are hell bent on getting our free camping areas shut down, my view is that if you are self contained, you will have a greater chance of keeping the freedom of free and low cost camps.
I am not aware of any authority that is certifying, rather there are programs that have been regognised by some councils such as "Leave no Trace"etc.
Bob
Thanks for that Bob (and others). I wasn't aware that this was becoming an issue. Turns out I'm lucky to have a grey water tank already fitted. I suppose it's only a matter of time before it happened. I know on Lake Eildon (Vic) you must have fully self contained tanks or have your bunks 'sealed' in your boat/houseboat.
Meredith said
07:26 AM Nov 6, 2013
We don't have a grey water tank and have managed ok without one, BUT if I was ordering a new van now I would definitely get one. I see it as something that will be asked for more and more in the future.
oldbobsbus said
02:50 PM Nov 6, 2013
We have one fitted but always have it draining to ground and infact have been encouraged to do so by most places we stay as it helps to keep the dust down and encourages grass growth.
As for fully self contained certificates I have never heard of them and I would be surprised if they were anything more than an idea promoted by someone with a vested interest in the industry..
So in the meantime I intend to drain to ground ...
As others have said I feel the future will be to take everything out that you brought in and that includes grey and black water. It is happening now with Camps requiring Self Containment only eg Cooktown, Loxton Motorhome Park, Kalgoorlie, Blackall, Charlton etc. What we must remember is if we disobey the self contained signage then next time there maybe no campsite there. The breaking of said rules is just giving the parties wanting to close such sites the necessary ammunition.
If it was me I would be fitting one as it will be the way of the future - already is in NZ and over there you have to have your Rig officially certified and labelled accordingly and no way can you get to camp where certification is required if you are not fully compliant. It will come here whether we like it or not is my honest opinion.
Ontos45 said
05:37 PM Nov 6, 2013
I have a little chuckle when I read that having a grey water tank adds weight and adds to fuel consumption!
You are only carrying the weight you started with in your general water tank and/or drinking water tank. You don't fill these tanks until you empty waste tank....so no extra weight. Get a water level guage to monitor tank level.
Get the waste tank Davemate.
Peter
gypsynolmate said
05:45 PM Nov 6, 2013
I agree with Lorries, it will happen eventually. We camped on a Lake Elphinston Qld. CAW6 No. 82. earlier in the year, beautiful spot.
The Dump Point is at Glendon a good 30kl away, we observed travellers take their cassette and were gone for about 10-15mins. So where did they
dump????????????It takes longer than that fora a return trip to Glendon. So I do support Fully Self Contained. Stay as long as you can Contain, your black & grey
water. As a matter a fact our next door neighbours at the camp, had a go at one of the caravanners about it.
Keith19837 said
07:06 PM Nov 6, 2013
Ontos45 wrote:
I have a little chuckle when I read that having a grey water tank adds weight and adds to fuel consumption! You are only carrying the weight you started with in your general water tank and/or drinking water tank. You don't fill these tanks until you empty waste tank....so no extra weight. Get a water level guage to monitor tank level. Get the waste tank Davemate.
Peter
G'day Peter, you're right, you do start with the weight. However if you're reducing it as it's used; the fuel consumption decreases, the same as the fuel tank getting emptier as you go the economy increases.
Lorries said
07:18 PM Nov 6, 2013
I quite often have more "water weight" on board than my fresh water tank capacity. It is easy sometimes to leave a campsite with grey water tank full and partly used fresh water tank, then top up with fresh before you leave town or campsite and dump the grey water where it is permitted in either a dump point or acceptable area (eg gravel pit). I would then have more on board than just my fresh tank capacity.
Ontos45 said
01:16 AM Nov 7, 2013
Lorries wrote:
I quite often have more "water weight" on board than my fresh water tank capacity. It is easy sometimes to leave a campsite with grey water tank full and partly used fresh water tank, then top up with fresh before you leave town or campsite and dump the grey water where it is permitted in either a dump point or acceptable area (eg gravel pit). I would then have more on board than just my fresh tank capacity.
Then your too close to your ATM. Leave at least 10% below for these occasions. Get used to it, we all will have to be self contained soon as out-lined above and in Far North Queensland the scalies are now pulling MH and vans over and weighing them. It may be a right royal pain to do some maths before departure but better than being put off the road for over-weight. We had no problem filling water tanks in the outback of Qld. even for a gold coin donation to the RFD. Forget your showers and have a "pommy bath" if weight critical.
Peter
pawsoz said
01:56 AM Nov 7, 2013
Hi!
If you intend to do some independant camping I would strongly suggest you do eitherr tank fitted or carry at least a 20ltr lidded container to save and hold your grey water or you may find yourself a bit limited in where you can stay.
I think there will be more and more campsites displaying the 'self contained vehicles only' signs, that does include grey water.
Annie
rosco532 said
02:22 AM Nov 7, 2013
I had a friend back in NZ convert his grey water tank to be the water sorce for his toilet...Worked a treat
Cheers
Renfrew said
02:31 AM Nov 7, 2013
Evening All,
Think I lost my earlier reply.
Since 2005 we have used, when bush camping, a Roll Tank, 65 litre capacity, fits under caravan, insert drainage outlet. To dispose roll to 4wd, load, drive to nearby dump point or dispose by burying. QED. Don't need to move the van, compact & can leave at home when caravan park camping. Handy to easily move rinse water from laundry around the garden. Second unit is ideal when bush camping to transport clean water from rivers & streams to replenish onboard water tank. Wouldn't be with out them. Easy to store & carry.
Self Contained? YES & member of the real Leave No Trace Australia an international organisation.
I quite often have more "water weight" on board than my fresh water tank capacity. It is easy sometimes to leave a campsite with grey water tank full and partly used fresh water tank, then top up with fresh before you leave town or campsite and dump the grey water where it is permitted in either a dump point or acceptable area (eg gravel pit). I would then have more on board than just my fresh tank capacity.
Then your too close to your ATM. Leave at least 10% below for these occasions. Get used to it, we all will have to be self contained soon as out-lined above and in Far North Queensland the scalies are now pulling MH and vans over and weighing them. It may be a right royal pain to do some maths before departure but better than being put off the road for over-weight. We had no problem filling water tanks in the outback of Qld. even for a gold coin donation to the RFD. Forget your showers and have a "pommy bath" if weight critical.
Peter
Excuse me, but how do you arrive at that statement! You know nothing about my rig and what it weighs and what is in it - I am not in a caravan and only me in the rig - You don't know what my rig weight is and I do - do you know if I have upgraded the rig to the next level which it is able to handle? I would appreciate you know the facts before you make such statements - Lorraine
Ontos45 said
06:06 PM Nov 7, 2013
Try not to take too personally replies Lorries. This is encourage people to carry all waste with them. By the way, most MH are built close to their ATMs, nature of the beast.
Peter
oldbobsbus said
07:06 PM Nov 7, 2013
Ontos45 wrote:
Try not to take too personally replies Lorries. This is encourage people to carry all waste with them. By the way, most MH are built close to their ATMs, nature of the beast.
Peter
Gee you make some wild statements Peter !!!!!
How would you know what the GVM of any MH is let alone MOST Motorhomes ????
I have a MH and my GVM is 9.800 but my on road weight is only 7000 and it is my experience that MOST motorhomes have much the same leeway..
On the other hand MOST caravans only have around 350 to 450kg tollerance for everything the owner wants to put in it after it leaves the showroom..
Collyn Rivers has a article on this very subject in the Nov 2013 (Current) issue of The Wanderer.
Ontos45 said
09:14 AM Nov 8, 2013
oldbobsbus wrote:
Ontos45 wrote:
Try not to take too personally replies Lorries. This is encourage people to carry all waste with them. By the way, most MH are built close to their ATMs, nature of the beast.
Peter
Gee you make some wild statements Peter !!!!!
How would you know what the GVM of any MH is let alone MOST Motorhomes ????
I have a MH and my GVM is 9.800 but my on road weight is only 7000 and it is my experience that MOST motorhomes have much the same leeway..
On the other hand MOST caravans only have around 350 to 450kg tollerance for everything the owner wants to put in it after it leaves the showroom..
Collyn Rivers has a article on this very subject in the Nov 2013 (Current) issue of The Wanderer.
Mate, I looked into this when deciding if to stay with a c'van or move to a MH. Unless most MH magazine writers are not doing their job, even they state most MH are built to certain weight limit and most are on the upper limit, same as you say, some c'vans are. The more so now as every thing the designer can think of is jammed into it, big fridges, aircon's etc. The whole shooting match is held up by your tyres and loose 1 and things change. Duel rear wheel MH have the problem of getting stones between the tyres and rubbing both tyres out. Not just my opinion but read Caravan and Motor Home etc. Our new/2nd hand van will weigh around 2.5T with independent dual suspension rated 3T to allow for punches and off-road use.
By the way, Collyn Rivers is not the only expert out there, he started in electronics not MH/c'van design.
Peter
PS. My last on this.
-- Edited by Ontos45 on Friday 8th of November 2013 09:17:54 AM
Davemate said
04:58 AM Nov 12, 2013
Thanks everyone for your very informative responses. I think I will give very serious consideration to the Fiamma 40 lt roll tank. Portability and price are the two main advantages for me.
Cheers
David.
brian said
05:50 AM Nov 12, 2013
I haven't been following this thread, but I wonder at the ability of a lot of us to safely lift a 40 litre container (40+kg) into and then out of a vehicle for disposal of the contents.
I would think that you would be better served to have 4 x 10 litre bottles that you can handle with little fear of spending the rest of your holiday on a Chiro's couch.
sandsmere said
03:01 PM Nov 12, 2013
I like the idea of the roll out tank , but as Brian said lifting would become a major problem .
Almost take superman to handle the 65 litre job .
copper1 said
03:13 PM Nov 12, 2013
I am looking at these on ebay at the moment.
Portable 40L Wheel Water Tank Camping Motorhome Caravan Storage Waste Transport
Please enter a quantity of $qty_dummy$ or lessPlease enter a quantity of 1Purchases are limited to $qty_dummy$ per buyerPlease enter quantity of 1 or morePlease enter a lower numberChoose quantity that is less than $qty_dummy1$ or equal to $qty_dummy$You can only choose quantity that is equal to $qty_dummy$
Price:
AU $89.95
+AU $29.95 postage
chiripacha said
09:09 PM Feb 26, 2018
Hi, I am considering to install an extra on my Mazda BT 50 (towing car) to pump my grey water from the extra grey water tank on my BT 50 and drive away to a proper place where to empty the tank, That way I don't have to drive the whole rig to the grey water dump. What do you think about that? Are there any other suggestions around? would very much to get some advice on that topic.
-- Edited by chiripacha on Monday 26th of February 2018 09:11:29 PM
jules47 said
10:16 PM Feb 26, 2018
Hi Kurt - I reckon you have a winner - thought I think you would have to have a dedicated pump - couldn't use it with anything else because of contamination. Not nice places inside the grey water tank - as you would imagine - also would small food particles get caught up in the pump?
You know, as I was writing that, if we all have to dump grey into a special tank - how are we going to get it in there - with a pump?
By the way - this is quite an old thread - better to start your own thread in General or Techs - or even in I Digress - hope you are enjoying the forum.
chiripacha said
07:41 AM Feb 28, 2018
Well, I agree that to use a pump for that purpose is not a good idea. So the only way to get rid of the grey water is to travel to a grey water dump point every time. Or are there any other ideas? This is not a technical question but a practical one.
We are considering purchasing a new "semi off road" caravan. I am seeking info on whether members consider a grey water tank essential. The van we are thinking of offers it as an option.
I would greatly appreciate some feedback please.
Cheers
David.
G'day David, my MH came with one fitted. Advantages: I find it to be handy to stop 'soggy' areas around the MH when free camping. I then empty when I get to an appropriate drain point. I don't have to worry about pipes and connections at each stop.
However if you're parked somewhere that has natural or man made drainage there's no problem, or possibly a large bucket/old fashioned Boy Scout 'wet pit' would do.
Disadvantages: The tank up a certain amount of room that could be used for other storage/slide outs or whatever. I'm carrying extra weight between stops until I can empty out. Extra fuel consumption etc.
Overall: I wouldn't spend the extra to have one fitted thus saving a bit of money, some room and fuel consumption.
For what it's worth.
If you have shower etc all in then get it, try as much as possible to get everything so you can get a "self containment certificate" for when they come in, Will assist you in the future for regulated freedom camping.
my opinion only
Bob
G'day Old Crofter. I'm unaware of a Self containment certificate. Is this an Australia wide reg or in certain states only?
Hi Keith, as I said in "my opinion", I have noticed on threads on GN and other places that self containment is starting to get some airplay with councils and regulatory bodies, as well as caravan and motor home clubs.
Up on the Murray, Renmarks and other camps there are signs up "self contained motorhomes only" this has caused some angst among the caravan fraternity and rightly so, but the stratagy was I think on self containment. With more and more caravans now being with showers toilets etc I believe that it will change and the containment principle will be applied.
"Fully self contained" has also been a catch cry by some of the lobby groups that are fighting against the caravan park lobby group who are hell bent on getting our free camping areas shut down, my view is that if you are self contained, you will have a greater chance of keeping the freedom of free and low cost camps.
I am not aware of any authority that is certifying, rather there are programs that have been regognised by some councils such as "Leave no Trace"etc.
Bob
In other places the 'controller' of the land will not allow it.
If you have a grey water tank, you have the choice.
My strong advise is to fit one. It is easier to do that now rather than later.
I fitted my own 70L tank. It cost less than $100.
Cheers,
Peter
Essential if you want 100% freedom these days,,, ours was fitted in 2007 and has well and truly paid its way.
Heaps of people at Theresa Ck dam near Clermont QLD, now have to carry grey water to dump point in buckets as you can't just "dump" and forget it.
Raveshoe Railway Camp has grey water dump point also.
Others are following,, so if you have the option go for it.
Thanks for that Bob (and others). I wasn't aware that this was becoming an issue. Turns out I'm lucky to have a grey water tank already fitted. I suppose it's only a matter of time before it happened. I know on Lake Eildon (Vic) you must have fully self contained tanks or have your bunks 'sealed' in your boat/houseboat.
We don't have a grey water tank and have managed ok without one, BUT if I was ordering a new van now I would definitely get one. I see it as something that will be asked for more and more in the future.
As for fully self contained certificates I have never heard of them and I would be surprised if they were anything more than an idea promoted by someone with a vested interest in the industry..
So in the meantime I intend to drain to ground ...
As others have said I feel the future will be to take everything out that you brought in and that includes grey and black water. It is happening now with Camps requiring Self Containment only eg Cooktown, Loxton Motorhome Park, Kalgoorlie, Blackall, Charlton etc. What we must remember is if we disobey the self contained signage then next time there maybe no campsite there. The breaking of said rules is just giving the parties wanting to close such sites the necessary ammunition.
If it was me I would be fitting one as it will be the way of the future - already is in NZ and over there you have to have your Rig officially certified and labelled accordingly and no way can you get to camp where certification is required if you are not fully compliant. It will come here whether we like it or not is my honest opinion.
You are only carrying the weight you started with in your general water tank and/or drinking water tank. You don't fill these tanks until you empty waste tank....so no extra weight. Get a water level guage to monitor tank level.
Get the waste tank Davemate.
Peter
I agree with Lorries, it will happen eventually. We camped on a Lake Elphinston Qld. CAW6 No. 82. earlier in the year, beautiful spot.
The Dump Point is at Glendon a good 30kl away, we observed travellers take their cassette and were gone for about 10-15mins. So where did they
dump????????????It takes longer than that fora a return trip to Glendon. So I do support Fully Self Contained. Stay as long as you can Contain, your black & grey
water. As a matter a fact our next door neighbours at the camp, had a go at one of the caravanners about it.
G'day Peter, you're right, you do start with the weight. However if you're reducing it as it's used; the fuel consumption decreases, the same as the fuel tank getting emptier as you go the economy increases.
Then your too close to your ATM. Leave at least 10% below for these occasions. Get used to it, we all will have to be self contained soon as out-lined above and in Far North Queensland the scalies are now pulling MH and vans over and weighing them. It may be a right royal pain to do some maths before departure but better than being put off the road for over-weight. We had no problem filling water tanks in the outback of Qld. even for a gold coin donation to the RFD. Forget your showers and have a "pommy bath" if weight critical.
Peter
Hi!
If you intend to do some independant camping I would strongly suggest you do eitherr tank fitted or carry at least a 20ltr lidded container to save and hold your grey water or you may find yourself a bit limited in where you can stay.
I think there will be more and more campsites displaying the 'self contained vehicles only' signs, that does include grey water.
Annie
I had a friend back in NZ convert his grey water tank to be the water sorce for his toilet...Worked a treat
Cheers
Evening All,
Think I lost my earlier reply.
Since 2005 we have used, when bush camping, a Roll Tank, 65 litre capacity, fits under caravan, insert drainage outlet. To dispose roll to 4wd, load, drive to nearby dump point or dispose by burying. QED. Don't need to move the van, compact & can leave at home when caravan park camping. Handy to easily move rinse water from laundry around the garden. Second unit is ideal when bush camping to transport clean water from rivers & streams to replenish onboard water tank. Wouldn't be with out them. Easy to store & carry.
Self Contained? YES & member of the real Leave No Trace Australia an international organisation.
http://rv247.com.au/fiamma-40ltr-waste-roll-tank/
Excuse me, but how do you arrive at that statement! You know nothing about my rig and what it weighs and what is in it - I am not in a caravan and only me in the rig - You don't know what my rig weight is and I do - do you know if I have upgraded the rig to the next level which it is able to handle? I would appreciate you know the facts before you make such statements - Lorraine
Try not to take too personally replies Lorries. This is encourage people to carry all waste with them. By the way, most MH are built close to their ATMs, nature of the beast.
Peter
Gee you make some wild statements Peter !!!!!
How would you know what the GVM of any MH is let alone MOST Motorhomes ????
I have a MH and my GVM is 9.800 but my on road weight is only 7000 and it is my experience that MOST motorhomes have much the same leeway..
On the other hand MOST caravans only have around 350 to 450kg tollerance for everything the owner wants to put in it after it leaves the showroom..
Collyn Rivers has a article on this very subject in the Nov 2013 (Current) issue of The Wanderer.
Mate, I looked into this when deciding if to stay with a c'van or move to a MH. Unless most MH magazine writers are not doing their job, even they state most MH are built to certain weight limit and most are on the upper limit, same as you say, some c'vans are. The more so now as every thing the designer can think of is jammed into it, big fridges, aircon's etc. The whole shooting match is held up by your tyres and loose 1 and things change. Duel rear wheel MH have the problem of getting stones between the tyres and rubbing both tyres out. Not just my opinion but read Caravan and Motor Home etc. Our new/2nd hand van will weigh around 2.5T with independent dual suspension rated 3T to allow for punches and off-road use.
By the way, Collyn Rivers is not the only expert out there, he started in electronics not MH/c'van design.
Peter
PS. My last on this.
-- Edited by Ontos45 on Friday 8th of November 2013 09:17:54 AM
Thanks everyone for your very informative responses. I think I will give very serious consideration to the Fiamma 40 lt roll tank. Portability and price are the two main advantages for me.
Cheers
David.
I haven't been following this thread, but I wonder at the ability of a lot of us to safely lift a 40 litre container (40+kg) into and then out of a vehicle for disposal of the contents.
I would think that you would be better served to have 4 x 10 litre bottles that you can handle with little fear of spending the rest of your holiday on a Chiro's couch.
I like the idea of the roll out tank , but as Brian said lifting would become a major problem .
Almost take superman to handle the 65 litre job .
I am looking at these on ebay at the moment.
Portable 40L Wheel Water Tank Camping Motorhome Caravan Storage Waste Transport
Seller information
Hi, I am considering to install an extra on my Mazda BT 50 (towing car) to pump my grey water from the extra grey water tank on my BT 50 and drive away to a proper place where to empty the tank, That way I don't have to drive the whole rig to the grey water dump. What do you think about that? Are there any other suggestions around? would very much to get some advice on that topic.
-- Edited by chiripacha on Monday 26th of February 2018 09:11:29 PM
You know, as I was writing that, if we all have to dump grey into a special tank - how are we going to get it in there - with a pump?
By the way - this is quite an old thread - better to start your own thread in General or Techs - or even in I Digress - hope you are enjoying the forum.